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bellyup
20th Sep 2009, 12:19 PM
G'day All,
I would like to get better at finials, I've looked on the web for instruction vidoes but came up a blank. Does anyone have any ideas or links?
Thanks guys,
Bruce.

Ed Reiss
20th Sep 2009, 12:22 PM
Hey Bellyup...check out Cindy Drozda's DVD's. Everything you ever wanted to know about finials and more :;

bellyup
20th Sep 2009, 12:40 PM
Thanks Ed,
Beautiful stuff- that lady sure knows her way around the lathe!! Could be just what I'm looking for.

jefferson
20th Sep 2009, 12:40 PM
Bruce,

another option for you would be to get an invite from the Griffith turners - Ken W. is doing a demo there next Friday evening. That would be a 4 hour or more drive for you, but it would be worth it. Assuming it's OK with them! :rolleyes:

I don't recall what exactly Ken is up to but he can turn a lace bobbin or a finial in no time flat. :D

I've got the Cindy Drozda DVDs and they are quite good. PM me and I post 'em up.

She does things a little differently to Ken W - she doesn't use tail-stock support for as long as Ken.

Ken also uses mini-chisels (Cindy doesn't) that have some very severe grinds on the wings of the spindle gouges. Ken had a special tool rest and live centre made up so he could get his hands closer to support the spindle.

(Ken, if you're on line, please post a pic of the Spirit Temple to show the crew what you do!)

One other thing - if you are intending to use tail-stock support, the trick I'm told is to make sure the head and tailstocks align. If they don't, you'll have to hold solely at the headstock end (in any number of ways).

(I go out to the shed and take a pic of my set-up which is very close to Ken W's and post back soon).

bellyup
20th Sep 2009, 12:51 PM
G'day Jeff,
Would love to see Ken in action but alas Griffith would be a 14+ hour round trip :(.
Thanks for the kind offer of the DVDs, that would be great! PM on the way.
Bruce.

jefferson
20th Sep 2009, 01:32 PM
Bruce,

here are the pics. The tool rest is for a leftie! Plenty of room for hands supporting the wood with this set-up and particularly the long tail stock support.

Note also the mini-chisel and the flute. Ken's are even more aggressive.

The boxes are all Ken W's. I hope you can see all the fine details.

116923

116924

116925

116926

116927

116928

Good luck with your finials. Not ready here to try them just yet. :B

bellyup
20th Sep 2009, 01:50 PM
Thanks Jeff,
What jaws are you using on your chuck?
Bruce.

jefferson
20th Sep 2009, 02:37 PM
Bruce, I think they are the 35mm Vicmarc pin jaws (the ones with two screws for each jaw). Chuck is a Vicmarc VM 100.

Check out Jim Carroll's site, think they'll be listed somewhere. The jaws weren't too dear from memory.

kps
20th Sep 2009, 04:52 PM
Jeff,
can you make suggestions on timber that is suited to finials [strength & elegance]. Some of the designs leave little support to the structure given their length. A WIP sequence would be great if anyone had the time.
cheers, kps

jefferson
20th Sep 2009, 06:50 PM
KPS,

you are talking to the wrong woodturner, so sorry. :oo:

I am called the Little Grasshopper for good reason! :D

I have been given so much help, encouragement and lessons from the Masters that not all of it has sunk in just yet.

But I do recall Ken W. telling me that the sapwood from any of our out-back timbers (gidgee etc) is great for practice. You should be looking for dense, slowing growing woods. They hold the detail so much better. And they bend.....

Talk with Tea Lady too, she's turned 50 more finials than I have. (I've done two bad ones).

As I said previously, I haven't tackled finials just yet. But I am ready to go.....

We must convince WWW to putting out a DVD (or three). IMHO, he turns better than most, if not all, but especially with finials and fine detail.

And, as Neil has already mentioned, he's a top fellow - up to his neck at least.

After that..... well, you get the gist.

This is a bad time for Ken W. - he's very busy Oct-Nov - so he may not reply.

Hopefully some of the others on the Board will chip in and give better advice.

KenW
20th Sep 2009, 07:28 PM
I don't need to reply, the little grasshoper is doing just fine.
Wood for finials, Mulga, Gidgee, Dead Finish, Kanooka, Ebony, etc. Any hard straight grained wood will work. I have worked with Cindy D, we make similar finals but in different ways.
As Jeff has said, I use tailstock support almost to the the finish. Cindy turns without tailstock support, she has to be much more careful with the tools than me.

tea lady
21st Sep 2009, 12:15 AM
Oh! Finials.:cool:

I turned mine without tail stock support cos my lathe is very out of wack. I used spotted gum for mine, as I had it there, and I kinda thought that it might take me a while to get to the stage where I was pushing the material more than my skills. I chose straight grained pieces. Was fine down to quite thin diameters. I guess for more detailed woofles you might want the desert timbers. :cool:

I rounded the blanks first between centers, then gripped them in pin jaws.

Here is some finials I turned earlier. :D (I recommend turning lots, as you get the hang of them much better. The last ones I turned in 9 minutes including finishing, and they got quite thin and nicely shaped. :2tsup: {If I don't say so myself.:D } ) (And just for some gratuitous showing off, here is the box they all went on. :cool:)

jefferson
21st Sep 2009, 08:48 AM
Tea Lady,

you are setting a cracking pace for we novices on the Forum...... :rolleyes:

So, a challenge for you and the others - turn a delicate finial with those little discs either side of the bead. :wink:

tea lady
21st Sep 2009, 11:13 AM
Tea Lady,

you are setting a cracking pace for we novices on the Forum...... :rolleyes:

So, a challenge for you and the others - turn a delicate finial with those little discs either side of the bead. :wink:
So, finial challenge this month is it.:D

ElizaLeahy
21st Sep 2009, 12:23 PM
I had little success getting really fine finials until Ken kindly sent me some samples of timber - and I can tell you the timber makes all the difference.

Listen to him, get the timbers on his list!

Also patience. Don't rush it, if it takes an hour to turn a tiny finial the first time then that is how long it takes. Ken can do it quickly because he has been doing it for a long time.

dai sensei
21st Sep 2009, 08:06 PM
A good free video of Cindy doing finials is from her finial box demo under AAW here (http://www.woodworkingchannel.com/dolphin/vidego_video_library.php) (scroll to the left, it is under AAW, then down a few, the finial is turned near the end)
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joe greiner
21st Sep 2009, 10:08 PM
A good free video of Cindy doing finials is from her finial box demo under AAW here (http://www.woodworkingchannel.com/dolphin/vidego_video_library.php) (scroll to the left, it is under AAW, then down a few, the finial is turned near the end)
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Or to the right, as needed, depending on where the site opens.

Cheers,
Joe

KenW
21st Sep 2009, 10:11 PM
So, finial challenge this month is it.:D
This is the piece that Jeff wanted me to post, I call it "Spirit Temple". I will make it my entry in the challenge.

dai sensei
21st Sep 2009, 10:52 PM
Holy crap Ken, amazing work :cool::2tsup:

Ed Reiss
21st Sep 2009, 11:10 PM
TL ... I think Ken just won the finial challange :o

awsome piece Ken :2tsup:

tea lady
21st Sep 2009, 11:15 PM
TL ... I think Ken just won the finial challange :o

:C :kickcan:

Well! We can't all be crazy.:D:cool:

Amazing piece Ken.:U

TTIT
21st Sep 2009, 11:51 PM
Holy crap Ken, amazing work :cool::2tsup:What he said :o. Too gobsmacked to come up with anything myself :B

NeilS
22nd Sep 2009, 12:23 AM
This is the piece that Jeff wanted me to post, I call it "Spirit Temple". I will make it my entry in the challenge.

Mind boggling, Ken. I withdraw from the challenge, before I start...:no:... well almost.

Just finished making something from the piece of Black Oak (Casuarina pauper) that Bruce brought down from Broken Hill and which he kindly gave to me at the Horsham YouTurn. Pic 1. Nice bit of wood, Bruce.

Then I thought it might look good with a lid.... and become a box. Pic 2. BTW, Pics 1&2 taken on a mirror. Thought I should mention that in case anyone got the impression that I had done anything as clever as a double winged bowl...:U.

Then the rot really set in and I started to think that maybe it needed a finial.

Both the lid and finial are Inland Rosewood (Acacia rhodoxylon), which I recently brought back with me from Qld. Seemed to work well on the finial.

Completed box with finial, Pic 3.

Oh well, if it qualifies, this is my entry. Otherwise, I think I have retired from finials.

If a name is needed, what about 'Pagoda Space Station'.

Thanks again, Bruce. You sure have some nice dense woods up your way, and, as indicated by Ken, many of them are suitable for finials and lots of other lovely stuff.

.

jefferson
22nd Sep 2009, 05:56 AM
Alright, so the next challenge is on..... This time, can we make it for more than a month?

Will create a new folder???? :rolleyes:

Neil, a nice entry too. :2tsup:

I wouldn't be too worried about the Weird and Wonderful. Next time he wants to turn a decent finial piece, he's got to do better than the Temple. :D:D:D

ElizaLeahy
22nd Sep 2009, 12:53 PM
I'd be in for a finial challenge - gives and excuse to continue improving boxes as well!

Texian
22nd Sep 2009, 02:44 PM
Gadzook T.L., that's an amazing spikey thingy (box?). Lack the words to comment on Ken's temple. Was contemplating what to turn tomorrow morning, and y'all got me fired up to do finial practice.