old Woodfast lathe bearing upgrade help needed

[rev]

G'day friends,
I'm trying to remove the greasable bearings from an old (1980) Woodfast lathe, model 6WL or 940M (not sure which). I have removed the grub screws from the pulley in the headstock and the left hand thread collar from the left hand end. I am trying to knock the shaft toward the bed but it just will not budge! I have tried a massive rubber mallet with hefty blows (to the point of being scared of cracking the cast housing), a bessy clamp with as much pressure as I can apply but I cannot coax it to move even a micron! :(:?

[Tankstand]

Is there a retaining ring on the bed side of the headstock? On either side for that matter? (I mean between the pulley and the casting wall on the bed side)

Have you completely removed the grub screws?

Maybe some pics will help?

[rev]

G'day tankstand,
not sure what you mean by retaining ring...there is a plate with three screws that go through the casting to another plate between which the bed end bearing is located. I'll go out now and take some pics.

[rev]

The screwdriver shaft points to the inner plate nad the loosened screws go through the casting to threaded holes in the inner plate. i hope this makes sense. And yes, the grub screws are completely removed. Cheers.

[Tankstand]

Looks good so far.

Same model as mine.

My bearings are 2" OD X 1" ID X .5" W

After unscrewing those three long screws you should be ready to drift away!

Make sure the top of the pulley doesn't contact the casting and jam proceedings.

I can only suggest looking for hidden grub screws etc.

Mine was a fair slog! I used a lump of wood and a #3 copper hammer for weight.

Just protect the LH thread, maybe leave the nut on loosely?

Goodluck.

[rev]

Yea I'm very wary of damaging the thread. So just keep at it?? Actually, the plate that retains the bearing should not affect the shaft coming through, right?

[rev]

Im thinking of installing some Fenner Drive link belt. What do you think? If tere is some reason why I shouldn't do that I will get a new belt before re assembling (same as what is on there now, though the original isn't too bad).

[Tankstand]

Actually, the plate that retains the bearing should not affect the shaft coming through, right?

Correct, I was hoping that letting the bearings come with the shaft might help you get things moving.

[Tankstand]

Im thinking of installing some Fenner Drive link belt. What do you think? If tere is some reason why I shouldn't do that I will get a new belt before re assembling (same as what is on there now, though the original isn't too bad).

See if you have clearance between the sheaves and the casting, I changed the belt at the same time as my bearings (Standard vee belt) and mine gets caught (Read, need to bleedin force it over the sheave with all of my might!) on the rough flashing? inside of the headstock. I will need to strip it again one day and fettle the thing to make my life easier!

[John T]

HI REV what would hapen if you used index pin to lock the shaft to loosen large nut john t:)

[John T]

or is the nut all part of the shaft JOHN T

[Tankstand]

There are only two bolts holding the headstock to the bed, last resort is to take it to a press!:oo::2tsup:

I had mine off and was considering lifting it up 50mm and then making a cast iron 50mm shoe for the tail stock.

[Tankstand]

HI REV what would hapen if you used index pin to lock the shaft to loosen large nut john t:)

! The pin is quite dainty, the pulley aluminium and the hex is a part of the spindle.

[rev]

I had thought of that...but the pin is fairly flimsy and I don't want to risk damaging it. this might sound stupid....but that big nut looks like it is machined as part of the shaft! :-

[rev]

Glad you said that Tankstand!

[NeilS]

When I replaced my belt it all came apart with ease. I'd be checking for another grub screw.

If still no go, I'd give Steve a ring at Woodfast before thumping anymore. Check the model numbers stamped in the bed on the tail stock end so he knows exactly which model you have. He has serviced all their models and will know exactly what to do.

.....

[issatree]

Hi Tankstand, & Others,
Now I have A "Tough Lathe", & if the Woodfast is anything like the Tough, then you bring up the Tail Stock, really tighten it to the bed, put a piece of wood between the T/S ( With no tail centre of course ) & wind it out Backwards.
I dare say you have given it a good spray with some kind of moving substance.
I have some Loctite Freeze & Release. I find this works very well.
So when all else fails, ring Graham at Woodfast in SA, as they are sure to have the answer.
Regards,
issatree.
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[NeilS]

Now I have A "Tough Lathe", & if the Woodfast is anything like the Tough, then you bring up the Tail Stock, really tighten it to the bed, put a piece of wood between the T/S ( With no tail centre of course ) & wind it out Backwards.
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Don't think the Woodfasts do it the same way as the Toughs, Issatree. If I remember correctly, the shaft comes out towards the tailstock.


And, yes Rev, the nut on the tailstock side of the headstock is machined into the shaft.

One trick that Steve from Woodfast passed onto me was to run a dowel through the shaft before you remove it. That way you keep the pulley in position making it easier to reinserting the shaft after you have replaced the bearings/belt.

A tip from Robo is to add an additional belt while you have the shaft out. Will get you going again much quicker when the belt in use breaks... :) but depends on having enough room to hold the spare out of the way inside the headstock as there isn't a lot of spare room in some Woodfast models.

.....

[texx]

an old trick used with fiat dozers and some other machinery , is when a fan belt needs to be changed ( pig of a job on those fiats ) you put 2 belts in there one in position and another spare wired up so it cant catch on anything then if you are in the bush and do a belt you have another in there that just has to be dropped onto the pulleys and your off and running:2tsup::2tsup:
and if it were mine i would be making up a puller for removing that shaft .

[Zsteve]

Good luck with it. I am not looking forward to doing mine if and when needed.

Mine is 1965 6WL. year of manufacture is the last two digits of the number stamped on the bed - mine is stamped up near the headstock

[rev]

I am going to try to pull it through using a long bolt or threaded rod through the hollow shaft captured on the left end against the shaft, and tightened against a spacer that protrudes past the end of the spindle on the bed end. i hope this makes sense. I will let you know how it goes, but won't be able to get to it before Saturday.

[issatree]

Hi All,
You Chaps really get a bloke thinking.
I've had my Tough since 1990, It has almost always sat on 3000 RPM.
I have never had a problem of any sort, & believe me It sure has done many, many Hours of work.
The one thing I do is to put some Molykote in the bearings when I think of it.
At the time I put Variable on it, I had a Hr. Meter that read some 579 Hrs. & it has done a heap more than that, so when the Electrician did the wiring, I forget to have it put back on. Silly me.

I really don't understand why there are so many Problems with all these Lathes.
Regards,
issatree.
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[hughie]

I really don't understand why there are so many Problems with all these Lathes.Like most mechanical things, usage, maintenance etc all come into it and of the age of the bearing. Many of us buy second hand lathes and so the bearing condition and history is unknown, sorta like buying a pig and a poke. :U

Your using Molykote that has molybdenum disulphide in it, which one the slipperiest products known to man, and an excellent choice of lubrication. It will prolong your bearings on your lathe big time. What and how you grease your bearing has a great deal to do with how long they last. With some grease you can over grease and cause heat build and this can lead to premature bearing failure. Molybdenum disulphide greases have a high tolerance to heat build and if memory serves me well a good heat transfer as well.

All in all you probably could not have chosen a better type of grease with out going into some expensive high load, high temp, specialty grease.

Castrol Moly Grease (http://www.opieoils.co.uk/p-6315-castrol-moly-grease.aspx)

heres a bit of info on grease in general
http://www.castrol.com/liveassets/bp_internet/castrol/castrol_australia/STAGING/local_assets/downloads/g/Greases_B112520.pdf

[NeilS]

I really don't understand why there are so many Problems with all these Lathes.

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Depends a lot on what you turn on them.

Bearing replacement is what we are mainly talking about here. Pens and the like are going to be put little or no strain on an industrial quality bearing, whereas heavy 20"+ out of balance bowl blanks are going to give any bearing a hammering.

Got over 10,000 hours out of the bearings (greased type) on my old Woodfast and I turned quite a few pieces up to about 27" on that lathe. Can't complain about that!

Most secondhand Woodfasts are ex-schools or TAFE, plus a few ex-industrials. Their pre-use can vary widely. Some can be 'as new' old lathes and will be good for many years while others can be ready for a complete reconditioning overhaul. Hard to judge them without knowing their complete history.

But, no doubt Lewis the Tough is wonderful....:U

......

[hughie]

Most secondhand Woodfasts are ex-schools or TAFE, plus a few ex-industrials. Their pre-use can vary widely. Some can be 'as new' old lathes and will be good for many years while others can be ready for a complete reconditioning overhaul. Hard to judge them without knowing their complete history.


agreed I have an ex high school Woodfast and did wonder how often they used it. The bearings are as new, a few dings on the paint work other wise in excellent condition

[Edwards]

Glad you said that Tankstand!

Rev.
First suggestion is to contact the manufacturer who should set you straight on what to do.
From my experience when all screws are removed from the pulley and I mean all because sometimes there is one below the other and we are talking the correct model as I believe there have been many, protect the outer thread and then hit hard with a solid metal hammer. Not rubber or similar. Often there is a burr left on the spindle where the grub screw locked onto it. It takes some moving.

Cheers
Edwards

[rev]

Well, its finally done!

Edwards was spot on. It turned out to be 2 burrs on either side of the shaft where the grub screws had tightened down. I think what helped most was to warm up the pulley gently with a heat gun...things really starthed moving well then. The hammer rather than the mallet was also a good tip.

Thanks all for taking the time to respond with suggestions. Cheers

[Tankstand]

Well done Rev.:2tsup:

It's a good feeling when you get it apart and haven't broken anything!:oo:

Now you just need to source new bearings, and hopefully fit them by drawing them in.....Hitting with a hammer and punch (I kid you not) reduces the life span of a bearing by 50%.

[rev]

Tankstand, it's interesting that our lathes have different size bearings though they appear to be the same model. Mine are 1.000 x 2.250 x 0.625 inch and there are 3 of them, 2 at the bed end. I have decided to replace the original ones because they are in excellent condition...no appreciable movement whatsoever, and it saves some money; besides, they are not a common size it seems. I think I'll use Slick 50 "ONE GREASE" which is white in colour, and leaves a PTFE risidual coating on the metal.

[Tankstand]

Tankstand, it's interesting that our lathes have different size bearings though they appear to be the same model. Mine are 1.000 x 2.250 x 0.625 inch.

My fault for assuming this :-

My lathe is older and pre-dates Woodfast. Mine is a Hyco, whom Woodfast bought out and continued using their casting moulds.

Honest injun, they look identicle!:rolleyes:

No doubt they went for larger bearings.

You have inspired me to dismantle mine again and resolve my belt issues.

[rev]

There is a thread about link-belts elsewhere on the forums at the moment. I don't know how they would go on a lathe if a vfd is fitted which allows reverse drive. Anyway, it might be worth your while checking out link-blt drive because you wouldn't need to remove the spindle to install the belt.