PDA

View Full Version : Personal Turning Safety Kit



Robson Valley
3rd December 2011, 03:57 PM
I sharpened a 12-tool set of full-sized Sorbey lathe tools, badly mistreated by owner #1. More grinder facets on the gouges than a brilliant-cut diamond. I am fairly good at sharpening and the original bevels have been restored and ground to 4000 grit. By hand. It was an absolute grunt of a job.
Owner #2 has offered me the use of his wood lathe in return.

I have no particular projects in mind yet, my mallets and gouges distract me for hours at a time.

When the time comes to do some lathe/turning, what should I be wearing?
- face shield
- hearing protection
- apron
- shirt/coat sleeves taped shut at the wrists?
- watch & ring = take them off?
- hard shoes/boots

do I need gloves?
I'd appreciate any and all sediments about this matter
Thanks

RETIRED
3rd December 2011, 05:05 PM
I sharpened a 12-tool set of full-sized Sorbey lathe tools, badly mistreated by owner #1. More grinder facets on the gouges than a brilliant-cut diamond. I am fairly good at sharpening and the original bevels have been restored and ground to 4000 grit. By hand. It was an absolute grunt of a job.
Owner #2 has offered me the use of his wood lathe in return.

I have no particular projects in mind yet, my mallets and gouges distract me for hours at a time.

When the time comes to do some lathe/turning, what should I be wearing?
- face shield. Definitely.
- hearing protection. No. You need to "hear" what the wood is "telling" you. A split or crack gives a ticking sound. The tools hiss when cutting properly.
- apron. Your choice but I find aprons a nuisance as the bib gets shavings down them. If you choose to wear one make sure that ALL ties are not loose.
- shirt/coat sleeves taped shut at the wrists? A rubber band will do but you need one that buttons to the neck.
- watch & ring = take them off? Definitely. Apart from the obvious catch risk, on some timbers you get a rash from sawdust trapped under them.
- hard shoes/boots Yep.

do I need gloves? We wear gloves for most of our work but on smaller stuff you don't really need them. If you wear them make sure they are a good fit. Riggers gloves are best. The stretchy nylon fancy ones wear out pretty quick around our place.:wink:
I'd appreciate any and all sediments about this matter
ThanksLong pants or gaiters if you wear shorts as shavings down the socks get most uncomfortable.

Have fun.

Robson Valley
4th December 2011, 04:06 AM
Thanks :
It is winter. 30+cm snow on the ground and more coming down right this moment (well, since last 10PM). Not less than -3C. The lathe owner isn't too generous with the wood heat in his detached shop. Think I will pass on the shorts idea. Might be all of 12C - 15C in there on a good day. The beer is cold enough, just sitting on the cement floor!
"You chilly? Leave your coat on."
Sure hope some project ideas come to me soon. Do need some bottle stoppers for a spice rack.

Drillit
4th December 2011, 09:46 AM
Hi Robson Valley,
We generally dont get it that cold hereabouts. On gear and not in anyway to usurp the master , I have found that cyclists gloves (with the fingertips cut off) to be excellent. Good firm fit and still have a bit of a feel. PS. At least you dont need a frig. to keep the beer cold - good chilblain weather particularly in the shorts...brrr.. John M.

rsser
4th December 2011, 03:05 PM
Jefferson gets it pretty cold in the Kiewa valley in winter!

Re gloves, I like a rigger's glove on the hand closest to the stream of hot chips; but with the fingers cut off at the 2nd knuckle (counting from the tip). (Thanks Hughie).

hughie
4th December 2011, 03:25 PM
Re gloves, I like a rigger's glove on the hand closest to the stream of hot chips; but with the fingers cut off at the 2nd knuckle (counting from the tip).


:U it was a pleasure.

Robson Valley nice part of the world, a tad off the beaten track tho' :U Spent some time around Watson Lake in the 70's.

Safety is a good thing some go over board. Do what your comfortable with that gives you the level you require.Probably complacency is our worst enemy. As says tune your ears to the various sounds
.
Due to our warmer weather I do not use boots toe cap or other wise. Generally in a pair of flip flops, lately crocks. As for gloves I have a pair of half finger gloves and tend to wear both. As I often turn with both hands, a pulling cut across the face using the r/h or the same along the outside towards myself using l/h.So both gloves are useful for me.

rsser
4th December 2011, 03:41 PM
And RV when it comes to sanding, and there'll be a deal of it as a beginner, get some protection for your airways. Wood dust is carcinogenic.

Mr Brush
4th December 2011, 05:37 PM
Better safe than sorry I say....:D

rsser
4th December 2011, 05:46 PM
Good to see Triton innovating again.

Robson Valley
4th December 2011, 06:04 PM
Thank you all. I really like all my body parts, no plans to lose any of them, whether through ignorance or stupidity. Lathe work I don't know about so figured I should ask.

Lathe owner does mega sanding. His dust machine has a 6"/15cm hole and just screams.

I lived in Melbourne for 4 years (PhD/LaTrobe/Botany/Wood Anatomy), some of the very best years of my life.

We must have got 15cm snow today, all dang day long. -2C and no wind so it really was nice. I run a 3/4T GMC Suburban, factory loaded with all possible options, 4X4, and the 454cube/7.6l V8 gas engine. Cooper wet ice winter tires. Gas hog but it gets me home.
Try Google Earth and find McBride, BC. Hell, I can even see my big garden shed!!!

rsser
4th December 2011, 06:36 PM
Happy to help a Canuck.

LaTrobe is just down the road as it happens, and I did some part-time teaching there this year in public health.

Yep, snow is nice when you can travel to it to play in. Around the neighborhood I can see it would be a bit wearing. My worst was camping out on a ski tour; it got down to -14C and the leather boots froze. Older hands said I should've tucked them into the sleeping bag overnight ... b*gger that!

Mr Brush
4th December 2011, 06:50 PM
Out of idle curiosity I looked up McBride BC on Google Earth.......looks a tad isolated to me :rolleyes:

I zoomed out....zoomed out......and finally found the nearest decent-sized place. How far is Prince George from you - 300km by (icy) road?

Heilander
4th December 2011, 07:27 PM
Better safe than sorry I say....:D

Danger!! Will Robinson?

powderpost
4th December 2011, 08:25 PM
Wood dust is carcinogenic.

Very broad statement. If this were true, I should have died many years ago. Maybe some species are carcinogenic or maybe the chemicals introduced to protect the timber???. I would be very interested in seeing the evidence of this. Even so, breathing protection is certainly a good idea.
Jim

BobL
4th December 2011, 08:35 PM
You aksed for sediments so here's mine.

I think you guys have it all wrong

- face shield : if things start to get awkward I find squinting and grimacing suffices
- hearing protection : I find this interferes with the stereo
- apron : leave that for the BBQ or kitchen
- shirt/coat sleeves taped shut at the wrists? : Not an issue for singlet wearers
- watch & ring = take them off? ; I have neither so no issue again
- hard shoes/boots : I likes me thongs or as you might know them, flipflops
- gloves? : I find those thin latex ones keep my nail polish from chipping.

RETIRED
4th December 2011, 09:07 PM
Better safe than sorry I say....:DGees, you have been peeking at our new protective gear for next year but Tea Lady said it made her bum look to big.:D

We just about wear that now.

I used to wear fingerless gloves and probably for the average turner they would be OK. In our case we have flesh eating shards coming off the timber that wears out gloves in about 3 weeks.

dr4g0nfly
5th December 2011, 01:11 AM
I also peaked at McBride in Google earth.

Having done some time between Medicine Hat, Calgary & Banff all I can say is that pic was taken on a 'Good day!'

Robson Valley
5th December 2011, 03:28 AM
Thanks for the safety information. Between me and the lathe owner, I think I have everything I need.

I did the Bio Prof thing in Prince George for 31 years. pop maybe 85,000
McBride is half way from PG to Jasper, about 2.5 hrs each way on a good road.
pop 700. Google Earth can't show the size of the mosquitoes in mid summer.
Bought my home in 2000 and have not regretted it for 1 second.
This is the top destination in North America for snowmobile riding.
Our little airport is so busy, that's where children learn to ride new bicycles in the spring.
Winter now, at least one Heliski company flies their clients from there.

You can't get off the beaten track. Highway #16 is the only track. Empty highway, just a grand hallway in the forest. Nobody lives there. 220km from PG to McBride. I can name the 7 people who live within 5km of the highway. No cell phone coverage in between.
While the logging roads may seem to go forever, all dead ends. GPS is useless, the valleys are narrow and steep-sided.

Paul39
5th December 2011, 10:20 AM
As to footwear, I have had my 2 pound scraper and 1 1/2 inch skew jiggle off the bench under the lathe and fall at my feet. I now have a rack and magnet, but still wear shoes.

I put on glasses to find the floor in the morning, so I have prescription safety glasses. One experience of having a chunk of wood removed from an eye has me use a face shield or goggles over the glasses if the timber is splintery or throwing chunks.

If you have "turners cough" and / or stuffed up head the next day, better dust extraction or face mask is in order.

Most lathes are not so noisy as to need to use hearing protection.

NeilS
5th December 2011, 12:23 PM
I used to wear fingerless gloves and probably for the average turner they would be OK. In our case we have flesh eating shards coming off the timber that wears out gloves in about 3 weeks.

I tried the fingerless style, but prefer a full glove. My workshop up here in the Adelaide Hills hovers around 8-11 deg C during the winter and that tool steel sure is cold first thing of a morning.

To get maximum feel through the leather I like my new rigger gloves to be as tight as I can get them. They then wear into a comfortable fit, but still take an effort to get on and off. That creates a problem for feeling for sharpness with the skin on my thumb, which I do very frequently. To get around this I put a slit in the back of my right hand glove thumb so I can slip my thumb in and out without removing the gloves. Found the right slit size and position for me by trial and error on worn out gloves before attacking a new pair of gloves.


190128

RETIRED
5th December 2011, 02:50 PM
I tried the fingerless style, but prefer a full glove. My workshop up here in the Adelaide Hills hovers around 8-11 deg C during the winter and that tool steel sure is cold first thing of a morning.

To get maximum feel through the leather I like my new rigger gloves to be as tight as I can get them. They then wear into a comfortable fit, but still take an effort to get on and off. That creates a problem for feeling for sharpness with the skin on my thumb, which I do very frequently. To get around this I put a slit in the back of my right hand glove thumb so I can slip my thumb in and out without removing the gloves. Found the right slit size and position for me by trial and error on worn out gloves before attacking a new pair of gloves.


190128



You been raiding our bin Neil?:D

rsser
5th December 2011, 03:15 PM
Very broad statement. If this were true, I should have died many years ago. Maybe some species are carcinogenic or maybe the chemicals introduced to protect the timber???. I would be very interested in seeing the evidence of this. Even so, breathing protection is certainly a good idea.
Jim

Jim,

The American Industrial Hygiene Association made this statement and it was published in an issue of Fine Woodworking in 1996. In fact, they described wood dust as on par with asbestos fibres.

'Carginogenic' doesn't mean everyone will get cancer; it means a cancer-inducing agent.

When you trawl through the research literature, nose and pharynx cancer among timber millers/workers shows up at a clearly higher rate than among the general population, and yes, some timbers are worse than others.

To add, MDF is a toxic material for this reason as well as for the binding agent (which may include urea-formaldehyde) - I read somewhere on the web (so it must be true :rolleyes:) that California has banned its use.

And breathing in wood dust has other negative health effects as well.

The biggest risk is in breathing in small particles from sanding, invisible to the eye and that float around the workshop for hours after generation, that lodge in the lungs or airways.

NeilS
5th December 2011, 08:04 PM
You been raiding our bin Neil?

Definitely a better source of used gloves than my bin, especially since I found a better lasting glove at my local nursery which are holding out for anything up to three months, and they don't stain my hands orange....:D

hughie
6th December 2011, 09:00 AM
[


The American Industrial Hygiene Association made this statement and it was published in an issue of Fine Woodworking in 1996. In fact, they described wood dust as on par with asbestos fibres.



I find it interesting as you wander around the net, many American turners are not aware of the danger, for many its only a general vague awareness.

rsser
8th December 2011, 10:45 AM
Yes, a google on 'bad wood' or 'wood toxicity' will yield some interesting reading. Inhalation is not the only risk.

...

Recently a turner was killed at the lathe in the US so within the AAW at least there's a renewed focus on safety.

Paul39
9th December 2011, 03:47 AM
Recently a turner was killed at the lathe in the US so within the AAW at least there's a renewed focus on safety.

More recently than the student that was found dead at the lathe with her hair wound up on the spindle?

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/14/nyregion/yale-student-dies-in-machine-shop-accident.html

rsser
9th December 2011, 07:26 AM
What a tragedy.

...

BTW if you're out to buy a visor, try to get one with a chin piece.

Debris can come up between the visor and the face. DAMHIKT.

Robson Valley
9th December 2011, 08:10 AM
Dust, any dust, is nasty. I got a page from a local tropical woods supplier which indicated some species' dust is better than other dust = toxic biochemicals in it. Doesn't surprise me one bit.

Still, I needed to know what gear I should be wearing for lathe work. Scary thought about tools rattling off the bench! Good tip right there. The Sorbey tools that I'll be using are in a big rack, like a chemistry test tube rack. The spot lights are good, the dust extraction is very good (lathe owner makes log furniture from diamond willow with production runs of 100 hiking sticks and 100 canes. Weeks of power sanding.)

NeilS: testing for sharpness with your thumb. What are you carving? Thumbs?
I NEVER do that. If and when I want to test a wood-carving tool, I have a "try-piece" on the bench, the kind of wood that I'll be carving. That's the real test. When I cleaned up the set of Sorbeys, I still poked them into a stick. I can tell, now, what's sharp and what's carving sharp.

rsser
9th December 2011, 08:54 AM
This is a woodturning forum, no?

Never had a prob. running the thumb off a bevel with tools at 30 or 45 degrees etc off the grinder. A honed skew gets more care and the thumbnail test is used.

NeilS
9th December 2011, 10:36 AM
NeilS: testing for sharpness with your thumb. What are you carving? Thumbs?

Thumbs are still all there....:D

A thumb is always 'to hand' ( :wink: ) and for me a predictable gauge of whether the edge will cut. When using aluminium oxide or silicon carbide wheels to sharpen your turning tools an indication of the sharpest edge you will get off that wheel are the sparks that start to come over the edge, but this doesn't apply to wet grinders or diamond/CBN wheels or hand honing.

But, like Ern, I do use the thumb nail test (http://www.watanabeblade.com/english/sharpen/sharpen1.htm) on my Japanese knives (which have subtle degrees of extreme sharpness) to judge whether they need to be resharpened. Although the best guide on when to resharpen any blade is when it has stopped cutting without extra effort.

rsser
9th December 2011, 11:56 AM
During tool use on a bowl, with a gouge and many timber species, if 'pig tail' shavings are not being produced it's time to resharpen. With a scraper, and again with a number of species, if dust rather than fluffy shavings is being produced, again ...

Just rules of thumb ;-}

RETIRED
9th December 2011, 01:18 PM
Yours or Neils?:D

Robson Valley
14th December 2011, 05:36 AM
Thanks for the observations and the judgements re sharpness which follow from seeing the shavings coming off the project.

I have a nice little tool originally used to measure the tip/bevel angles on drill bits. Works equally well for carving and lathe tools. From multiple measurements, I'd regrind the bevels such that most of gross scratch marks were gone, matte finish or better. Did the entire lot by hand.

I have been carving western red cedar, almost exclusively, for years. I'd poke a slab of that with the lathe tool and compare with what I know of carving tool performance. I think that the lathe tools are good to go.

However, I think that I'll start with wood a bit harder than my WRC. Birch (Betula) is in good supply.