PDA

View Full Version : reconditioning a windmill (long long story here)



.RC.
20th August 2012, 02:16 PM
Latest job to come up has been the reconditiong of a Comet 12ft windmill.... Originally installed sometime in the mid-late 1960's, been in continuous use ever since.. Only repair since that time besides general oiling has been a repair to the crank shaft where the bottom hole had worn egg shaped..

We generally do all our own windmill repairs ourselves, we have not been very impressed with the quality of work provided in the times we have used contractors to do major repairs.... The last incident where we had a major rebuild done on a 12ft Z pattern Southern Cross, resulted in a $1700 repair bill 3 years after the job was done due to substandard workmanship, a shaft was knurled to increase it's diameter to make it better fit a hole, subsequently it worked loose a key fell out and the wheel was free wheeling on the shaft....... $1500 of the $1700 bill was just in crane hire by external contractors... In any case this is not an isolated incident of substandard repairs we and our neighbours have had with the expert contractors...

Anyways back to this 12ft Comet... Due to age I suspected some preventative maintenance should be done, as in very dry times it is the only water source in the paddock.. At the moment water is in abundance..

A year and a bit back I came across a palfinger crane on ebay... In melbourne, at a not too expensive price considering it was only 11 years old and upon calling the seller was told he had been using it on his truck but had since removed it has someone backed into his truck writing it off... It also came with a wireless remote control.. I purchased it and when I got it home discovered the old "let the buyer beware" saying ringing true.... If the seller of the crane is reading this, you are a lowlife scum sucking ########... Yes it was indeed only 11 years old, but had come off a boat of all places, had suffered from rust pretty badly in the base..... Did not have original outriggers, but came with a couple of semi trailer legs and the radio remote had been flogged off a different crane and had never been used on this one...

I propped it up against a post and after contacting Palfinger, nearly had my head torn off after I asked how would I go about welding a new base on it... Lets just say nicely the OHS rules and my idea of repairs did not see eye to eye...

The crane sat for a year.. reminding me of the ######## seller... With the saying fortune favours the bold I said fuk it and I will not achieve anything if I do not try..... OHS rules do not apply to owners who are free to do whatever dangerous practices they want provided they and they themselves along with only their property are the only ones put at risk.. I ordered steel low hydrogen welding rods and fabricated a new base.. For the record it is a 9.5metre tonne model..

Fate soon saw me get given an old old Toyota D6000 truck when I was chatting about my intentions for the crane... I was told it ran... I laughed... He assured me put batteries in it and it will go but it has a blown head gasket... I was just going to use it as a pull along trailer and use a tractor as a hydraulic power source for the crane...

I had it sitting at home for a couple of months and curiosity got the better of me, so I jump started it..... Bloody thing ran after sitting for several years... Head gasket was indeed blown.... Lucky the person who gave it to me had a new head gasket for it.... I removed the rear head (it has two heads) and devconned up the pit marks in the block (reason why it blew in the first place) and seem to have cured the problem..

The crane was soon fitted to the truck and tested out using a tractor as the power source for the hydraulics... A load of 500kg was placed at full extension..... Seemed to hold it OK....In for a penny, in for a pound, lets double the load to 1100kg the cranes rated maximum load at full extension... Of course it would never be able to lift that by itself as the max hydraulic pressuse the crane can handle is 4250psi while the tractor does around 2300.... I lifted the load onto the crane and gradually let it take the load, half expecting something to go snap.... IT HELD!!!! woo hoo, I was wrapped... Time to get serious about this now....

The plans soon changed from tractor hydraulics to self contained unit.. Ebay provided a new old stock Italian hydraulic pump.... Only small @ 16l/min flow but does 3500psi..... Ebay also provided a 9hp chinese engine... I fabricated up some proper outriggers using the provided trailer legs... They are rated at 30 tonnes wit a 14 tonne side load, so should be adequate :)..

Using the workshop I fabricated a connector to connect the pump and motor together directly.. I cursed European standards and the strange things they do... The pump had a 1:8 taper on the drive shaft along with a tapered key.. The auto drive top slide on the lathe came quite in handy for doing the taper, and my slotter, the head rotates so I could do the tapered key... Somehow the finished part fitted...

The pump also has some rare German flange ports on it so parts had to made for it as well as an adapter to a more common connector...

The hydraulic tank came from a previously failed project and hoses were purchased to connect it all together (christ hydraulic hoses are expensive)

All fitted together, all has worked quite well...

An extension was fabricated to fit int he crane so it can lift to a height allowing windmill heads to be removed... The extension was tested.... Firstly lifting 200kg up to full height of 44ft..... That was doubled to 400kg.... Finally 550kg (a 44 of concrete) was lifted to full height and moved around to test for stability... Would not want to lift anything heavier but it seemed OK....

Which leads us back to the Comet windmill reconditioning.....

After contacting Comet Windmills Australia and they telling me the complete head weighs in at 360kg I waited for a still day and headed off to start the job.... For those not in the know, windmills are very dirty things after they have 40 years of semi solidified oil and grease over them... After tying the tail into the on position (so it does not swing around and unbalance everything) and tying down the ball race so the ball bearings the turn table run on do not go everywhere I disconnected the connecting rod and removing the two bolts that hold the head on, it was time to do the lift.... I had an endless chain connected to it with the intention of lifting it free of the tower first then slewing the crane and lowering it to the ground...

I tool the weight with the endless chain... However I did not have the balls to lift it free of the tower with me being up there with it.. To be honest we had not done this before and I had no idea how balanced it would be when it came free of the tower.. So I went down to the crane controls and hoisted it up with it... When it came free of the tower, it just hung there nearly perfectly balanced... Slewed around the lowered it to the ground ready for dismantling...

Got it dismantled and back home..... 3hrs after we left... Doing it the old way of using a gin pole and dismantling it in pieces while still on the tower would take a lot lot lot longer and be much harder..

Have got the parts home.... Got a large plastic vat and filled it with water and 30l of the Repco degreasing solution which is a concentrated caustic solution and placed them in that for a day, then pressure cleaned them, then put them back in for another day.. It cleaned everything up very well, stripping most of the paint as well..

Have procured paint, new bolts for the rusted ones, discovered the old tank bolts that bolts the sails on were a very obscure 9/32 x 20 tpi size... They are being replaced by 8mm gal hex head...

The ball bearings that the head swivels on are worn down by nearly 1mm (originally 5/8 size)

So at the moment have every thing dismantled mostly clean and some painting done... Shoudl hopefully get it finished later this week time permitting...

.RC.
20th August 2012, 02:29 PM
This is what I mean by old way of doing it with a gin pole which in this case is a length of 2" water pipe.... Here is one we did a few years ago... Only a 10ft Comet here.... This head was originally on the other tower you can see.... The new tower, is new...

Andy Mac
20th August 2012, 02:32 PM
Hi .RC, a great yarn thanks! That's the good thing about being on a farm, doing all that stuff yourself.

Cheers,

welder
20th August 2012, 04:09 PM
Nice work on the Crane looks like a useful rig and a great read :2tsup:

morrisman
20th August 2012, 04:47 PM
great story

But what does DEVCONNED mean ? The cyl head fix on that truck

Mike

Andy Mac
20th August 2012, 05:01 PM
great story

But what does DEVCONNED mean ? The cyl head fix on that truck

Mike

A proprietry brand of aluminium epoxy. Handy stuff!

shedhappens
20th August 2012, 05:30 PM
Good stuff RC, that crane will be a handy sky hook for many task's.

A few years ago I had a Cranville Wombat backhoe, it had a 2 cylinder Wisconsin engine and a car diff, small but very handy.
I made a flier up for it and used it to put power poles up for a shed I was building, after that it did more craning than digging,

Don't forget the reassembly pic's :2tsup:

welder
20th August 2012, 05:53 PM
Nice I have always wanted to buy or build a cranvel backhoe.

Anorak Bob
20th August 2012, 06:14 PM
What a fascinating tale Richard.:2tsup:

Most of you farm boys are tarred with the same improvisational brush. I've got a brother-in-law who is a farmer in Badgingarra up near Geraldton. Some of his make do to get the job done stories are similarly entertaining though I don't think I'd get him to refurbish any of my machine tools. Ha ha.:U

BT

Tankstand
20th August 2012, 07:05 PM
Thankyou for a good read,

I just had to go and read up on windmills. Thinking I was that your windmill looks taller than 12 feet? :rolleyes:

Correct me if I am wrong but does it refer to the vane diameter? :2tsup:

All I know about windmills is my family telling me that I climbed the one at North Bungaree when I was 18 months old! :D

Ueee
20th August 2012, 07:26 PM
Good yarn RC, those old toyota trucks just go on forever!
Maybe you should have added an interlude and some elevator music to the middle of the post, so some some members could have their arvo snooze....

Tankstand, the 12feet is the vein dia, just look at the first pic of it next to the guys.

.RC.
20th August 2012, 09:04 PM
Thankyou for a good read,

I just had to go and read up on windmills. Thinking I was that your windmill looks taller than 12 feet? :rolleyes:

Correct me if I am wrong but does it refer to the vane diameter? :2tsup:





Yes it is the size of the wheel.. Tower sizes vary as well of course..

This one like most of ours has a 30ft tower.. We have a 20ft tower and a couple of 40ft ones... 30ft being chosen as a length of steel pipe is 6.5m long and the 30ft is about the minimum height to make work inside the tower easy...

We have wheel sizes ranging from 8ft to 17ft... mostly 10 and 12's.. All Southern Cross's and Comets except for a lone IBC (Intercolonial Boring Company) I think we have 19 all up, all working...

attached pic of the 17ft one and a new 10X30 comet installed a few years back to replace a bore that had a poor water supply..

shedhappens
20th August 2012, 09:13 PM
RC, It looks like good country for dams, is the soil too permeable ?

Or are the bores and windmills a cheaper/better alternative ?

Bryan
20th August 2012, 09:44 PM
Nice work RC. That crane would have to be pretty handy. Good on you for making it happen. And you're clearly smart enough to be safe. Getting off the tower while lifting was a good call I reckon.

I went up a few windmills as a lad and they gave me the horrors. They always seemed to have bolts missing and rotten platforms. The old cocky I worked for was fearless. They were the days....

.RC.
20th August 2012, 10:47 PM
RC, It looks like good country for dams, is the soil too permeable ?

Or are the bores and windmills a cheaper/better alternative ?

Dams are fairly common here, but in the scheme of things are a relatively recent thing to come along... Pretty much all these mills have been put up before earthmoving machinery was common and available...

Also dams at least in this area can tend to have a nasty habit of turning into bog holes during a drought, plus the water quality is not as good..

By the time you spend $15-20 000 on a decent dam that should not go dry you are up there above the price of a windmill setup anyway... There is no doubt the numbers of working windmills is getting less and less each year, being replaced by solar pumps and dams for various reasons...

Underground can be easily got at in this area as shown in the pic... ;)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v606/OzRinger/th_bore001Custom-1.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v606/OzRinger/bore001Custom-1.jpg)

.RC.
21st August 2012, 06:18 PM
Well my hardness tester had now paid for itself..... With the rebuild kit I purchased for this mill it comes with a hardened steel pin for connecting the con rod to the piston rod... For the fun of it I tested the hardness of the new pin... I was amazed to see it come up at 22HRC... That is about the hardness of 4140HT... As I had the old pin, I tested it.... 50HRC...hmmmmm, Someone has stuffed up here.... The new pin being so soft would not last very well..

Off to the heat treaters... In this case the oxy, coating it with soap suds first (to reduce oxidation of the surface) then heating it to orange and a bit of rapid cooling... Then a quick polish and temper to light blue...... let cool naturally and volia... came in at 47HRC... time to uncross the fingers.. :D

The hardness tester just saved a heap of labour down the track...

RayG
21st August 2012, 07:12 PM
Hi .RC,

I saw this machine working outside the window yesterday, and thought of you.


http://www.backsaw.net/pics/Misc/DSCN2163.JPG

It has more hydraulic cylinders than I could easily count, I think 6 or 7 extension sections and can swivel left and right to get into tight corners...

Might be some ideas for your next one.. :)

Regards
Ray

Anorak Bob
21st August 2012, 07:30 PM
"coating it with soap suds first "

Hey Richard,

Can you expand a bit on the application of the soap on the 4140? Please.

I have not tried any heat treating and I know it's something I need to embrace .

Bob.

.RC.
21st August 2012, 07:39 PM
I did read somewhere it will semi protect the steel from being exposed to the atmosphere when heated and thus reduce oxidation...

A bit off topic here, but here is my oven with a rectangular block of steel in it @ 1000C

Notice the ballooned coating on the steel... This is the oxidiation skin from the heated steel being in contact with the atmosphere at a high temperature..

Ueee
21st August 2012, 07:54 PM
Soap, Borax or even fine sand all work well to stop oxidization of steel at high temps. If using an oxy setup (acet or LPG), a slightly reducing (oxygen deficient) flame helps to make sure there is no unburnt oxygen that can cause iron oxides. Hardening is just like any other aspect of metalworking, the more precise you are the better the results.

.RC.
24th August 2012, 01:03 PM
quick update pictures..... I should be further advanced on this but making money in the shipping industry has kept me busy along with the metropolis of Rockhampton not having any 5/8 balls and having to wait several days for them to get some in for me...

A couple of picsw showing the very basic design.... Just a simple crank system.. And the bare main casting with the new wooden bearings yet to be installed.

shedhappens
24th August 2012, 05:51 PM
Ha......... I can remember being puzzled when I was a kid because my father was in his shed making wooden bushes, they might have been for a windmill pump ? He was born and bred on a farm.

What type of wood is it RC ? Turpentine ?

The pump is looking pretty smick too.

Log
26th August 2012, 10:01 PM
Thanks .RC. for the story and pics of the current going-on's of a central Queensland cow chaser:D.

I bet the truck crane:2tsup: will come in handy around the place.

I hope we get to see a vid of the workings of the mechanism's in operation:2tsup:.

Cheers.

.RC.
26th August 2012, 10:30 PM
Ha......... I can remember being puzzled when I was a kid because my father was in his shed making wooden bushes, they might have been for a windmill pump ? He was born and bred on a farm.

What type of wood is it RC ? Turpentine ?

The pump is looking pretty smick too.

No idea what the timber is.... I assume spotted gum...

If the weather is favourable it should go back tomorrow and do hope to have the camera rolling...... I had some complications I had to attend to today..... Namely the ball race it rotates on needed to be machined due to wear...

.RC.
27th August 2012, 02:30 PM
All over bar the shouting.... Have vid and pics on camera....

Ropetangler
27th August 2012, 03:44 PM
It looks great Richard, as does the country. You've had rain by the look of all the green up there, which can only be good. I hadn't noticed Palfy Jnr. on the Landcruiser ute before, - that would have to be useful too, what is its capacity, and does it have outriggers?
Did you attach the vanes before lifting it up, or did you leave them off until you had the main assembly in place and anchored down. A bit less windage that way, but against that, a fair bit of assembly requiring working at height. Either way it looks good from here.
Rob:2tsup:

TKO
27th August 2012, 04:13 PM
Hi .RC. have followed the story from the begining,I reckon it should be in book form Has been very interesting reading ,and an eye opener,as to what you have to do with the lack of expensive equipment,to get a difficult job done,I take my hat off to you.


Eddie

.RC.
27th August 2012, 06:45 PM
It looks great Richard, as does the country. You've had rain by the look of all the green up there, which can only be good. I hadn't noticed Palfy Jnr. on the Landcruiser ute before, - that would have to be useful too, what is its capacity, and does it have outriggers?
Did you attach the vanes before lifting it up, or did you leave them off until you had the main assembly in place and anchored down. A bit less windage that way, but against that, a fair bit of assembly requiring working at height. Either way it looks good from here.
Rob:2tsup:

Yes had a really good winter. winter is usually very dry for us...We actually had our first storm yesterday but only got 7mm out of it... More storms around today.... August/September are usually the two driest months of the year here...

The crane in the landcruiser is a Lindsell Hoist one.... I got it several years ago to save my back as I cannot lift 400kg.... It has a leg you can put down is you need it.... It is radio remote controlled, manual slew...



Hi .RC. have followed the story from the begining,I reckon it should be in book form Has been very interesting reading ,and an eye opener,as to what you have to do with the lack of expensive equipment,to get a difficult job done,I take my hat off to you.


Eddie

Thanks for the kind words.....

Video has been uploaded and is available for viewing here.....

Enjoy.... I think you will get a laugh out of it..In is rendered in 720HD as well so click on that... :):)

Comet windmill reconditioning - YouTube (http://youtu.be/p4p0g6NeUcI)

Anorak Bob
27th August 2012, 07:11 PM
Fanxxxxxxxtastic.:2tsup:

Steamwhisperer
27th August 2012, 08:52 PM
Love your work..and methods .RC.:2tsup:

Phil

Ueee
27th August 2012, 10:24 PM
Thanks for the vid:2tsup: Has been a few years since the inlaws sold their farm, great fun to be had doing all sorts......Never that green though, spent more time feeding than anything else in the last few years.
Never would have thought timber bearings, spotted gum would be perfect, it is hard, naturally slightly waxy and has a lowish silica content.

Stustoys
27th August 2012, 11:16 PM
Great work RC, thanks for the pics and video.


Stuart

Bryan
27th August 2012, 11:25 PM
Yep, tidy work Cowboy. :2tsup: What I want to know is, does it still rattle, clank, squeak and groan? I just find it hard to imagine a windmill that doesn't. :)

springwater
28th August 2012, 12:11 AM
Great set of skills you've got there RC well done :2tsup:

I climbed an old rusty, tailless windmill out the back of an old farmhouse in East Trentham (Vic) one foggy morning and as soon as I stood at the top the old thing slowly started to turn and rotate a bit with a creaky groan :oo: There's not a lot of dancing room up there. Got down pretty quickly and had a cuppa tea :-

.RC.
29th September 2012, 04:44 PM
Neighbour just got a 10ft SX reconditioned.... It took the "expert" 3 years (no typo) to do and has sent a bill of $8000 to our neighbour.... Lets just say he is not impressed...

nearnexus
29th September 2012, 07:14 PM
Good video.

That's a very handy crane truck you've got there.

Farmers have to do it themselves to stay solvent.

We don't have any windmills, but we've certainly repaired plenty of stuff.

Contractors will always rip you off - that's the way of life.

Good one.

Rob