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xXvapourXx
26th August 2012, 11:02 PM
Hey guys
Im really in need of some new drill bits because my other crappy ones keep breaking, bound to happen though. So what are some good drill bit sets that are under $50?

Cooper

Grahame Collins
26th August 2012, 11:12 PM
Hey guys
Im really in need of some new drill bits because my other crappy ones keep breaking, bound to happen though. So what are some good drill bit sets that are under $50?

Cooper

Poor technique and wrong speeds can break good drills as readily as crappy ones!

What do you see as a set ?

1 -10mm in .5 increments, or 1- 13mm.

What do you need , carbon steel drills or HSS?

You will be hard pressed to find a decent quality brand set of 1 -13mm HSS under a $100.
I call Sutton .P &N and Frost decent brands.

Grahame

xXvapourXx
26th August 2012, 11:22 PM
I see a set being 1 to 10mm and i need HSS. Dont really need any thing bigger than 10mm at the moment as iv got some drill bits from 11 to 14

I was thinking of getting this set: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Frost-Sutton-Set-Drill-Metric-19Pce-HSS-HV274118-92258-/130656208844?pt=AU_Power_Tools&hash=item1e6bb787cc#ht_2578wt_1139

Cooper

Greg Q
27th August 2012, 12:03 AM
Without clicking on your link, Frost are made in China and are reputed to be crap.
Dormer make a great bit, as do Guhring. I think your quality desires conflict with your budget.

Greg

Ueee
27th August 2012, 12:06 AM
Hi Cooper,
I have 2 older sets(10+ years, made in Aus) of frosts and am very happy with them. However i have bought a few single drills of late and have been very disappointed with them. My good drills are Dormers and i have a few Bordo's in larger sizes. To be honest the bordo's are not up to the standards of the dormers. This link is what i would suggest....but it is twice the cost you want to spend:o http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Dormer-A095-Comp-Hss-Tin-Drill-Set-1-10mm-X-0-5-/170819502077?pt=AU_Tool_Parts_Accessories&hash=item27c5a2bffd

xXvapourXx
27th August 2012, 12:07 AM
Would these be alright?

DORMER A096 No.413 HSS Drill Set of 19 1.0-10mm x 0.5mm | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/DORMER-A096-No-413-HSS-Drill-Set-19-1-0-10mm-x-0-5mm-/380464656464?pt=UK_Hand_Tools_Equipment&hash=item589575f050#ht_1014wt_1163)

Ueee
27th August 2012, 12:13 AM
They are the ones you want....but i would check with the seller about the set, the description says 1-6.5 x .05, but the title says 1-10....at the price i would have to say the 1-6.5 would be correct

xXvapourXx
27th August 2012, 12:24 AM
hmm thinking about it, i reckon ill try and save up for the bigger set like the one you linked me.

Cooper

Ropetangler
27th August 2012, 12:26 AM
I see a set being 1 to 10mm and i need HSS. Dont really need any thing bigger than 10mm at the moment as iv got some drill bits from 11 to 14

I was thinking of getting this set: Frost by Sutton Set Drill Metric 19Pce HSS HV274118 92258 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Frost-Sutton-Set-Drill-Metric-19Pce-HSS-HV274118-92258-/130656208844?pt=AU_Power_Tools&hash=item1e6bb787cc#ht_2578wt_1139)

Cooper
Drill Sets (http://kittstools.securesites.net/store/drill_sets.html)
1000's of drill bits - high speed, cobalt, and carbide (http://www.victornet.com/departments/Drill-Bits/90.html)
G'Day Cooper, the links above will give you an idea of what is available, but these are both U.S. suppliers, so you will have freight on top.
Probably nothing wrong with the drill bits in your link, except if you plan on tapping drilled holes. The jumps are a bit big, and mostly miss the sizes needed for tapping drills. They would be o.k. for general use and you could just buy the bits needed for M3, M4, M5, M8, and M10 and use these only for tapping drills. This might help improve your tapping, as you would have more accurately sized holes for your job.
As Grahame has said, you can break good bits just as easily as poor drill bits, especially in smaller sizes, if all you have is a hand held drill. If you don't already have one a small drill press and vice may be a good investment. This will make it much easier to drill thin sheet, stainless steel and other difficult materials and save breaking your drill bits. Your holes will be square, and you can even start your taps using the drill press as a guide to get a straight start with your tap. You turn the chuck by hand, NOT by powering the drill press, and this can save breaking taps too.
If you do decide to just get the tapping size drill bits, for tapping the sizes you need, you will need to go to a good engineering supplies business, as your local hardware store is unlikely to have what you need, online suppliers may also be useful.
If you don't plan on tapping threads, but just need to drill the odd hole, then the set you linked to should be a reasonable starting point for you. All the best,
Rob.
Cooper I was unaware that Frost drills are now of questionable quality, Dormer are certainly good from what I have heard. In the links I posted both suppliers, have imported (most likely Chinese, and of uncertain quality) and also American made drill bits, which I would expect to be pretty good, although I have only seen their advertisements, and never used their products. Kitts Industrial Products have quite a few different sets, even a set of Cobalt drills from 1/16 to 1/2" in 1/64th rises, USA manufactured for US$ 85.00. They should be very good for drilling Stainless steel and other tough materials, as they are 1 step up from HSS. All the best, Rob.

xXvapourXx
27th August 2012, 12:41 AM
Drill Sets (http://kittstools.securesites.net/store/drill_sets.html)
1000's of drill bits - high speed, cobalt, and carbide (http://www.victornet.com/departments/Drill-Bits/90.html)
G'Day Cooper, the links above will give you an idea of what is available, but these are both U.S. suppliers, so you will have freight on top.
Probably nothing wrong with the drill bits in your link, except if you plan on tapping drilled holes. The jumps are a bit big, and mostly miss the sizes needed for tapping drills. They would be o.k. for general use and you could just buy the bits needed for M3, M4, M5, M8, and M10 and use these only for tapping drills. This might help improve your tapping, as you would have more accurately sized holes for your job.
As Grahame has said, you can break good bits just as easily as poor drill bits, especially in smaller sizes, if all you have is a hand held drill. If you don't already have one a small drill press and vice may be a good investment. This will make it much easier to drill thin sheet, stainless steel and other difficult materials and save breaking your drill bits. Your holes will be square, and you can even start your taps using the drill press as a guide to get a straight start with your tap. You turn the chuck by hand, NOT by powering the drill press, and this can save breaking taps too.
If you do decide to just get the tapping size drill bits, for tapping the sizes you need, you will need to go to a good engineering supplies business, as your local hardware store is unlikely to have what you need, online suppliers may also be useful.
If you don't plan on tapping threads, but just need to drill the odd hole, then the set you linked to should be a reasonable starting point for you. All the best,
Rob.

I was planing to get the dormer set for drilling holes but also taping, but if i don't get the dormers will ill get the frost set. My dad is bringing my waldown drill press from his house to my house we were going to fix it at my dads house but dad dosent have the time at the moment so im bringing it to mine and replacing the motor and probably a good clean to. So ill most likely be making a thread about the drill press this week.
Are the Sutton Viper sets any good?? or are they just the same as the frosts?

Cooper

Ueee
27th August 2012, 12:52 AM
As far as i know they are the same.
I keep a cheaper set of drills for use in a hand drill, that way if i break them its not so bad:rolleyes:. I then have a set of dormers in .1mm rises that i use just in the mill, drill press and on the lathe. When i have broken the smaller sizes i buy a whole box of 10 of them, so i shouldn't have to buy any for a looooooong time. the smaller drills are less than $2 each so its relatively affordable one box at a time.

Ropetangler
27th August 2012, 01:07 AM
Cooper, I can't help you with any info about Sutton Viper drill bits, until GQ's post, I thought that all Sutton and Frost were Australian made, but that appears to be ancient history now. Congratulations on the Waldown, that will be a great asset.
Ewan, do you get your Dormer drills locally, or online? Cheers all,
Rob.

scottyd
27th August 2012, 08:37 AM
I can +1 to the frost being crap argument. I gave them a go through school and within the week, most of them had been trashed, including one being snapped off in some timber! In particular, I found them to be really brittle. As a general rule, I only purchase sutton and P+N drills now. Ive just bought a few of the mentioned viper bits, they seems pretty good, especially the cobalt ones.

Bunnings has / had a box of 170 drills from 1.5 up to 10mm for $20, supposedly HSS with TiN coating. My head teacher got them saying "who cares how average they are, at that price we can go through them like candy and we'll still be ahead". I believed his train of thought...for a few hours. I had a look in the box to see what was in there, 3 of the drills in different sizes were sharpened back-to-front, 2 of them were incorrectly sized by more than .5mm and maaany of them would drill much larger than stamped because they were badly sharpened. A few were even bad enough to visibly wobble once the centre of the drill found the centre punch mark. They were all as brittle as ice too, the cutting edges had a tendency to chip and the coatings didnt stick around for long.

Very ...uhh...interesting drills.

Bryan
27th August 2012, 09:34 AM
I've been happy with Vipers. And I've also had a set of the horrors described by scottyd. They went in the bin. I keep metric x .5 and imp x 64th sets by the drill and a conversion chart. For tapping I can usually find one close en<cough> within tolerance. :)

But the single best investment you can make, after a drill press and some ok bits, is learning how to sharpen them. And there's a ton of material been written about that. (Hint: search) :wink:

morrisman
27th August 2012, 10:41 AM
I've been using Bordo as its what the local supplier BJ Bearings sell locally . I haven't got a complete set, but I buy the odd new bit when I need a particular size . They perform OK for my needs , mostly in mild steel .

Mike

Ueee
27th August 2012, 11:32 AM
Ewan, do you get your Dormer drills locally, or online? Cheers all,
Rob.

Hi Rob,
I get them locally, although the sets are cheaper on ebay i don't think i have seen individuals anywhere online at a decent price, i know Bolt.com.au sells them but at about twice the price i can get them for locally. RS sells them too, much better price than Bolt, but still not what i pay. (i do get trade prices on some stuff though, depends who serves me....)

xXvapourXx
27th August 2012, 08:49 PM
thanks guys, ill probably either get those viper drill bits if not, the dormers.
Those viper drill bits do look not bad for the price though but im still thinking haha
Iv got my birthday next week and im thinking of buying some lathe tools so here another question what turning tools would you guys recommend? and im thinking of buying a quick change tool post to maybe.

Cooper

Jekyll and Hyde
27th August 2012, 09:08 PM
For what it's worth, I'll throw a different supplier into the mix that might not occur to most. Although it probably doesn't help Cooper much, I have a 29pc (imperial) set of Snap-On cobalt drill bits that I bought a few years ago. They were normally over $300, I got them for $150 at the time, and they are brilliant. Haven't broken one yet, and only had to give the cutting edges a quick clean up on the grinder on a few of them after years of use. Not to mention they still cut like they're going through butter.

This is the set I have here: DBTBC129, Set, Drill Bit, THUNDERBIT&#174;, Cobalt, 135&#176; Split Point, 29 Bits (http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item.asp?P65=&tool=power&item_ID=634501&group_ID=675209&store=australia&dir=catalog)

If you go looking on Ebay, just be aware that when I was searching trying to find the same set as I had, one came up with an almost identical part number (DBTB129 instead of DBTBC129), but they weren't cobalt drills. I did find a completed listing out of the US for an unused set that went for just a shade under $160US - not bad value, I reckon, assuming Snap-On are still using the same manufacturer as when I bought mine almost ten years ago (has it really been that long?). And of course, providing you don't mind imperial sizes, since I don't see a metric option. I do see however, that the 21 piece set that only goes up to 3/8 is $167 straight off Snap-On Australia... Strangely cheap in comparison to the price for the 29 piece set....

I suppose if you could work out which manufacturer is supplying them to Snap-On, you might be able to get a metric set, but I'd guess that it will be one of the usual suspects.

xXvapourXx
27th August 2012, 09:48 PM
Yea i iv heard about snap on quite a phew people have said they are good but i never knew they made drill bits haha, Don't think ill pay $160 for them though, maybe when i get i job i will. :D

Cooper

Stustoys
27th August 2012, 09:51 PM
Not sure I would buy viper drill bits if they were going to be my only drills. They can be very aggressive also sharpening will be a problem. I have normal Sutton, Viper and a suit case of cheapys for use in the pistol drill.

I've also had Frost years ago that snapped like carrots, maybe they would be ok in a pillar drill?

Stuart

SurfinNev
27th August 2012, 10:01 PM
I thought that all Sutton and Frost were Australian made, but that appears to be ancient history now.

I have a set of Sutton imperial fractional drills made in New zealand. KMart used to have their brand, which was Performer. They also were made in New zealnd. They were pretty good drills. Probably made by whoever made the sutton.

Nev

welder
27th August 2012, 10:08 PM
I have a sett made by JBS industrial (Blackwoods) the set cost me $60 I think but it may have been more. The drill bits are Aussie made as good as my P+N drills.

pipeclay
28th August 2012, 01:59 AM
With regard to lathe tools were you looking for HSS blanks,HSS preground,Cemented Carbide or Indexable tooling.

bollie7
28th August 2012, 11:12 AM
Cooper
Seeing as how you are a young bloke who is keen to get into metal working and thats pretty rare these days, I have some extra drill bits that I'd like to donate to you. They will be an assortment of random sizes, not a full set though, but all good quality in good condition.
I think I might also have a tin with some used bits in it that all need a clean up and a sharpen. If I can find them you can have them too if you want them.

If you PM me with a postal address I'll send them to you. But keep in mind I'm not as young as I used to be and I frequently forget things so you might have to remind me.
regards
bollie7

Ueee
28th August 2012, 01:01 PM
Good onya Bollie7:2tsup:
even at my young age i seem to have a tin of odds and sods of drills, inherited, bought in job lots etc. I could only imagine that you would accumulate more and more as you get more experienced:D

Stustoys
28th August 2012, 01:12 PM
I have some extra drill bits that I'd like to donate to you. :brava

welder
28th August 2012, 01:29 PM
+1 on what ueee said onya Bollie7.
My collection of odd and assorted drills is pretty big and growing and I am less than half most of.you blokes age :o

Steamwhisperer
28th August 2012, 06:59 PM
Well done Bollie7:2tsup:
I keep saying it...."the members on this forum...

xXvapourXx
28th August 2012, 07:04 PM
Cooper
Seeing as how you are a young bloke who is keen to get into metal working and thats pretty rare these days, I have some extra drill bits that I'd like to donate to you. They will be an assortment of random sizes, not a full set though, but all good quality in good condition.
I think I might also have a tin with some used bits in it that all need a clean up and a sharpen. If I can find them you can have them too if you want them.

If you PM me with a postal address I'll send them to you. But keep in mind I'm not as young as I used to be and I frequently forget things so you might have to remind me.
regards
bollie7

Wow thanks Bollie i would be happy to own them! :D Ill send you my Address now. I will probably save my money for something else now for my shed or lathe. Once again thanks bollie :2tsup:

Cooper

bollie7
29th August 2012, 09:03 AM
Wow thanks Bollie i would be happy to own them! :D Ill send you my Address now. I will probably save my money for something else now for my shed or lathe. Once again thanks bollie :2tsup:

Cooper

No worries mate. PM sent. I'll try and have a look tonight but it might not happen until the weekend. I don't know how many spare smaller drills I have so you will still have to buy yourself some but at least smaller drills are cheaper than bigger ones.
It will be a bit of a lucky dip for you.:).
I don't mind helping out a keen young bloke. ( my own sons have no interest what so ever) When I was your age, a few old hands helped me out with tools etc so I suppose its just paying forward.
In 30 years or so you might be in a position to do the same for another keen youngster.
regards
bollie7

P J
29th August 2012, 09:21 PM
Bunnings has / had a box of 170 drills from 1.5 up to 10mm for $20, supposedly HSS with TiN coating. My head teacher got them saying "who cares how average they are, at that price we can go through them like candy and we'll still be ahead". I believed his train of thought...for a few hours. I had a look in the box to see what was in there, 3 of the drills in different sizes were sharpened back-to-front, 2 of them were incorrectly sized by more than .5mm and maaany of them would drill much larger than stamped because they were badly sharpened. A few were even bad enough to visibly wobble once the centre of the drill found the centre punch mark. They were all as brittle as ice too, the cutting edges had a tendency to chip and the coatings didnt stick around for long.

Very ...uhh...interesting drills.

Yeah I thought the same and bought a set of those. I've chucked the lot in the bin since, there wasn't a straight one in the box.

bollie7
31st August 2012, 11:08 AM
Cooper
Your "Care" package is in the mail. You should get it on Mon or Tue. Enjoy

regards
bollie7

xXvapourXx
31st August 2012, 08:19 PM
Cooper
Your "Care" package is in the mail. You should get it on Mon or Tue. Enjoy

regards
bollie7

Ok thanks Bollie. Cant wait to get the parts on Mon or Tue!

Cooper

marty989
24th September 2012, 10:20 PM
Just to revive and hijack this thread, I'm after a decent set of drills and would like some advice. Previously I've only ever used bunnings cheapies but now I want a decent set for my mini lathe. Sutton currently have a 25 piece 95th aniversary metric set for $95. Someone cautioned against Viper bits and I'm not sure if these are just a repackaged version of those.

I don't mind spending a bit of money and there seems to be a price range of $100-$150. It seems the major manufacturers have numerous different sets and I'm just not sure what to get. It would seem plain HSS isn't good for ferrous metals although I won't be doing much of that I'd imagine on a mini lathe so I don't know whether coated ones would be better. I also want to get some proper sized drill bits for tapping and it seems I might be better off just buying individual bits for that?

Thanks for your help.

Michael G
25th September 2012, 07:38 AM
Plain HSS is fine for ferrous metals. The most important thing is the speed at which they are being used and that they are sharp. If the drills are run too fast they will overheat and lose their edge.
Sutton and P&N are both good brands.

Michael

scottyd
25th September 2012, 08:53 AM
There isnt anything wrong with the vipers to use, I find them a lot more resiliant to abuse from group after group of teenagers and if any tool can put up with that, itll be more than enough for a hobbiest. The only problem I have with the vipers is the internal web is a lot thicker than other drills (probably why they are so tough), so once youve sharpened off the back relief of the cutting edge, the drill becomes very difficult to push through work. You could just learn how to grind that back relief though, it reduces the need for pilot drills somewhat.

Materials wise, the M42 CoHSS are very good. Dear, but I dont think youd be buying new drills in a hurry.

simonl
25th September 2012, 06:51 PM
Without clicking on your link, Frost are made in China and are reputed to be crap.
Dormer make a great bit, as do Guhring. I think your quality desires conflict with your budget.

Greg

I have some really old Sutton and Frost drill bits. They were made when stuff was made in Australia. Encouraged by their quality, I recently bought a Frost tap wrench, only to be bitterly disappointed with the quality. The correct size tap starting turning in the wrench after 1/2 dozen turns, I really should have known because it looked like it was made of cheese. I took it back and I'll never buy Frost again. :~

I was under the impression that Frost, Sutton and P&N are all the same brand but I may be wrong. Dormer seem to make nice stuff still.

Simon

simonl
25th September 2012, 06:55 PM
BTW, I recently bought a Drill Doctor 750X. Sharpens the drill geometry beautifully and symmetrically. Love it! Not a blunt drill to be seen! :U
My drill holes are now central to my centre punch marks again.

Simon

Michael G
25th September 2012, 06:55 PM
I suspect that Viper bits are the way they are because they are the old '4 facet' sharpening technique. From a production point of view a lot easier to automate rather than the 2 axis movement needed for standard sharpening.
Nothing wrong with them though.

Michael

Greg Q
25th September 2012, 07:12 PM
I have some really old Sutton and Frost drill bits. They were made when stuff was made in Australia. Encouraged by their quality, I recently bought a Frost tap wrench, only to be bitterly disappointed with the quality. The correct size tap starting turning in the wrench after 1/2 dozen turns, I really should have known because it looked like it was made of cheese. I took it back and I'll never buy Frost again. :~

I was under the impression that Frost, Sutton and P&N are all the same brand but I may be wrong. Dormer seem to make nice stuff still.

Simon

I wonder about that...i have a P & N tap wrench that is useless too...the tap will easily spin out of the collet jaws. Maybe its an undocumented feature to prevent tap breakage?:wink:

Ueee
25th September 2012, 07:42 PM
Hi Marty,
Earlier in the thread there where some good suggestions as to brands, bordo, dormer even snap on got thrown in IIRC. Buy the best you can afford and you won't regret it. As for tapping drills, if you don't get a set of drills in .1mm rises, then I would just buy the appropriate tapping drill with each tap you buy.

Graziano
25th September 2012, 08:52 PM
Almost every box of the Frost made in China drills (around 10) I've looked at are actually sharpened wrong, seemingly at random angles: another "Movie prop" product, it looks like the real thing but can't function as the real thing.

Stustoys
25th September 2012, 09:40 PM
The only problem I have with the vipers is the internal web is a lot thicker than other drills (probably why they are so tough)
I just measure my S2 and viper webs and as far as I can tell they are the same. Though sutton makes so many different drills that doesnt mean much.

I suspect that Viper bits are the way they are because they are the old '4 facet' sharpening technique. From a production point of view a lot easier to automate rather than the 2 axis movement needed for standard sharpening.

Split point and four facet are a little different. The primary face on the vipers is 2D.

The only problem I have with vipers is some times they work to well.


Stuart

pipeclay
26th September 2012, 02:29 AM
I just measure my S2 and viper webs and as far as I can tell they are the same. Though sutton makes so many different drills that doesnt mean much.

Split point and four facet are a little different. The primary face on the vipers is 2D.

The only problem I have with vipers is some times they work to well.


Stuart
Nothing better than the blunt ones and those that cut oversize,you just need to throw the crappy ones that cut true and are sharp in the bin.

marty989
26th September 2012, 11:05 AM
Thanks for the advice so far guys. I had a look at some Dormer sets on ebay. There seems to be some still made in the UK and others are made in Brazil. Are the Brazilian ones still ok?

Ueee
26th September 2012, 01:04 PM
Dormer makes stuff all over the place.....mill tooling mostly comes from Sweden, some Germany.....but to answer your question I have both UK and Brazil drills and there is no difference as far as I can tell.

RayG
26th September 2012, 02:12 PM
The best ( and still Australian Made) i'd recommend Sutton Tools.

Brands (http://www.sutton.com.au/Brands)

Drills (http://www.sutton.com.au/Products/drills/)

I think it's well known that the Frost Brand is sourced overseas, but the good stuff is still made in Melbourne.

Josh did the commissioning of the central pump control for their coolant system about a year back, and could probably elaborate on the product range they make at their Thomastown plant.

Their heat treatment is done by Surface Technology Coatings, ( I'm pretty sure it's a subsidiary of Sutton Tools) and the previous batches of chisels and plane blades for the forum group purchases were done by them. Not the most recent batch however, they were flat out with in-house production.

So, support Australian Manufacturing, buy Australian. :)

Regards
Ray

PS. They are just around the corner from Phil, (Machtool) so he might know a bit more as to what their product range to recommend.

marty989
26th September 2012, 03:37 PM
Went to two dedicated tool stores and only one even had a set, but it was imperial. Picked up these at Bunnings to get me going.
234270

welder
26th September 2012, 03:54 PM
I was at bunnings today and found two sets of frost drill sets which are Australian made.

RayG
26th September 2012, 05:30 PM
I was at bunnings today and found two sets of frost drill sets which are Australian made.

Hi Andre,

Yes, Frost is one of Sutton's brands, but NOT made in Australia, (as far as I know) that's their cheap chinese brand. Stick with the other Sutton Brands.

Regards
Ray