2 questions on new lathes

[leroy]

Hi, first post here so please go easy on me:U just beginning with lathes,
If you had to choose between two similar lathes one with variable speed control (TL250V)
or power cross feed (AL320G) which feature would be more suitable for making hand driven coffee grinders in aluminum and mild steel?
second Question, is a timber bench suitable for a lath of of this weight, or is there to much movement for precision work?

[nearnexus]

I would definitely buy the TL250V.

It has a quick change gearbox for the leadscrew - the other does not.

This is a major factor for anyone that uses a lathe continually. You don't want to be crawling along at one feed speed or frigging around with change gears

Also the variable spindle speed would be quite OK for what you intend to machine.

Power cross feeds are no big deal. One downside is that they feed at one speed and you can't vary the feed as the diameter of the job changes (ie. as you move into the centre).

The AL320G is one of those lathes that looks good at first glance but is really a bit of a non event IMHO.

You should have the lathe on a rigid base - ie steel or cement. Wood is not what I would consider as suitable.

Rob

[BRADFORD]

It depends on what you need to machine, for example are you intending to turn larger diameter or smaller diameter?, length of items between centres? ,what size will you need to pass through the spindle bore?, will you be cutting a lot of threads?
For me at least, buying a lathe became a compromise between what I would like to have and what I was prepared to spend.
Your best option is to make list of every feature a lathe (any lathe) can offer, then select which of these features you would actually use regularly then find the lathe with the features you have selected. A further compromise may be required for price as mentioned above.
I would not be mounting the lathe on a wooden bench

Good luck

[leroy]

Thanks Rob, every thing you said pretty much goes with what I've been told in bits and pieces from various souces, I just don't have enough experience yet to confidently judge for myself, thanks for your reply:U

[nearnexus]

One other thing to consider regarding geared head lathes is that they can leave a pattern in very fine work.

This is due to harmonics produced when the gears mesh. That's why super precision tool room lathes such as Shaublin are mostly belt drive.

To get around this the cheap lathes generally have a fibre gear in the final drive set.

I think the AL320G has one of these.

As Bradford said, make sure you have adequate swing for the diameter of the work - ie. allow for the use of external chuck jaws in addition to the job diameter (clearance wise).

Cheers

Rob

[Stustoys]

It has a quick change gearbox for the leadscrew - the other does not.

Not so sure about that. It seems to have A B C. but that has to cover both thread pitches and powerfeed as the powerfeed appears to be done with the half nuts. so the steps will likely be pretty huge or you will have to change gears between thread and power feed

While the AL-320G doesnt have any quick change at all its powerfeed isnt driven with the half nuts so will be a different ratio.

"or is there to much movement for precision"
Well now that depends on what you call precision and over what length you need to hold it?
If you have the tools to make a steel bench then I'd say go for it, $250 will buy you a lot of steel. If not and you're aiming for sizes in the +/-0.1mm range* I'd say dont let it worry you just yet.

Stuart

*over a short distance. If you want to hold 0.1mm for the length of the lathe best get going on your steel bench.

[nearnexus]

Here's a video describing the TL250V.

TL250V MOVIE - YouTube

Looks like a nice little lathe.

I only have a 3 step quick change gearbox on my CQ9325 and it's plenty good enough.

The CQ9325 has got three ratio choices that are sensibly spaced for coarse, medium, and fine feed. The Titan looks to be pretty similar. Also has a reverse tumbler.

And has two belt drive ratios, which is a good thing.

For the money it seems pretty well done.

You get a steel bench/stand as well.

I couldn't understand what the deal with the thread indicator working was in the video - seemed a bit odd to me. But then I don't have one :)

[leroy]

OK Rob, I had seen that vidio,I thought it was a good overview of the lathe, I've looked at so many lathes online and some in the metal and it just keeps going around and around, comes a time to make a decision, tomorrow I'll put my money down on the titan 250V and go from there,
CHEERS:U

[nearnexus]

I hope it goes as well as it looks.

The Chinese are certainly bringing out some really nice lathes these days - design wise.

I agree, when you look at the $1000 to $2500 range it's difficult to choose.

I'd be happy with that one. For similar money you can also get the AL250G and the CQ6128. Haven't seen the AL250G but the CQ6128 is pretty capable.

Life's hard at times, but hey, it's only money :)

Rob

[bwal74]

Hi,

I've never dealt with Titan but did see about 100 adds posted on Ebay by a disgruntled buyer (who purchased a milling machine which he claimed didn't work as specified) last weekend (now taken off).
I'm not siding either way but I would definitely make sure you get a warranty and actually see the machine work etc.
Maybe check out Hare and Forbes for their equivalent.
Let us know how you go.
For arguments sake, I love power crossfeed on a lathe, I always get a better finish when facing.
Ben.

[cba_melbourne]

Hi, first post here so please go easy on me:U just beginning with lathes,
If you had to choose between two similar lathes one with variable speed control (TL250V)
or power cross feed (AL320G) which feature would be more suitable for making hand driven coffee grinders in aluminum and mild steel?
second Question, is a timber bench suitable for a lath of of this weight, or is there to much movement for precision work?

If the choice is between a variable speed lathe and a power cross feed lathe, I would reason as follows: It is very easy and low cost to add variable speed to an existing lathe, but it is much harder to add cross feed. I like to add this: don't buy the lathe with just the one current project (coffee grinder) in mind. Think wahat you will use it for after that and 5 or 10 years later.

Regarding the timber bench, this is not simply a matter of lathe weight. Wood lives and moves with humidity and temperature. As long as you are into things like coffe grinders, a wooden bench is absolutely fine. But should you ever feel the need to turn longer objects to precise fits, you may not want a bench that twists your lathe bed with the seasons and causes it to cut taper. That is not to say that a timber bench cannot be made to avoid twisting the lathe bed, it just is not easy and certailnly not cheaper than a steel stand. The very best lathe stands are made of cast iron, because they are dimensionally stable like a sheet metal stand yet dampen vibrations like a solid oak bench would.

Chris

[leroy]

Hi Chris, I was I was just trying to save money but I guess I knew timber being what it is woudn't do the job, I'm 67 this year and a raw beginner with a lathe, I just want something
that I can use as is and not get too adventuress for the future, in 5 to 10 years I'll be worn out
before the lathe:Uif I can figure out how to add photos here I'll show my last big project

[MuellerNick]

It is very easy and low cost to add variable speed to an existing lathe

+1!
Save a bit of money, add it later. Maybe even after you have given up using the lathe. :rolleyes:


Nick

[bwal74]

Leroy,

If you can built a boat, don't worry about what type of lathe you get, you'll be able to use.

Don't discount second hand either, there are some good lathes out there.

37" LANTAINE MODEL LAM 350 BH 240 VOLT - IN GREAT USED WORKING COND | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/37-LANTAINE-MODEL-LAM-350-BH-240-VOLT-GREAT-USED-WORKING-COND-/140839367334?pt=AU_Hardware&hash=item20caae32a6#ht_500wt_1288)

Doesn't look to bad, but you would need to inspect it first.

Ben

[shedhappens]

Hi Chris, I was I was just trying to save money but I guess I knew timber being what it is woudn't do the job, I'm 67 this year and a raw beginner with a lathe, I just want something
that I can use as is and not get too adventuress for the future, in 5 to 10 years I'll be worn out
before the lathe:Uif I can figure out how to add photos here I'll show my last big project


Nice little project that Leroy, I know what it's like to do fabrication and welding in the mud so I can appreciate the effort you have put in there. :2tsup:

Just one question, how did you turn it over to complete it ?

[PDW]

Hi Chris, I was I was just trying to save money but I guess I knew timber being what it is woudn't do the job, I'm 67 this year and a raw beginner with a lathe, I just want something
that I can use as is and not get too adventuress for the future, in 5 to 10 years I'll be worn out
before the lathe:Uif I can figure out how to add photos here I'll show my last big project

Bruce Roberts SPRAY design? 40'?

I'm building a toy steel sailboat ATM.

PDW

[leroy]

HI,yes a Bruce Roberts 38ft Spray, I built the hull upside down to make laying the skin plating easier also easier for me to weld,at the time of turning it over it weighed about 3.5 ton, I built a frame over it and used 4 2 ton chain blocks, lowered one side as raised the other, it rolled over smooth as you like without touching the ground.By the way I caved on the TL250V and bought a Hafco AL 320G from HARE and FORBES in Brisbane today

[HavinaGo]

Amazing!
I continue to be amazed by the things people build! Anything seems to have become possible!
All the best withe the lathe.

[PDW]

HI,yes a Bruce Roberts 38ft Spray, I built the hull upside down to make laying the skin plating easier also easier for me to weld,at the time of turning it over it weighed about 3.5 ton, I built a frame over it and used 4 2 ton chain blocks, lowered one side as raised the other, it rolled over smooth as you like without touching the ground.By the way I caved on the TL250V and bought a Hafco AL 320G from HARE and FORBES in Brisbane today

I built mine right-side up on the advice of the designer. It worked out fine and I'd do it again. There's no one right way to do stuff like this, whatever works for you.

Best way I ever saw was the way the META yard in France did them - 2 giant rings on rollers and build the hull inside. Rotate as required to ease welding.

Couple pix.

Have fun with the lathe, now you can start getting all the tooling you want. My suggestion for the first upgrade is to get a quick change toolpost, but not from H&F unless you like to pay 2X the price for the same thing you can buy elsewhere.

I like the multifix type myself and one day I'm going to get one for my big lathe. Meanwhile the Dickson I have on my little Colchester is very nice to use.

PDW

[leroy]

Hi PDL, Thats a nice looking boat,a bit more traditional deck layout than mine, reminds me of the original,how did you rig it, one or two masts? I remember reading about those rings in France, a bit beyond me.I've been setting the lathe up on its stand tonight, had to strip most of the bits off it to get a sling on that would balance the heavy thing, managed in the end.
I bought a few tools from H &F to get me going, will start looking on line now for the rest,
my wife says its all starting again just like the boat its like throwing money into a bottomless
hole in the water:U

[Ueee]

Congrats on your purchase Leroy:2tsup:
Some of us throw a saying about sometimes, "it didn't happen unless there are photo's". So you had better put some in so we can all ogle your new toy machine.....
Its not really a bottomless hole, you will run out of space eventually......
Just don't tell her that next will be a mill.....and a shaper.....surface grinder.....a bigger lathe......a bigger shed:D

[leroy]

OK here it is, it was fun getting it out of the box and up on its stand, so now the journey begins.it feels a bit stiff to start with, I cleaned all the preservative off and reoiled exposed parts with chainsaw bar oil ran the carriage back and fourth a few times and its starting to move a bit more freely,the crossfeed feels very tight and jerky so I'll work on that next.
a couple of photos.

[Stustoys]

Congrads on your new lathe.
Now you just need to get it level :D

Stuart

[PDW]

Hi PDL, Thats a nice looking boat,a bit more traditional deck layout than mine, reminds me of the original,how did you rig it, one or two masts? I remember reading about those rings in France, a bit beyond me.I've been setting the lathe up on its stand tonight, had to strip most of the bits off it to get a sling on that would balance the heavy thing, managed in the end.
I bought a few tools from H &F to get me going, will start looking on line now for the rest,
my wife says its all starting again just like the boat its like throwing money into a bottomless
hole in the water:U

She's absolutely correct. So what? Reminds me of the time mine asked me why I needed a 5th 22LR rifle. My answer was that I didn't need it, I wanted it and I could pay for it so I was having it. No further justification required.

The hull is a Colvin Witch design junk schooner rig. 11.995m (hey, I wanted to stay under 12m and I did - just) LOA not counting bowsprit in a tabernacle. Big toy to occupy my time and give me an excuse for buying more tools and playing with the ones I have. The only other useful purpose it serves is the same one all pleasure craft serve - keeps the money flowing in the economy. Not finished yet so there's plenty of time to enrich the likes of Whitworth's and the local stainless steel merchant.

Do take a look at the multifix type tool posts when you decide you need a QCTP. They really are very good.

PDW

[BRADFORD]

OK here it is, it was fun getting it out of the box and up on its stand, so now the journey begins.it feels a bit stiff to start with, I cleaned all the preservative off and reoiled exposed parts with chainsaw bar oil ran the carriage back and fourth a few times and its starting to move a bit more freely,the crossfeed feels very tight and jerky so I'll work on that next.
a couple of photos.

Congtats on your purchase

As with most Chinese lathes it will most likely require a bit of tweeking and tuning to get right, but once you get there I'm sure you will be very happy with it.

I have the exact some lathe and my only real complaint is the circlips that hold the change gears on the shafts, they are too fiddly and a bit of a pain if changing the gears a lot. I'll go for months and not change them, but just lately I've been cutting quite few different threads and the circlips are starting to iritate me. Will have to put my thinking cap on and dream up an alternative.

[barkersegg]

Leroy,

Congrats on the new lathe......I notice you purchased the H&F stand package as well....most users including myself find it way too low for continued use so you may have that problem also if you're more than 4' tall.....:D...there are lots of posts on setting up and mods to your lathe on this forum which will help you...just a comment on your photo of slinging it in position.....if it came with the 3 jaw chuck mounted, I was told that you can hang a sling under the chuck and another at the tail stock end and it will balance...it does actually but I found it easier to slide off the tail stock before slinging - makes it easier to set up and level especially when using the hoist.

I fabricated a swivel hook that fits under the ways and use that as the second lift point rather than roping around the ways - you can position it anywhere under the bed to get your balance...it is easy to knock up and greatly assists in manoeuvring the lathe - if your interested, will post a piccie.......hope that helps.............Lee

[morrisman]

Do those lathes have a hardened bed ? The tail stock looks nice and chunky . Did you get all the bits .. steadies and so on ? I guess it will do both imperial and metric threads ?

Mike

[leroy]

Hi Mike, I have to say yes to all those questions, bear in mind this is the first time I've laid hands on a lathe so its a steep learning curve, I did a little trick I read about online, I lined up the spindle dead centre with the tailstock dead centre holding a razer blade lightly between the two and then rotated the spindle by hand, the blade stayed in place so I believe that means its lined up well, straight out of the box,