Timber for Bearings

[electrosteam]

I have been a member for some time, but exclusively posted in the Metalwork forum.

I need some advice on timber to use as a bearing for a machining application.
The standard English texts on machining refer to Lignum Vitae as the timber to use for such applications.

Can any of the woodworkers provide a source for Lignum Vitae sized about 50 x 50 x 50, or an equivalent ?
Preferably near Penrith, west of Sydney.

Thanks in advance for any suggestions,
John.

[RETIRED]

Trend timbers may have some. Trend Timbers (http://www.trendtimbers.com.au/) A little far away I know but......

[Dalboy]

Try looking for some old Bowls balls as they were made from Lignum Vitae

[dr4g0nfly]

Even here in the UK we look out for Bowls for the wood. However another source can be boat restoration yards. Lignum was used as a water-seal bearing for the propshaft of old boats.

[hughie]

You will find that most of the suppliers are overseas. These days its not used much in this country for bearings, plus its not so common as it used to be.

Heres a post from a previous discussion, about an Australian equivalent
http://www.woodworkforums.com/f8/lignum-vitae-187/
Vitex lignum-vitae - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitex_lignum-vitae)

Lignum-Vitae-Bearings (http://lignum-vitae-bearings.com/)



Genuine Lignum Vitae (guiacum officinale from Griffin Exotic Wood (http://www.exoticwood.biz/lignumvitae.htm)
Exotic Hard Woods | Specialist Timber - Lignum Vitae - Palo Santo wood (http://www.exotichardwoods.co.uk/Woods_List/Lignum_Vitae-PaloSantowood.asp)
Lignum Vitae Timber Suppliers - UK Hardwood Timber Merchants (http://www.smeetimber.com/species/lignum_vitae.html)
Lignum Vitae : Ockenden Timber, Specialist Woodturning & Carving Suppliers (http://www.ockenden-timber.co.uk/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=89_97_286)

[electrosteam]

Thanks guys for all the help.
Once I have sorted out my application, I will post the results here.
The alternative to timber is some sort of plastic, but I am keen to try the traditional approach.

,
Trend Timbers is about 30 minutes away, I will definitely check them out, they may have a 'good enough' equivalent.

John.

[Paul39]

In the US oil soaked maple is used.

Wood you believe bearings? | Machine Design (http://machinedesign.com/article/wood-you-believe-bearings-0520)

Woodex Wood Bearings for Snowblower Augers (http://www.woodexbearing.com/casehistories.php)

[wheelinround]

Trend timbers may have some. Trend Timbers (http://www.trendtimbers.com.au/) A little far away I know but......

I 2nd that Trend had stock last Saturday.

[Bushmiller]

Lignum Vitae is one of the legendary species of timbers. It's properties are indisputable for hardness and it's self oiling capability the two of which have led to it's use as a bearing material particularly in marine applications.

I noticed from hughie's very informative post of references that it is quoted as being the densest of timbers. That is not quite true. The author of that comment probably doesn't know that the island of Australia was discovered a few years back and has a number of more dense timbers :cool: .

Gidgee, for example, has an ADD of 1330Kg/m3 compared to Lignum Vitae at 1200Kg/m3. Cooktown Ironwood is another heavier species, although only just.

I did find a reference to Crows Ash and Forest Red Gum being alternative timbers for bearing use, but it did say for use in lightly stressed situation and no mention of marine application. Clearly Lignum Vitae is a stand out material for bearings.

John

I have never used LV but I did notice in my research that it splits easily tangentially but is resistant radially. I suspect with modern turning tool steels it will turn beautifully. I will be interested to hear what happens.

Regards
Paul

[TheNutter]

When we bought the place that we are on I inherited a number of machines with low speed shafts running in jarrah bearings. The shafts had a fair bit of weight on them (almond screens). Some of them must have been there for 30+ years. Worked well and easy to get.

Regards

Ian

[Mr Brush]

Trend Timbers usually have some LV, but I've only see very small pieces there recently - no bigger sections. Its on one of the tables with all the other timber #### like ebony.

Just wait until you see what it costs......:oo:

I was thinking of buying some thinner pieces for the sole of a timber plane a while ago, but when I saw the price I retreaded rapidly with my wallet between my legs (so to speak) :rolleyes:

[wheelinround]

Trend Timbers usually have some LV, but I've only see very small pieces there recently - no bigger sections. Its on one of the tables with all the other timber #### like ebony.

Just wait until you see what it costs......:oo:

I was thinking of buying some thinner pieces for the sole of a timber plane a while ago, but when I saw the price I retreaded rapidly with my wallet between my legs (so to speak) :rolleyes:

Likely story John.


Nope there was a nice piece there about the size of 6 house bricks yes somewhere in the price range of $300

[Mobyturns]

I have often wondered about the suitability of Leopard Tree - Caesalpinia ferrea for bearing stock. It seems to have the sought after characteristics.

[powderpost]

I built a wooden chuck for turning elliptical shapes. For the bearing surfaces I used cooktown ironwood that had liberal coatings of lanolin grease. It worked well but did wear a bit, but then it was exposed to shock loads not regular consistent loads. The first attempt was with spotted gum bearing surfaces, also coated with lanolin grease. they didn't wear as well as the cooktown ironwood.
Jim

[Big A]

50x50x50? Millimetres or centimetres? If mm, look for an old Comet windmill. They had wooden bearings in the head. At least ours did 40 years ago! Probably best if it is on the ground though.

Instead of the old "Hope this is of use to you", I am confident this did not add much to the discussion at all:U.

"A".

[Paul39]

A couple of days ago a friend gave me a 7 foot chunk of red oak 4 X 4 (100 X 100mm). I made a mushroom of a piece of it as a thank you gift.

The hardness was somewhere between concrete and granite. This would make fine bearing material, and two pieces will be used for slow speed grinder bearings.

I think any of your close grained AU hardwoods without silica would serve you well. Those that take up silica, as our locust here, are likely to wear the shaft.

[woodwork wally]

[QUOTE=Paul39;1578281]In the US oil soaked maple is used.
]
I can remember as a kid 60 years agao a whitemetal bearing on a saw bench got way too hot and disintegrated and the old boys pulled it of a made a redgum bearing block and gave it a soaking in molten lard and fitted it and finished the week {1.5 days ] with that:2tsup: and the guys poured a new white metal over the weekend . dad reckoned she'd have run a few weeks with the lard kept up to it :) cheers ww.wally

[rsser]

As per Jim, I would've tried Spotted Gum first. The bits that've passed through the workshop have been relatively oily.

Cp. Paul, what's been labelled as Red Oak downunder that I've turned wouldn't do the job. It was easy turning. That said, its roots weren't in sand.

[clear out]

When I was an apprentice at Garden Island we used lignum for the sub shafts.
Cut it into long segments that went around the shaft.
Comet used be to just down the road from me here in Concord and I cut up some blocks of red gum with an interlocked grain which they used to soak in old sump oil for 6 months before turning it to final size.
It was 150 x 150 and quite short,they had injured 2 workers trying to chainsaw it. The Wadkin PK ate it.
I had some off cuts somewhere in the shed also had a pice of lignum but it was from a slip and roughed out similar to how we did the sub bearings.
H.

[Paul39]

Cp. Paul, what's been labelled as Red Oak downunder that I've turned wouldn't do the job. It was easy turning. That said, its roots weren't in sand.

Here is a chart showing the densities of North American Timber.

http://www.nrs.fs.fed.us/pubs/rn/rn_nrs38.pdf

It shows the weight per cu. ft. of sugar maple that is used for bearings as 39.3 lbs., Southern Red Oak is 36.8, Osage orange is 53.

I'll bet there is one for AU timber published down there.

[rsser]

Yes. Bootle's book lists averages but there's a deal of variation with some timbers.

There's some online data here: www.timber.net.au - The Australian Database of Timber - Species (http://www.timber.net.au/index.php/species.html) Timber Plus Toolbox, Selecting timber, Characteristics of timber, Density Table (http://toolboxes.flexiblelearning.net.au/demosites/series13/13_05/toolbox13_05/unit9_selecting_timber/section2_characteristics/lesson7_density_table.htm)

Hardness or Janka ratings are also relevant:

Wood Species Janka Hardness Scale/Chart By Common/Trade Name A - E (http://www.morlanwoodgifts.com/MM011.ASP?pageno=207)
BobL's extract from the above for Aussie species: Timber Hardness ? [Archive] - Woodwork Forums (http://www.woodworkforums.com/archive/index.php/t-120599.html)
www.timber.net.au - The Australian Database of Timber - Species (http://www.timber.net.au/index.php/species.html)