Irish grind on a bowl gouge

[nz_carver]

Ok so I was watching YouTube and seen a bowl gouge with a Irish grind on it
it was used to rough shape a bowl and seemed to make short work of it

I have a P&N bowl gouge what I'm thinking of changing the grind on is like to know can the Irish grind be done my useing a Tre Gind? And what number is it??

[RETIRED]

Some P&N bowl gouges do not lend themselves to an Irish Grind well.

You end up with a point on the nose instead of a curve and you have to fiddle a bit..

I generally hand shape them and then set the jigs to that shape.

Not much help on the settings I know.

[Mobyturns]

Some P&N bowl gouges do not lend themselves to an Irish Grind well.

You end up with a point on the nose instead of a curve and you have to fiddle a bit..

I generally hand shape them and then set the jigs to that shape.

Not much help on the settings I know.

Plus the flute isn't that well centered in some P&N gouges!

[NeilS]

Some P&N bowl gouges do not lend themselves to an Irish Grind well.

You end up with a point on the nose instead of a curve and you have to fiddle a bit..



+1

[nz_carver]

Well looks like in buying a Robert Sorby 3/4" Bowl Gouge when
Jim opens in the new yr
Mmm new tool wipes drool away :U

[Cliff Rogers]

Get a Henry Taylor HS1, my favourite.

[RETIRED]

Ditto.

[Pat]

Or get one of these (http://www.packardwoodworks.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Category_Code=tools-ellsw-gouge)


I've got one set up, if you want to try before you buy.

[rsser]

The milling tracks on P&N can be a pain to take out, to get a clean edge.

And yeah, while two smaller P&Ns are essential parts of my kit, they're decidely U-shaped in the flute. And the transition from the bottom to the sides is not exactly smooth. But with a bit of fiddling they can be freehanded on a platform to pull the wings back. That said, those wings don't get used for shear scraping.

And nz_carver, dunno why you want a tool that big. A few members here like them but half or 3/8 inch will do plenty of damage to the wood. Go 5/8 if you do a lot of shear scraping or need a long overhang. Go 3/4 if you have whopping lumps, a big lathe and carbon-fibre reinforced hands :wink:

As with others, I'm a fan of Thompson and HT gouges. AFAIK there's now only one retailer of HT in Aus. that keeps serious stock. Woodturning Supplies for Wood Turning Equipment and Services (http://www.woodturningsupplies.com.au/)

Good folk, good service. No connection other than as a customer.

[nz_carver]

I have a 3/8 vicmarc and I love it
I to am a fan of the Thompson
I've got a sorby of the Sam size so will have a play with the grind on it

as the the lathe size only a nova at the moment but a bigger lathe may be on the cards:o

[RETIRED]

A 19mm bowl gouge will pull just about any lathe up if used to its capacity.

Have a play with the 1/2"-5/8" when you are here.

[rsser]

Yeah, a 5/8" gouge could stop the old Stubby 1000.

[robo hippy]

A steeper V flute does not make a good swept back design as the pointy nose just is too pointy. The more open flutes C shaped or ( don't work well either. The 'parabolic flutes work best for this grind. I did use the swept back grind a lot in earlier years, but almost not at all any more. I am different in that I prefer scrapers for roughing, and the 40 bevel/40 sweep for most of my outside cuts, and down the inside of the bowl, and then a bottom feeder type (60 degree bevel, and almost no sweep) for the transition. They all work. I would guess that most of the 'advantage' to the swept back design is that with the longer wings, you can put more steel into the wood at one time, at least if you have the horse power to handle that much pressure. It also is nice for a dropped handle shear cut/scrap cut in that it has more surface area, so you can start near the nose and finish up on the top of the flute, keeping a fresh edge for most of the cut.

robo hippy

[Mobyturns]

It also is nice for a dropped handle shear cut/scrap cut in that it has more surface area, so you can start near the nose and finish up on the top of the flute, keeping a fresh edge for most of the cut.

robo hippy

Like using a bowl gouge as a skew chisel in planing cut mode?

[wheelinround]

Wouldn't surprise me if the Irish Grind was either done upside down or they ground the handle end :U

BUT here's the true Irish Grind (http://www.woodturningvideosplus.com/irish-grind.html)

[NeilS]

...here's the true Irish Grind (http://www.woodturningvideosplus.com/irish-grind.html)



The extremely long grinds that Steven Russell defines as the Irish Grind are far too long for me. I don't use my gouges for scraping so there would be no benefit there, and by having so much grind along the wings you lose edge real-estate at the pointy end which is the business end for me.

Something closer to the Ellsworth grind (http://www.packardwoodworks.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Category_Code=tools-ellsw-gouge) works for me. When my first Thompson arrived I found that it was almost the exact bowl gouge grind I had settled on for my jig setting.

My main gouges are are all 5/8" with the above grind and do most of the work. For roughing down larger green bowl blanks I will use a 3/4" and I also have a 1" which I would use for the same purpose if it had better steel (Crown Cryo Pro-PM). I have 1/4", 3/8" and 1/2" bowl gouges that only get used on very small bowls or in and around details.

I know that there are some very experienced turners that use the 3/8" bowl gouge for almost everything they do. It would drive me mad, but we all have our preferences.

As suggested above, try a few different sizes, if you can, to find out what works for you.

[Mobyturns]

I think we have to be very mindfull of the reasons why these grinds were developed - because they worked with their timbers! Have a look at Irish turners Glen Lucas's you tube clips. He can pull amazing cuts in his timbers with those grinds. I can't see to many Aussie turners doing similar with our timbers! Saw him in action in NZ amazing turner, who btw will be at Turnfest next year.

Glenn Lucas - Step 2 rough turning - woodturning a bowl - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jalnX5W7VkE&feature=related)

[Paul39]

I think we have to be very mindfull of the reasons why these grinds were developed - because they worked with their timbers! Have a look at Irish turners Glen Lucas's you tube clips. He can pull amazing cuts in his timbers with those grinds. I can't see to many Aussie turners doing similar with our timbers! Saw him in action in NZ amazing turner, who btw will be at Turnfest next year.

Glenn Lucas - Step 2 rough turning - woodturning a bowl - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jalnX5W7VkE&feature=related)

Glenn Lucas site, sounds like an interesting person: Interview with Glenn Lucas for Woodturning UK « « (http://glennlucas.com/woodturning-magazine-jan-2009/)

I think he roughs green timber. Even dry UK timber is not as hard as yours. I understand some of your dry AU timber is somewhere between concrete and granite.

I was given a knotty, split, bone dry, piece of red oak recently. It ate the edge right off a Crown M2 bowl gouge. I roughed with a carbide Easy Finisher and then finished with frequently sharpened scrapers.

[Mobyturns]

Glenn Lucas site, sounds like an interesting person

He is and a very good demonstrator as well, plus he has a lot more years left in him than most of us.

[nz_carver]

I think we have to be very mindfull of the reasons why these grinds were developed - because they worked with their timbers! Have a look at Irish turners Glen Lucas's you tube clips. He can pull amazing cuts in his timbers with those grinds. I can't see to many Aussie turners doing similar with our timbers! Saw him in action in NZ amazing turner, who btw will be at Turnfest next year.

Glenn Lucas - Step 2 rough turning - woodturning a bowl - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jalnX5W7VkE&feature=related)
Yeah that's were I seen it I'm a big fan of his work
im thinking hard if going turnfest if I ever get a email back off the person running it

[Mobyturns]

Yeah that's were I seen it I'm a big fan of his work
im thinking hard if going turnfest if I ever get a email back off the person running it

Well worth going