Turnin turnin turnin keep them lathes aturnin

[Wild Dingo]

WOODWHISPERERS!!! YEHAAAA!! :D Sung to the soundtrack of Rawhide :cool:.. uhoh am I showin me age? at least I didnt say the Rifleman!! :eek: :D

Okay... so I got carried away :o

Anyway between doin other things Ive been goin at the lathe every chance Ive had over the last few days and have now done 4 sorta bowls... sorta... like I know 1 is definantly a bowl... theres one that thinks its a bowl but is more a jug (these are on my other recent thread where I get excited about havin finally got the damned thing sussed... I think? :confused: ) and another who also thinks its a bowl but it needs to grow a tad and then theres the cup... sorta... mug maybe? ANYWAYS!!!

Okay so I need help again... I turn the outside first between centres (I think thats right?) and turn a tenon on the end... then take it out and turn it around and into the supanova chuck then bung that on the lathe... trouble is Im finding its hard to get the damned lip fair one side always seems to be larger than the other which ends up really thin!! :eek: Todays effort was about the best so far in that the lip "appears fair" but really one side is still a tad smaller than the other... Somehow I dont think Im facing the chisel into the bowl part at the right angle or something along those lines would I be right? Is the chisel rest meant to be level with the centre or below the centre to get the lip straight and fair?

Heres the last two efforts... the first two of the small "thinks its a bowl" and the second two todays cup/mug/goblet wannabe ;) I know I know for it to be a goblet its got to be a lot thinner in the midsection but hey whats a peice of plum know! :p

[ozwinner]

What the hell have ya been doin to get a RAWHIDE, ok, dont answer we dont want to know. :eek:

Al :D :D :D :D

[stevesandy]

wild dingo, Same tune same drift

Steve

[DJ’s Timber]

Good onya Dingo, you look like ya starting to get the hang of things. If ya talking about when your turning out the inside of the bowl, the rest should be just below centre

[Skew ChiDAMN!!]

Okay so I need help again... I turn the outside first between centres (I think thats right?) and turn a tenon on the end... then take it out and turn it around and into the supanova chuck then bung that on the lathe... trouble is Im finding its hard to get the damned lip fair one side always seems to be larger than the other which ends up really thin!! :eek: Todays effort was about the best so far in that the lip "appears fair" but really one side is still a tad smaller than the other... Somehow I dont think Im facing the chisel into the bowl part at the right angle or something along those lines would I be right? Is the chisel rest meant to be level with the centre or below the centre to get the lip straight and fair?

OK mate, the height of the toolrest or angle you hold the tool shouldn't cause this... what I think is probably happening is that when you're moving it from between centres into the chuck, it's not being held exactly square and the outside is "off-centre." Sorta like trying to drill a hole when the drill-bit is tightened between two jaws of the chuck and not in the middle. (And don't tell me you've never had that mongrel happen! :p) Rechucking squarely is not easy, it takes a lot of pracitice but don't worry about it... there's ways to work around it. :)

What I like to do is just rough the thing round between centres and turn the tenon to mount it in the chuck. When you move it to the chuck, make sure you bring up the tailstock into the old holes to hold the piece square while you tighten the chuck... then turn the outside and the rest of it.


Heres the last two efforts... the first two of the small "thinks its a bowl" and the second two todays cup/mug/goblet wannabe ;) I know I know for it to be a goblet its got to be a lot thinner in the midsection but hey whats a peice of plum know! :p

For someone who's trying to work it out by himself, your doing alright. I was going to shoot a video of different ways to mount blanks for bowls & things but... well... you know how hard it is when the camera turns tits up. :rolleyes: (Just thought I'd throw a teaser in there. :D:D:p)

[Farnk]

You're welcome to use mine Skew! (camera that is..):D

[Don Nethercott]

You're doing great Dingo.

I mount my piece of wood on the faceplate with 4 screws then turn, sand and polish the base (including either a recess or foot for the chuck to grip on). Then turn it around, mount in the chuck and do the inside.

As for how to use the chisels, get Richard Raffan's Turning Wood book. Worth its weight in gold if you haven't got anyone to show you how. Costs about $45 plus postage, or you could try Book Passion ([email protected])in Canberra, I just got one from them for $20 plus $5 postage.

Keep trying
Don

[baxter]

Dingo,

Skew is on the money about the outside possibly being turned off centre. Have you ckecked to see if the headstock and tailstock drives mate up? If they don't then your outside turning will follow that angle and not be dead centre when you reverse.

Also, have you been turning off right across the end of the tenon? Again this can cause problems when you reverse into the chuck.

Don's use of a faceplate is a sound bowl turning method, however you must make sure that the blank is squared off to sit flush against the faceplate.

Did you get a screw with your chuck? Have you used it to hold the blank at the headstock? Then bring up the tailstock to hold the blank until the tenon is turned. Move the tailstock away and continue with the turning of the outside. If you have a mishap, then you can remount on the tenon and turn the outside off at that time.

Hope this helps.

[TTIT]

Just a stab in the dark here Shane but how long is the tenon you're turning?? It should be shorter than the length of your jaws so that the tenon doesn't touch the face of the jaws/chuck (Hope I'm making myself clear - not much good at explaining these things) :cool:. Your work will centre itself better if the outer face of your jaws rests against the bottom of the piece.:D

At your current rate of production, plum trees are going to become an endangered species in WA soon! :eek: Great stuff mate!:)

[Wild Dingo]

:D Well one is or has become severaly depleated in my ministrations ;) ONTO THE PEAR TREE!!! :cool: damned things got one chance left to fruit! If it doesnt fruit this season... ITS BOWLS!!! :eek: but by then I would have gotten over bowls and moved on to lampstands eh! :D

Thanks for all the tips mates. I checked the two centres today thinking that could be the hiccup but they mate spot on the nose! :cool: so its not that I dont think

When I turn the tenon thing I sorta cut that in first I suppose I could take it of while its in the rough and try to spiggot tenon thing in the chuck eh just to check? Otherwise I only seemed to have muffed the size of the thing with that tiny "thinks its a bowl" thing (went WAY to small and had to glue/screw a round onto it :rolleyes: and THAT could explain that one eh? :o

Okay heres how it goes
Step one I find the centres... not an easy task with some of these peices of timber... but as close as I can get it... then front it to the centres if its OBVIOUSLY out of kilter I take it back to the bench and try another spot then back... and forth and back etc till its as close as... then I stick it on the centres spin it if its close then I tighten up and let rip turnin the tenon/spiggot thing first... do a quick eyebal I need at least 1/4in to fit the nova... then turn it down to a cylinder and and work the outside in to final shape move the chisel thing out of the way sand sand sand finish sand then shellawax and eee the outside... then if the ends are wonkey or have a wrong shape bark whateve... I take it... ahem this is where I differ somewhat

I take it of the lathe and to the workbench! I drill a hole in each centre down a 1/2in or whatever I need to pass this next step... then I slot it into the vice thingy and with trusty jap saw in hand cut that damned end off so I have a nice tenon... if need be I will do that to the top as well (usual scenario) then once done I take it to the chuck and try it in if it fits I set it up... if not I either toss it with the other "scraps" and start again or I stick a round of timber to its bum to make it fit :mad:

Then back to the lathe set it up again put the chisel thing up to it... and this is where another problem I have kicks in... Im not sure if the damned things meant to be IN LINE with the centre or just under and if under how much?... and start to working with the long chisel thing... mmmm okay first up when doing the outside I use the big gouge chisel till cylinder and then use the long thin chisel thing to do most of the shaping and "cutting in" I use the pointy shaped one for cuttin lines and edges of the roundover shapes then a quick slash with the angled thing and thats it... I havent found a use for either the round ended nor the small rounded shaped gouge chisel as yet dont seem to do anything when I face the timber with them to :rolleyes... for the inside I use the long thin gouge for all the work of removing the timber nothing else when done its just sanding by hand... I know one of these things must get those ridges off I just havent been able to work out which one yet!... BUT! I'll get the buggar :mad:

So if I try the next one with the faceplate and that big bolt thing that came with it? (or a couple of screws eh?) ...bring the end centre thing up to meet the wood from the other way sorta between centres? this would be better cause then I guess the faceplate would HOLD the peice while I try the tenon for fit eh?... but does and will that address the issue of the offcentre middle bit the lip thing?... okay so if I also drop the chisel stand a tad UNDER centre that should help or not?... how far under?... PLEASE DO NOT USE MM sorry but Ive got no friggin idea what they are!

Thanks for the hints tips and advice mates! :cool: Will check out that book mate cheers ;)

HEY another question!! What speed am I meant to be using to turn bowls? I mean when I had that first go ages back I think what I did wrong that made the chisel dance and bang clang etc was that I didnt have the chisel ON the ledge thing BEFORE I went to the timber... so the speed thing was set at 1900rpm by the dodad on the lathe... which is the speed I used for the pens... I thought maybe that was too fast but before doing this one today we fixed the dodad so it works again and Im still using 1900rpms... so is that right? Or should I be going slower? didnt feel right when I tried slower but I COULD BE WRONG!!!... I know I know a rare thing indeed but still sorta possible eh? given I know nuffink that is! :o So what speed am I meant to be doing this at?

[Gil Jones]

I really like the first one (left). Nice shape and finish.
Plum is a beautiful wood.

[TTIT]

Looks like step 2 is what's gettin' ya into trouble Shane.:eek: Ya shouldn't need to take the work away from the lathe. Check out the little step-by-step (http://www.woodturnerscatalog.com/email/pdf/bowl.pdf) I found a while back. Guaranteed no mm :( but just make sure you read the little bit in RED. Like it says, there's umpteen ways to hold/drive the blank to start out but from there on the process doesn't vary that much - but definitely no drilling of holes or sawing off of tenon ends etc.;)

If I ever get this bloody buffet for the daughter finished and outta the shed, I'll try and put a pictorial together for you (or hopefully, Skew will get to it first!;))

[tashammer]

there is something really terrifying about his dauntless enthusiam :D

[OGYT]

Dingo, ditto what they said, plus... When I get the tenon cut to fit the chuck, I then rough shape the outside. Turn it around, mount it in the chuck, and then finish shape the outside; this makes up for the screw-up if I fail to get it mounted right in the chuck... (which is often) :o(
Finish turnin' the outside after chuck-mounting just insures it's truly round according to the spindle.
One more thing: If you're takin' a while to turn, or if you're leavin' for lunch or some other sustenance, it could be warping a little on ya.
Just another idea or two....

[Don Nethercott]

According to Richard Raffan's book a bowl 4 inches deep and 10 inches wide should run at about 900rpm on a faceplate. The wider the bowl, the slower you go. Once bottom is turned out and thing is pretty well balanced you should be able to turn up the speed a bit. I usually end up running around 1500 - 1800 rpm

Make sure the chisel is firm on the rest or you will get lots of clatter. I put a roughing gouge into a piece of timber recently and had it about a quarter inch above the rest and it came down so hard on the rest that the rest snapped.

Have you a thicknesser?? - if so run the slab of timber through that first, then cut out the round shape on the bandsaw. The resultant blank should be pretty well balanced with a nice flat end to screw on the faceplate. You don't need the tailstock doing it this way.

Another way of determining speeds is to gradually turn up the speed until it vibrates then back off a few revs (sorry only works with electronic speed thingo - couldn't do this with my old Woodfast but just got a Vicmarc VM100 with variable speed - never thought I would need variable speed until I tried one - works like magic).

When you cut your foot it only needs to be about 3mm (oops 1/8 to 3/16 inch) but undercut it a little to match the angle of the jaws - this will help it hold better.

Keep trying

Don

[Skew ChiDAMN!!]

Lathe speeds an iffy thing. The size of the blank makes a big difference, and whether it's balanced or not. If it's not balanced, always start slow and increase speed only after it has been roughed to balance. But size isn't the only thing... the hardness of the wood, the grain, etc., etc. all have some effect on the speed a piece should be cut at.. For example, if a piece of wood is prone to tearout no matter what you do then try speeding the lathe up or down a bit.

Here's a table of the lathe speeds that I use as a general rule of thumb for the speeds to start turning at... I change the speed as I go depending on how well the timber is cutting. It's not based on anything "scientific," just my own personal experience on safe starting speeds. [shrug]

Faceplate turning:

<8" diameter = 1000rpm if <2" long, 750rpm if >2" long
8-12" diameter = 750rpm
>12" = slowest speed possible.

Spindle turning:
<1" = flat out. :)
1"-2 1/2" dia = 2000rpm if <6" long, 1500rpm if 6"+ long
2 1/2"-4" dia = 1500rpm if <6" long, 1000rpm for 6"+ long
4"-8" dia = 1000 (<6") or 750(6"+)
8"+ = 750 or slowest speed possible.

[Touchwood]

Richard Raffan's Turning Wood book.

Wild Dingo ... believe this one was in the Bunbury library if that is of any help ... if it's not there, they'll get it back for you

JD

[Wild Dingo]

Cheers all!! :cool:
When I get back I will refresh my memory of this thread and have at it again!! And Gil? Thanks the info email came in this evening havent had time to go through it and probably wont till I get back leaving Wednesday lunch time (count on 2 weeks) then its hell for leather! ;)

Well after Ive had a burst at sharpenin the sodding chisels that is... they are now SERIOUSLY BLUNT!! dropped on on me bare toe when I went in there this evening and it just bounced of! No bruise no slicing trickle of red stuff nothin... blunt as ol larry as they say :o embarrassing admission I know but hell Ive no flamin idea how one does that! I think the email had a link to some info in that regard but really I havent had time to go through and check them out :(

Anyway mates thanks shiploads! :cool: