Do I need a table saw? - complete amateur

[NoTalentSteve]

First of all, I'm a complete woodworking novice. I'm an IT professional and woodworking has only just come into my life.
I'm in the process of building a cabinet and need to construct a control box that's about a metre wide.
Anyway, I need to make some cuts into timber that require a 6 degree tilt on the blade, and a 45. I made a quick image to show what I mean. Not too informative, I don't suppose. :) It shows how the timber would have to be cut as it lays on the table.
Friends have suggested just using a power saw that can be angled but I'm not sure I like the idea of trying to run it along a line to keep it straight. I guess I'd need to clamp a straight piece along side it to act as a "fence" (right word?)
So, I could buy a power saw or a table saw. Reading these forums I like the sound of the 10" MT-250 ($379) from Carba-tec, except that the salesman says I'd need a dust extractor to go with it. Could I get away without it for VERY light use?
Or, would a power saw be more useful to me, even though I'd need to mess about a bit to get the cuts staight?
Any help/advice/insults would be gratefully accepted. I can skim through a computer catalogue and tell the good from the bad but woodworking is a new and frightening world :)

[TOMARTOM]

This can be achieved with a

No 4/5 Handplane(not powered)
A straight piece of wood as a guide
A protractor (newsagant)
A Circular saw
A sliding bevel
A piece of sandpaper

If you buy the plane second hand and the cheaper lines of circular saw you could probably get away with $80-$100.

Hope this helps

Regards Tony

[TOMARTOM]

PS, Let me encourage you on your new found love in woodworking, and I am sure with perserverence you will achieve more then what you thought possible.

I am reminded of a story in TEC about 11 years ago where there was a bloke who was a danger to all including concrete, He was always finding it hard to pair up and no one would go with him to the pub in lunch breaks(his driving). Although it was best he no longer stayed in the course or should I say that it became evident that one of us may not finish the course, he was offered an apprenticship with a lawn mower shop, fixing small engines, with perseverence I am sure he is a very competant engine builder.

Gee we had some fun times though

He really was a top bloke,, just a little dangerous.


regards Tony

[Sir Stinkalot]

There is only one real answer to this one ......

Dont touch the hand tools ..... go out and buy the Jet cabinetmakers saw ($2K) .... make your cabinets and then give the saw to me !!!! :D

This has the advantage of very accurate boxes ..... and makes me happy. :D :D :D

[Rocker]

It is impossible to answer your question without more information. If you just plan to make the one cabinet, then it is not worth your while to buy any power tools - you could do the job with a plane and a tenon saw. However, if you feel that you may well want to make a lifelong hobby of woodworking, then go ahead and buy the best table saw you can afford.

Be warned though - assembling the tools for a well-equipped workshop is not cheap. You can easily spend $30,000, and that would buy quite a few pieces of furniture. On the other hand it is a fascinating hobby, and with persistence you can acquire the skill to build distinctive heirloom pieces, which will last for generations. If you are really good, you may even be able to make a living from it, although relatively few manage to do that.

[NoTalentSteve]

I don't plan on making a career from this but I like the idea of building things myself. I can see myself constructing such uncomplicated things as a VCR/DVD hutch or something to tuck my amplifier into so I can put heavy things on top of it.
I am willing to go for a table saw under $400 or a circular saw of some kind. The table saw seemd like a good idea as it looked the eaiest to work with. However, a circular saw takes up far less room.
I can also use this project as an excuse to buy some toys :)
It won't be heavy use at all so maybe a circular saw is the way to go. If I go in this direction, is a saw under $200 going to be more trouble than it's worth or quite reasonable for my minimal use?
Thanks again for taking the time to respond.

[mat]

Steve
You will encounter problems with both saws that you mention. Getting a long straight cut with a circular saw takes skill. Using a fence only eliminates wander in one direction. You could try two fences that the saw foot travels in but this is not as easy as it sounds as they both have to be perfectly parrallel to get a good cut. There are good expensive guides like the Veritas guide but you are adding the bucks. Cutting large pieces on a small saw table is also asking for trouble. You can add extensions yourself but again more work. also the guides on these small saws are not the best for large pieces either.
Sorry to be pesimistic but it is better to know the pitfalls than to spend the bucks and then find you don't get the result you want.

Don't forget the option of getting some of the more difficult cutting done at a cabinet shop or good hardware store and do the rest yourself - maybe a good way to start.

The other option is to use a compound mitre slide saw for narrow panels and then glue together. I have done this quite a lot very sucessfully with little skill.

[ndru]

Originally posted by NoTalentSteve
I can see myself constructing such uncomplicated things as a VCR/DVD hutch or something to tuck my amplifier into so I can put heavy things on top of it.


This is how I started out! Be very careful here - you may get a reputation of being "handy". Once SWMBO detects any whiff of talent your "to do" list ballon and you're weekend wardrobe will consist of nothing but flannel shirts and tracky dacks with one hole in the knee. Even worse, you may end up like poor doorstophttp://www.click-smilies.de/sammlung0903/grinser/grinning-smiley-028.gif

[Wayne Davy]

Steve,

I have the MT-250 (well the Timbecon version - same thing) and, while it is not in the same league as the big saws, it does the job quite well. It's actually not all that small really, especially the table top and has a quite decent Induction motor. The Fence is a bit fiddly - mainly getting it to lock in dead straight but, once you are used to it, its Ok.

If you go for the MT-250 (or any Table Saw), I do agree that you may need some in/outfeed support if you are cutting large/long pieces but this can easily be solved by buying one or two Roller Stands or make some yourself (search the forum for ideas or check out disposal stores like The Warehouse).

Lastly, Carbatec have the MT-250 on special at the moment for $339! (check out the PDF special on their site)

Whichever way you go, good luck and welcome to the wonderful world of woodworking :D

[GCP310]

Look in the yellow pages for cut to size people or even take your cutting list to bunnies (bunnings) to get youself going in the world of woodworking. That way you can buy quality power tools as you progress in skill.

Many small cabinetmaking shops will gladly run the items you need for cash, and they can even edgeband the edges.

I have access to a cnc router and computer beamsaw at work so
im pretty spoilt when it comes to running gear thru.
but when i am at home i have made up a tablesaw using my circular saw mounted upside down on a peice of 25mm MDF.
I have created a fence using aluminium C channel and even routed in steel rulers for calibration. Its a start for me, and if
i leave the place i work at now, then i may consider a proper tablesaw

[derekcohen]

Welcome Steve

Given a choice of a circular saw and a tablesaw, at your stage of woodworking, I would go for the MT-250. However, before you use it read a good book on tablesaw use. What you especially need to know is about safety issues.

Watch out - you are stepping onto a very slippery slope! This little hobby of ours is quite addictive and soon you will be buying more and more tools. Don't be alarmed by this - you'll soon discover.... eh, believe .. that that this is normal behaviour.

Many on this BB know of my love for hand tools, such as planes. I am not going to recommend them to you at this stage, other than to try and get a decent Block Plane (such as a Stanley #60 1/2) and a set of chisels (the blue Record set is a great first purchase - about $60 for 4). The work you seek to do is less about crafting joints in solid timber and more about cutting and joining sheet goods.

Hand tools require sharpening, and this is another area to master (in addition to the basics of cutting boards to size). Lastly, a 1/3 sheet orbital sander (GMC is just fine, approx $50) would be sufficient to set you up for now.

Most importantly, write in to us here if you have any questions at all.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[NoTalentSteve]

Wow, excellent advice - thanks everyone.

Wayne Davy - does your MT250 need dust extraction? The salesman said I'd need it to a certain extent but I hate the idea of throwing another $200 at it. Would it run alright for small jobs if I paid attention to it and brushed dust away if it collected?
The lengths I'll be working with would be about 1200mm maximum MDF (well, until someone decides I need to tackle bigger jobs! :) ) so I guess this would be manageable with either the circular or bench saw.
Arrgh, I thought this would be an easy choice to make! :)

Actually, if I can buy the MT250 for $339 then I think I'm sold. And I'll pick up a safety book as suggested. I don't much fancy losing fingers.
I already have a power drill (Ryobi), orbital sander (GMC - I figure that the 2yr warranty and tiny amount of use will make it $50 well spent) etc but am very light-on for hand tools beyond screwdrivers.
I was thinking of maybe picking up a job lot at an auction or something. I've always thought that the older hand tools seem better than a lot of new gear.

[Wayne Davy]

Steve,

Yes it does need Dust Extraction as the Blade is sealed under the table and it has a 2.5/3" dust port (which is way to small btw). With mine, I took of the side plate covering the blade and then put a new plate with a 4" outlet under the whole saw.

With this saw, if you don't use an dust extractor, the chips/dust will fill up inside the saw blade shroud. You could get away with an old Vac for a little while but I would think about a proper D/C at some stage if I were you. (Search the forum for 'Cyclone').

btw: Don't even think about removing the blade cover plate so that the dust just falls out the bottom. This would mean that the Blade would be exposed (admittely inside the cabinet) and someone might be silly enough (i.e. kids) to stick their fingers in there. If you do, make sure you put a new cover underneath the whole saw like I did.