Another "mistaken identity" turning timber

[robutacion]

Hi everyone,

A few days ago, I went to see my vehicle mechanic (30km away) for a vehicle service appointment + a few other "noises" I wanted him to identify, and while he was having a look at the vehicle with the engine still going (outside), I spotted a pile of wood 30 meters away on a open patch near a large pile of black ashes. After he finished looking and with the engine now off, I asked, "what sort of timber have you got out there, in that pile?) he said "pine!". I went and had a look, cause it didn't look like pine to me at that distance, I didn't have to get far to see that it wasn't pine but, what was it?. Got closer and moving some of the small logs around, I still wasn't able to identify the timber but I could see that has been cut a long time ago (very dry), with the timbers seating on the ground already getting rot, still lots of logs were looking promising for turning. I walked back to the mechanic and said, "that ain't pine, where did you get it from?" he said, " from the neighbour next door", pointing the finger to a place about 60 meters away!. I could see lots of pines, but that wasn't one of them for sure.
I asked if I could have some (about a full small trailer all together), he said, " but that is my firewood for the get together with my mechanics after work!" OK I said, no problem, I get as much as I can in the back of the waggon now, don't burn any more of it, I will bring a trailer full with a mixed firewood (pine-gum) load, on the 19/11 (day of the vehicle service), unload it on that spot and take the rest of the mastery timber back in the trailer, "is that OK with you?", I said! he replied, "yeah, that should be ok, is only firewood...!).

Is still a bit there, but I believe I got the best logs from the top, and from what I could see, that was a large tree, half has been burnt already (some of the biggest pieces...:(().

I split the logs in half when I got home and put them away (stored safely), kept the single piece (fork) out for some testing, and turn it into a bowl this afternoon. Got it in the shed with a coat of sanding sealer drying, and I can tell you, wow...! you will see when I finish it tomorrow!

In the mean time, see if you can tell what it is. It looks similar to the Cork tree I know, bark (all lose, comes out in one big piece) & timber but, I don't know if they exist here in Australia, what I know if that if was cut in the SA - McLaren vale area, and about those "spikes" all over the outerskin?):?

PS: I could have only written, what is it? but I tough the story behind was interesting!:D.

Cheers:2tsup:
RBTCO

[fubar]

cork trees certainly grow in oz bark does seem to be cork but i cant get good enough detail on bark photos to say for sure

[Manuka Jock]

Hi everyone,

In the mean time, see if you can tell what it is. It looks similar to the Cork tree I know, bark (all lose, comes out in one big piece) & timber but, I don't know if they exist here in Australia, what I know if that if was cut in the SA - McLaren vale area, and about those "spikes" all over the outerskin?):?
RBTCO

RBTCO, drop a bit of the bark down the bog , and see if it flushes or floats :D

[OGYT]

Sweet Gum? Maple? Do they even grow in Oz? :D

[texx]

strange the timber its self looks like our beefwood but the bark is not like anything around my parts

[dai sensei]

The timber looks like the Mango I have here, has the dimples and the bark comes off as you describe, but the bark looks a bit too rough.

[Ed Reiss]

Way to go RBTCO:2tsup: ...another nice haul!

[rsser]

The only cork trees I've seen have mid-gray (on the surface) very thick bark ... obviously as the bark produces the corks. AFAIK the bark can be harvested without killing the tree, so presumably the tree is only cut down when it's unsound for some reason.

[Manuka Jock]

The cork oaks that I have seen look like these ones (http://images.google.co.nz/images?hl=en&q=cork%20oak&rlz=1W1GGLL_en-GB&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wi).
That bark looks like pine , so I can see how the mechanic fugured that it was ,
but
there is a cork pine and they look like these (http://images.google.co.nz/images?um=1&hl=en&rlz=1W1GGLL_en-GB&q=cork+pine++bark&btnG=Search+Images)

[rsser]

Yeah, for Vic folk who like to drop into Brown Bros in Milawa, there's one or two flanking the entry to the car park.

[Cliff Rogers]

There are a few natives that have a bark like cork... do some homework on these....

Corkbark Endiandra sieberi
Corkbark Tree Hakea ivoryi
Corkbark Tree Hakea suberea

[funkychicken]

Looks a bit like silky oak from this distance

[woodwork wally]

And if you cant get to brown bros. there is an excellant sample at geelon bot. gardens. and the bark looks very similar but I would have thought maybe should be thicker but then with constant harvesting does cause it to thicken up . Try cutting it and see if it compresses like cork and as someone suggested see if it floats at around 65% out of water . If so back it in as cork till proven otherwise Cheers Wally

[mic-d]

Is it stringybark
http://www.anbg.gov.au/cpbr/cd-keys/Euclid/sample/html/roughbark.htm

Cheers
Michael

[macca2]

It looks a lot like Sheoak.
Very similar bark to the ones that I have see growing in the wheatbelt of WA

[funkychicken]

Is it stringybark
http://www.anbg.gov.au/cpbr/cd-keys/Euclid/sample/html/roughbark.htm

Cheers
Michael


Not even close, we cut heaps of stringybark at work and the bark is very different, very fibrous.

[texx]

the timber has got the Casuarina look about it some type of aussie oak or that family but the bark ???????

[Wizened of Oz]

The bark looks almost identical to that of a Linden tree (Tilia species) that I cut up not long back.
It's also known as lime in England and basswood in USA. There are about 30 species and it's a lightweight wood (favourite of carvers), dry weight about 350-550kg/cu.m depending on species.

[joe greiner]

Most of the pine in the upover has more of a shingle-like bark, not striated like this. The smooth grain suggests basswood, very favoured by patternmakers.

Pine for firewood: Probably OK for outdoor fires at GTGs; not advisable for fireplaces, because the partially burned resin tends to coat chimneys with flammable creosote. Extinguishing a chimney fire isn't much fun, I've heard.

Joe

[Manuka Jock]

RBTCO ,
how about hopping into ya car , and and heading back to where you got this wood from , grab some of the leaves/needles , and any cones/seeds , it there are any still about and posting pics of them.
Also , sand and polish a piece of the wood , as show us that too .

Of the various ways to identify a tree , old bark and weathered wood are not the best .

[robutacion]

Sorry folks, all my yesterdays plans went with the wind, as I had to leave home early today and just got back. With this said, obviously I had no chance to finish the bowl, nor read the progress of this thread, until just now.

Reading all the comments, questions, suggestions, I can see the variety of possibilities, even tough I believe some are totally out.

Anyway, I will try to get a couple more of close-ups of the bark, and some of the finished bowl, hopefully...!

There are tough, a couple of things to which I can comment on, one is the weight of this timber, and I can tell you, is one of the heaviest timbers I've worked with, and unfortunately, is no need for me to go back looking for any other identifying parts of this particular tree, as there is none! the spot where these logs were pilled up, is totally clean of vegetation, grasses, weeds, etc.

If I have the opportunity, the day of the vehicle service, I will try to find out who the neighbor is, and maybe I can get some information on this tree.

Apart from the way the timber look from the pics (obviously, a lot more details is visible is person), for me, everything points to a subspecies of the cork tree, even tough the bark inside texture (middle part) looked different and less "rubbery" look than the real cork.

As a kid, removing the cork from the trees, picking up the "ready" seeds/fruit on the ground to feed the pigs, cutting its wood for firewood (one of the most popular and valued firewood timbers sourced in countries like Portugal), visiting bottle cork factories and other cork by-products, was quite common and normal, but I'm not sure about this one!

Cheers:2tsup:
RBTCO

[robutacion]

Hi everyone,

This is not a joke but, the bowl wasn't finished today either. I only had time to take some pics of it with it's one coat of sanding sealer, from 2 days ago. Just got it on the top of a painted white and yellow cardboard box, under a fluorescent light and use a different camera, without any flash at about 11:00 PM.
The more I look at it, the more I like the mat finish, so I'm now, not sure what to finish it with:~:D! bugger.

I will try to get the close-ups of th bark, tomorrow:? :no:.

What you're reckon?

Cheers:2tsup:
RBTCO

[Ed Reiss]

Hmmmmmmmmm.... is the yellow color from the sanding sealer or the wood itself?:?

[Cliff Rogers]

I think the fluros are confusing the issue, can you get a shot in normal outside daylight?

[Manuka Jock]

RBTCO

Can we have two well lit photographs of the wood after it has been smoothed in some fashion ,
so that we can see the grain , the natural colour of the grain .

one Dry ,
and
one Wet .
Wetted with fresh clear water .

After all , the purpose of this thread is to identify the timber.

The photos should have been posted in the opening post eh :)

cheers mate.


Nice looking bowl too :2tsup:

[mic-d]

Well it's not stringy bark. Those ray planes in the timber look quite casuarina-esque, and might explain why the tree could be confused with a pine. Then again it also looks a bit silky oak-ish so the funky young fella might have been onto something. Although I don't think silky as qlders know it is endemic to the region, it might be a grevillea of some sort.

I'd be happy to call it South Australian Plane tree.

:wink:

Cheers
Michael

[robutacion]

Well it's not stringy bark. Those ray planes in the timber look quite casuarina-esque, and might explain why the tree could be confused with a pine. Then again it also looks a bit silky oak-ish so the funky young fella might have been onto something. Although I don't think silky as qlders know it is endemic to the region, it might be a grevillea of some sort.

I'd be happy to call it South Australian Plane tree.

:wink:

Cheers
Michael

I ain't have a problem with that...! It can be anything you want, but it is not that "plane", it is actually quite "busy"!.

I've spent the afternoon in the shed, to finish this bowl and a couple of other things, but once again this bowl didn't like the finish I though in giving it (one coat of Arganoil, on the top of the coat of sanding sealer, after some "rubbing" with some fine steel wool.
The oil soaked very unevenly "patchy", a second coat didn't improve much so I tried to wash the oil off with some Thurs, and let it dry for a bit.
I'm aware that the oil has compromised the timber surface but, the thurps procedure has produced successful results many times before. The first coat of sanding sealer did work well, and the timber reacted quite ok, obviously I should have finished it with one or two coats more, of the same stuff, savings lots of troubles, and they are not finished yet!
I decided to give it a coat (spray gun) of Floorseal from FeastWatson, normally very efficient in these situations but once again, a surprise was in store for me, which wasn't very nice at all. The first thing I notice was the 1lt tin I purchase recently (finish the new gouges handles), had a thick skin of about 0.5", when the tin was new and I used last only a few days ago. This same product has been used throughout the hot Summer months before, and I never seen a skin on it, today was quite hot but the weather has been mainly cool so, I knew something was on...!:((
I diluted the varnish a little, strain it, put it in the gun and gave it a nice even coat, (normally, is all is needed), but I notice some reaction happening on the inside of the bowl, only. Knowing that the job wasn't over yet, I left the varnish in the gun, as the need for a second coat was evident.
Left it alone for a couple of hours, enough time to dry for a second coat as the temperature was high so, after a quick rub with some 400 sandpaper, grab the spray gun, gave it a good shake and after a quick spray test in a piece of news paper, I started to spray the bowl, when all of a certain, the gun started to "spit" so by the time I've stoped, part of the bowl was looking really bad. Knowing that this stuff dries quick when hot, I quickly open the gun reservoir only to see that the varnish went all jelly, so I quickly grabbed a clean rag and with the aid of thurps I wiped the bowl out, removing all the fresh varnish. Checked what was left in the tin, it looked a lot better than what was in the gun so I clean the gun out and put some fresh(er) varnish on it. By then, the day was almost gone, without losing any more time, I gave it another coat but, it didn't look right for some reason so I simply clean the gun, turn the shed lights off and didn't look back.:C:doh:.
Tomorrow is another day...! we will see... but I'm not that excited, no wonder why...?:~
PS: I will get all those pics, I promise

Cheers:2tsup:
RBTCO

[Ed Reiss]

Sounds like you had a "not quite perfect" day, RBTCO:C

Sometimes best just to sit back, have a couple of cold ones, and just say the hell with it!

Am sure you'll work it out for the better.:2tsup:

[robutacion]

Sounds like you had a "not quite perfect" day, RBTCO:C

Sometimes best just to sit back, have a couple of cold ones, and just say the hell with it!

Am sure you'll work it out for the better.:2tsup:

You can say that, Ed...! but then and again, I had a few good "pointers" today, inclueding putting together a few new tools (sharpeners, circular saw type discs, electric chainsaw chain sharpener, Plus some other small stuff. I'm getting ready for turning season (summer), as winter is mostly spent gathering and preparing timbers. I still have a few trees to cut and bring home, one lot not far from here (beginning of town) I have a dry log of black wattle still attached on its roots, about 1.5m tall and 1'1/2 in diameter. Next is a large Golden Wattle full tree but dead, the main trunk is quite straigh (for a change) is about 5 meters tall, 2' wide. Next is a short log of red river gum, about 1 meter tall and about 4' diameter, next is a blue gum which the top has been cut off some time ago, still on its roots standing up, but this one is going to be a "slabber", as is about 4 meter tall and 4' wide, next are 2 dried willows one still full tree, the other has had the top cut off. There is one more tree, this one is a large fruit tree of some sort, it has died a long time ago, it looks like a berry tree:?.
They all have to come out before the 15/11/08 last day of the burning season. Ouch!
Anyone wants to gives us a hand?:D I need a truck with a hoist on it:U:doh:, wishful thinking...!

Cheers:2tsup:
RBTCO

[Cliff Rogers]

....I'd be happy to call it South Australian Plane tree.

:wink:.....


I ain't have a problem with that...! It can be anything you want, but it is not that "plane", it is actually quite "busy"!......

I suspect you missed the wink. :D

It was one of 'those' jokes that refers to something that somebody else said on a different thread a long time ago. :p

[Ed Reiss]

RBTCO ....it's FOG wood!! :2tsup: (Found On Ground)

[robutacion]

RBTCO ....it's FOG wood!! :2tsup: (Found On Ground)

I hope you right Ed, cause it looks like more a F@%& of a wood to me...!:oo::doh::D

Cliff, you're right, that one went straight over my head...!:wink::p Plane wood...:?

I haven't done anything with the bark yet but I've done a bit of work on the timber itself, hoping that will help to put a name (the proper one, I mean), on it. I have also some close ups of the bowl after the episode of yesterday. The varnish made the repaired cracks more visible, you can see on the inside of the bowl the results of the varnish going off before it had time to spread evenly and dry/cure. On the other hand, the outside shows a spot where a reaction did occur, in between the varnish and some of the Organoil oil, soaked a little too deep into the timber, where it created a "air bubble" normal appearance of rejection.
There are a few options for the future of this bowl, which was suppose to be given as a gift to my vehicle mechanic on the 19/11, and of them all, I'm going for the hardest one but, the one with the better chances to make it look the way I wanted, in the first place, there is, re-chuck and re-turn it, in an out to remove all the coats. I've got still a safe thickness on it, so a couple of millimetres or so less, won't hurt. I will then, coat it with 3 coats of the original sanding sealer, but this time use the spray gun, and a dilution of 0% on the first coat, 25% on the second coat and 50% on the third and last coat. This "I know", it will work well on this timber (going from the way it looked with only one coat on sanding sealer on the first time around), next piece I will try other stuff.

PS: on the pics of the piece of timber, the half (lighter in colour) was sanded with a belt sander 120 grit, and the liquid use was clean water.

Cheers:2tsup:
RBTCO

[Manuka Jock]

I'm going for the hardest one but, the one with the better chances to make it look the way I wanted, in the first place, there is, re-chuck and re-turn it, in an out to remove all the coats. I've got still a safe thickness on it, so a couple of millimetres or so less, won't hurt. I will then, coat it with 3 coats of the original sanding sealer, but this time use the spray gun, and a dilution of 0% on the first coat, 25% on the second coat and 50% on the third and last coat. This "I know", it will work well on this timber (going from the way it looked with only one coat on sanding sealer on the first time around), next piece I will try other stuff.

Cheers:2tsup:
RBTCO

Thats' a beautiful grain that . And it definitely ain't pine eh :U
Its gotta be a hardwood , slow growing by the looks of it .

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=88522&d=1226498096 (http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=88522&d=1226498096)




http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=88513&d=1226498096 (http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=88513&d=1226498096)

If it all comes up looking like this , you can't go wrong :2tsup:

[robutacion]

[quote=Manuka Jock;840409]Thats' a beautiful grain that . And it definitely ain't pine eh :U
Its gotta be a hardwood , slow growing by the looks of it .

Yeah MJ, you're right there...!
In a few more days, (vehicle service day) actually changed from the 19/11 to the 18/11, I should get a little more info from the yard where this tree was suppose to have been cut from. At the moment, I call it the SA corkcass-tree!:D
Does anyone needs/wants some?:;

Cheers
RBTCO

[robutacion]

Hi everyone,

There you have it Manuka Jock, it floats but it doesn't swim...!:D

I wanted to do this myself, just to make sure, and I have no doubt after close inspection of the bark, this has to be a descendant of the European Cork Tree. Timber and bark are indeed a close match to be cork tree, therefore I'm happy to call it SA Cork Tree. If anyone can identify the species in more details, I would be happy to know!

I should make so fishing "floats" out of it, better still, I should have enough to make a complete protecting suit...!:oo::q

Cheers:2tsup:
RBTCO

[Ed Reiss]

Aha...."raft-wood" !:U

[weisyboy]

looks exactly like silky oak to me. :2tsup:

[robutacion]

looks exactly like silky oak to me. :2tsup:

I'm starting to believe that you have a good case, weisyboy. I've seen some pics today in this forum that is making me think! (these pics are attached bellow).

I went to the mechanic today so, I've ask a few more questions, unloaded a trailer full of firewood and picked-up what I left behind from my first trip (discovery trip!:D).

According to the mechanic, this tree was cut a little over 3 years ago, from his neighbour which is in a registered Settlement strip (corridor) used in middle of the 1800 Th's and up to middle of the 1900 Th's. Any trees there, were planted by the settlers at least 150 years ago, and there are not many left from those days but I've ask my mechanic to ask this bloke when he sees it, if he knows what it was, and if is any of them left.

Now, in the 3 pics I took today, of what was left there, I didn't focus on one particular detail that I come across in lots of logs on the bottom of the pile, there is, the shape of those logs are a 3 point star type, and for me they are the base of the trunk going up, very much like some fig trees. This can be a good clue of the species in question, and I can take a couple of close ups of these logs shape for confirmation and viewing.

As I mention above, these pics of Caveman, I hope that he doesn't mind, (from the Silky Oak Gallery, post 9) does get the matter bloody confusing, as this end grain rays are so similar with those on my piece, but the rest doesn't look the same, so it is possible that weisyboy is correct!

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=89084&d=1226999890 (http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=89084&d=1226999890)

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=88513&d=1226498096

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=88295&d=1226331197 (http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=88295&d=1226331197)

Interesting...!:doh:

PS; Has anyone heard of "platypus gum"? I cut a tree on the back of the mechanics shed, and I never worked with timber as heavy as that, leaves Iron bark for dead. I struggle with it but got it done an got some of the bigger timber of of it about 1 +foot at the base.

Cheers:2tsup:
RBTCO

[weisyboy]

judging by the first pics you posted and teh pics of the blocks there is no doubt its silky oak.

[Manuka Jock]

OK guys , hands up all those who thought the answer

'Silky Oak'

was was a simple one .


Silky Oak .....but which one ? :U

-------------------------------------------------------------- :aro-d:

Silky Oak Queensland Silky Oak (not a real Oak.... it's actually an Australian native from the Grevillea family which grows in rainforest areas (and many backyards) in Queensland; also known as Lacewood outside Australia).

The Silky Oak (Grevillea robusta) is the largest tree in the Grevillea family which consists of over 200 different types of tree.
Northern Silky Oak is a medium-sized to tall tree, growing to 40 metres. The tree bears large, woody fruits - up to a size of approximately 12 cm long by 8 cm wide.
Many other tree species are also marketed as "silky oak" - thirty other tree species are listed on the Victorian Woodworker's Association website under this common name.

Cardwellia sublimis (Northern Silky Oak) and Orites excelsa are the two other most commonly cited species.
In the northern hemisphere, it was once a leading face veneer, where it was marketed as "lacewood."

http://www.mrpuzzle.com.au/webcontent94.htm

------------------------------------------------------- :aro-d:

Lacewood
(Cardwellia sublimia)

Botanical Name: Cardwellia sublimia

Other Common Names: Silky oak, Australian silky-oak, Lacewood, Northern silky oak, Queensland silky oak, Selano

Environmental Profile
The environmental status of this species within its geographical boundaries has not been officially determined.

Distribution
The species is reported to be native to Queensland, Australia, especially in the northern coastal areas.

Toxic Constituents
Green wood and sawdust from machining operations have been associated with skin irritation in some individuals.

http://www.exotichardwoods-southamerica.com/lacewood.htm

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ :aro-d:

Lacewood:
A common name for an uncommon wood.
The term lacewood has been appropriated by several species of woods, both as a common and commercial name. For example, lacewood is often used to refer to Australian silky oak and the Brazilian grown louro faixa (Carvalho Brasiileiro.)

But it is also the name given to the quartered European plane from a completely different species, Platanus hybrida. Selected logs of European plane are cut to produce lacewood, a highly decorative wood that is traditionally used for paneling, interiors and fine furniture pieces.

http://www.allbusiness.com/furniture-related/office-furniture-including/162903-1.html

--------------------------------------------------------------------- :!

Its nice to have choices eh folks :D

[weisyboy]

bugger off:U.

who cares what type it is.

next thing you will wanna know how many branches it had.

[Manuka Jock]

bugger off:U.

who cares what type it is.

next thing you will wanna know how many branches it had.

It had five .
Well , six really , but we don't talk about That one , do we :-



:D

[Frank&Earnest]

Well, whatever it is, it is a dead ringer for what Weisyboy gave me as "silky oak" :2tsup:

[robutacion]

I'm not sure anymore what it becomes more important, with this threads on timber identification. There is, no doubt that being able to identify a particular tree species is rewarding and educative but, more educative than that, is really the amount of information shared by everyone of such issues, making this type threads a positive thing to do, and a good learning lesson to most of us, I reckon...!

So, Silky Oak, sounds ok, I'm sad that it wasn't the Cork tree I would like to be, and then and again, the first bowl made from this timber, given as a gift to my vehicle mechanic, yesterday (Tuesday), was signed and named as "Cork tree" so, in some way, it become the Cork tree from the mechanic's firewood pile.

And about the number of branches it had, I will say, a few...!:q

Cheers:2tsup:
RBTCO