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aak
4th March 2009, 10:03 PM
Well, I have the lathe for a while and been thinking, which chuck would be the best to get. I have done nothing fancy at this point, just trying to get familiar with the chisels and various cuts with them. Also, what speed to use for different size of turning. Have checked the forum for old threads on chucks and read the following ones:

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showthread.php?t=41469&highlight=which+chuck

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showthread.php?t=40428&highlight=which+chuck

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showthread.php?t=32484&highlight=which+chuck

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showthread.php?t=16000&highlight=which+chuck

and a couple of others.

To be honest they did not quite help to decide which one is best to get. That is some of the threads are old and as such maybe the chucks have been upgarded since. Also, they were mostly relating to MC900/MC1100 lathes, which I think are bigger than the VL100. If I understood what I read, based on the advice there the SuperNova 2, G3 and Vicmarc VM100 possible the right chuck for the VL100. Of course I could be way off the mark.

So, if I may ask for your advice:

1) which chuck, if money is not an issue?

2) which one is best for value?

3) which jaws I should get with the chuck and why/for what work (remember I am still a total novice)?

4) How difficult/easy is to replace the jaws?

5) What are scroll chucks primarily used for (bowl/plate turning)?

Some additional info to help you:

a) I have no intention to get rid of the VL100 even if I step up at some point in the future to a larger lathe.

b) The VL100 has a face plate, rather small, but it came with the lathe.

c) I also bought an ER25 collet system with 15 collets (1/16" to 5/8").

d) I will not be interested in any cheap chuck (copies) as I intend to keep the chuck, quality is important for me.

e) I have read up on Skew's advise on jam chucks, but I doubt that at present I have the skills/experience to successfully create the right type of jam chuck for any given situation/need.

Thank you in advance.
Andy

Jim Carroll
4th March 2009, 10:46 PM
Stick with the VM100 chuck with maybe the 25mm pin jaws and the 70mm dovetail jaws and the 220mm bowl jaws and as a last resort the shark jaws.

You dont need to get them all at once just build up over time.

These would cover most projects on a lathe of this size.

Give us a call if you require any other info.

Tornatus
4th March 2009, 11:06 PM
G'day Andy

I'll jump in here....

Qs 1&2: Vicmarc chucks are demonstrably the best quality & value for money - it's like any tool purchase, you can't go wrong if you buy the best from the outset; even if it's expensive, you are making a long-term investment. Now, I know the Nova addicts will bleat, but my understanding is that there have been some quality control problems recently with Nova. Whichever you buy, however, as Julius Caesar said "Jacta alea est!" - the two brands are (generally speaking) not compatible, so once you cast your die, you are restricted to the range of jaws available for that brand alone. The only model Vicmarc chuck suitable for your VL100 is the VM100 (or the older "tommy-bar" VM90, which can be a good buy second-hand) - you can mount the bigger VM120/150 models on your lathe, but they are very heavy and will bugger your bearings.

Q3: In my experience, the most useful jaws (in this order) are the Shark, the Long-nose, and the Dovetail. The aggressive "teeth", inside & out, of the Shark make it easy to mount blanks of all kinds, even pieces of wood which are not uniformly shaped, for both spindle & bowl work. The Long-nose are inherently stronger than Pin Jaws, but still offer the ability to grip very small diameter material, and hold it away from the chuck face to make access easier - I use these jaws extensively when preparing blanks for pens and other small items. Dovetail Jaws are very useful in mounting and remounting bowls, and allow you to grip very small bowl feet without damage, if you measure the optimal chuck diameter carefully.

Q4: Jaws are easy to change, but fiddly - and always do it over a tray, so you don't lose the machine screws when you inevitably drop them. Like most of us (regardless of brand), you will soon get sick of changing jaws and will beg/borrow/steal to get another chuck - and another, and another .... Fortunately, you can now buy Vicmarc chucks cheaper in "companion" mode, with no standard jaws fitted, so you can dedicate a chuck to each specialty jawset and not end up with a drawer full of useless standard jaws (I wonder if they have any scrap value??)

Q5: Scroll chucks are extremely versatile and are by no means confined to bowl-turning - they are primarily the strongest, and therefore safest, means of mounting wood in a lathe. You are only limited by your imagination - I recently saw a demonstration of multi-axis turning where two jaws had been removed, allowing the blank to be moved laterally between the two remaining jaws; and I have also seen work gripped by the jaw slides alone.

In short, you will never regret investing in a scroll chuck, and once you have one, you will wonder how you ever managed without it - except, of course, that two chucks are better than one, and three are really useful, and four will greatly extend your capabilities, and five .........:roll:

Go & get chucked!!!

Willy Nelson
4th March 2009, 11:15 PM
In my opinion I reckon the vicmarc is the best. I own 3 chucks at the moment. I only use one. If I buy another chuck, it will only be a Vicmarc, plus the pin jaws.
So Answers
1= Vicmarc
2=Vicmarc
3=Vicmarc
4=easy (just changed to the coles (450mm) 3 times tonight
5= bowls and platters. I turned 3 Jarrah platters tonight, all in excess of 400 dia and 40mm high. The spigot I turn is about 4mm high. I do not recall the last time the chuck let go.
I should stop beating around the bush and come out and say it, get the Vicmarc chuck!!!!!
Regards
Good Luck
Willy

Gil Jones
5th March 2009, 07:20 AM
Andy,
The VM100 is a fine chuck, with a very good selection of optional jaws.

aak
5th March 2009, 09:54 AM
Hi Jim, Tornatus, Willy and Gil,

Thank you for your advice. At this point the VM100 is the clear winner, which is fine with me. I am surprised though that none of the SuperNova fans commented.

Tornatus, I would prefer dedicated chucks too, but at this point it would be an overkill for me. However, I will most likely buy second, third and ... more chuck for specific tasks as I progress.

Willy, I assume the Cole chuck is really the same as the Vicmarc Bowl jaws.

Another question if I may ask:
Are the jaws (your recommendations) for holding the timber from the inside, from the outside or can they be used to hold from either side?

I probably will get one extra jaw set to start with as well as the standard chuck unless the jaws of the standard chuck are really no use. Then I would get the companion chuck with one or two sets of jaws. Hence my question.


Regards
Andy

OGYT
5th March 2009, 11:24 AM
Hi, Andy. SuperNova2 Fan, here. :D I have a little Nova Compac on my VL100 lathe.
But... I'm sure the Vicmarc Chuck is a good one, also.

Enfield Guy
5th March 2009, 11:59 AM
Vermec engineering do a conversion kit to enable the fitting of Vicmarc jaws to Nova chucks. Works quite well. I have just fitted a set of vicmarc long nose jars to a Nova chuck. The only issue was drilling out the 5 mm holes in the Vicmarc jaws to 6 mm. No drama really, drill press, sharp 6 mm drill bit and a vice to hold the jaws. One other thing, in the case of the long nose jaws, the inside screw has a head diameter that is too large. Again, an easy fix. I fitted each screw in turn to the chuck of my drill, tightened firmly by hand so as to NOT damage the threads, and gently filed the screw down to the required diameter.

That having been said, I think the best option is the Vicmarc option. They seem to have a wider range of jaw options and they are an Aussie company manufacturing in Aussie. Not a Kiwi mob manufacturing in China.

turnerted
5th March 2009, 04:51 PM
aak

I would just buy the VM100 chuck with the standard jaws to start off with . After you get more experience using it you will have a better idear of which extra jaws to buy . These chucks will grip both inside and outside . I have a VM100 and a VM120 but I have a VL200 lathe .

Ted

aak
5th March 2009, 09:34 PM
Thank you Al, EG and Ted.

Regards
Andy

artme
5th March 2009, 10:04 PM
Vicmarc - the brand says it all.:2tsup::2tsup::2tsup:

Tornatus
5th March 2009, 10:15 PM
Me again, Andy

Despite my chuck addiction problem, I agree that you should just buy your first VM100 with the standard jaws, as they will certainly allow you to do basic bowl-turning, and can even grip spindle blanks if you first mount the blank between centres and turn a spigot on one end. Don't splash out on more specialized jaws until you have done more research, preferably "hands-on".

I would strongly recommend that you join your local woodwork club, if there is one, or try and find a fellow turner in your area - this forum might provide some contacts if you ask around. If you are starting on a limited budget, like most of us, there is nothing better than spending some time with a person or group who already have the equipment you are interested in and are willing to let you "test-drive" it. That way, you can decide for yourself which jaws, for instance, would best meet your needs/interests, before you spend your precious dollars.

I notice you are just across the bay from Jim Carroll's place at Drysdale, so I suggest a visit and a chat with Jim would be a good investment.

Willy Nelson
6th March 2009, 12:13 AM
Hello Andy
Yeah, I call em cole jaws, but they are the big 450mm Vicmarc bowl holders for finishing the bums.
Are designed to hold either the inside, or the outside. I have yet to use them in expansion mode.
I also have a nova scroll, but haven't touched it since getting the Vicmarc
Cheers
Willy

jefferson
6th March 2009, 08:05 AM
Andy,

I'm a Vicmarc fan too. I have 3 sets of chucks - the 100, 120 and the 150. All work a treat. And they fit both the small and larger Vicmarc lathes, which is very handy. (Not that I use the big chucks on my VL100).

Follow Jim's advice and you can't go wrong. Just start putting some cash away for a VL300!

Jeff

bowl-basher
6th March 2009, 08:32 AM
Hello Andy
Yeah, I call em cole jaws, but they are the big 450mm Vicmarc bowl holders for finishing the bums.
Are designed to hold either the inside, or the outside. I have yet to use them in expansion mode.
I also have a nova scroll, but haven't touched it since getting the Vicmarc
Cheers
Willy
I use the cole jaws at least twice a week the are the best way to finish the spiggot or internal spiggot on a bowl or platter have made several shaped sets of blocks for odd shaped bowl or platter edges:no::no: but be warned the blocks or buttons have a great love of finger tips (about the same as the old feeling of six of the best from the headmaster)
Bowl- Basher

aak
6th March 2009, 08:55 AM
Artme, Tornatus, Willy and Jeff,

Thank you again. It will be the WM100. Based on the advice, one of the easiest decisions I had to make in my life. It will come from Jim, just like the VL100 did. I have not had a good opportunity to get accross the bay to meet Jim face to face, but it will happen sooner or later. Have met though who was kind enough to offer his time and advice and in due course I will give him another visit. I just feel I need to get a bit more experience to ask sensible questions.

At this point I only did spindle turning and it appears to be going OK. I am sure bowl turning will be an entirely different experence when I get to it. As I like to fix things and make stuff for my various projects I need to get into single ended turning, if that is the right expression. I need to make one offs from wood, plastic and soft metals. Hence the need for the chuck.

Regards
Andy

aak
6th March 2009, 09:33 AM
Bowl-Basher,

Our posts have crossed. Thank you, I will watch out for my fingers. I know exactly what it is going to feel like if I am not careful enough.

Regards
Andy

Tornatus
6th March 2009, 06:52 PM
I just feel I need to get a bit more experience to ask sensible questions.

Mate, as I always say to anybody I may be training, there are no dumb questions, only stupid answers! Don't lurk on your own trying to learn from your mistakes - you will only discover how to make even bigger mistakes. Put aside any performance anxiety, and seek as many opportunities as you can to practice under the watchful eye of someone - like the legendary - who: a) knows what they are doing; and b) (even more important) knows how to communicate effectively with a learner. The best experience is guided experience - you will improve your technique much, much faster than trying to learn on your own from books, videos and "trial and error". I would go so far as to suggest that paying for one-on-one lessons from a reputable teacher would be a far wiser investment than, say, a new chuck! :;

aak
6th March 2009, 08:14 PM
Mate, as I always say to anybody I may be training, there are no dumb questions, only stupid answers! Don't lurk on your own trying to learn from your mistakes - you will only discover how to make even bigger mistakes. Put aside any performance anxiety, and seek as many opportunities as you can to practice under the watchful eye of someone - like the legendary - who: a) knows what they are doing; and b) (even more important) knows how to communicate effectively with a learner. The best experience is guided experience - you will improve your technique much, much faster than trying to learn on your own from books, videos and "trial and error". I would go so far as to suggest that paying for one-on-one lessons from a reputable teacher would be a far wiser investment than, say, a new chuck! :;


Hi Tornatus,

I am not worried that the questions I ask could be stupid. Done it plenty of times and not concernd doing it again. Having said that, in my opinion questions need to be asked so that I can put the answers to some use.

Guided experience is without question the best way to go, if and when one has the opportunity (teacher/time/money available). To me the time factor is the biggest problem here to solve. Money I can find for it and it would be very well spent. I am confident a good teacher could also be found not far from where I live who would take me on. However, finding a regular time slot for the lessons is not so simple. Yes, I know it is a matter of priorities.

Speaking of teachers, I agree that is a great communicator with beginners. He made me feel comfortable to ask anything and his answers were simple to understand. He even offered me to have a go turning in his workshop.

For those who have not seen his set up: His chisels were nearly as big as my lathe. The size of logs he turns on his giant lathe were also mind numbing. I remember thinking, if that log were to come off it would destroy everything in its way. Having said that, I am sure knows what he is doing. No, he did not turn while I was there, he was sipping his tee and gave me 100% attention.:2tsup:

I set up my lathe based on his advice when it arrived and taken a good mental note of his advice in general.

was/is very generous with his time and let me pick his brain. I feel I should not abuse this generosity and use it wisely. Hence I feel the need to ask sensible questions during my next visit to him too. For that I need to progress myself.

Regards
Andy

orificiam
6th March 2009, 09:49 PM
Hi Andy First of all congratulation on the VL100.
as for what chuck? VM100 you can't go wrong.
Cheers Tony.:2tsup::2tsup:

aak
7th March 2009, 07:11 AM
Thanks Tony. I am very happy with the VL100 and have a suspicion I will be eqally happy with the VM100 once I got it. Just need to tee it up with Jim.

Regards
Andy

aak
12th March 2009, 12:48 PM
Well, I have a few more questions. I spoke to Jim and discovered that the jaws of the chuck do not fully close like a drill press chuck does. And no matter which jaws I will get with the chuck it is still going to be the case. I will still visit Jim next week once he also has the 25mm pin chuck in stock too and see the chuck and jaws in my hand so I get a better handle on what work I can use them for. However, I have a more immediate need for turning small diameter pieces, so what are the options to do so?

I suppose I could use the ER25 chuck and its collets, but at first I would need to turn (turning between centres) one end to a suitable diameter to allow locking it in the appropriate bushing or in the drill chuck. Then turn the piece as needed and then part it off.

How do you guys do it?

Also, What is the range of movement of the VM100 chuck. That info would help me to determine what minimum and maximum size of timer pieces I can hold with the various jaws.

Another question: are there any other mandrels similar to the pen mandrels but with different (smaller and larger) diameters with MT2 tapers?

Regards
Andy

orificiam
12th March 2009, 05:16 PM
Hi Andy Vicmarc makes the 35 mm pin jaws that I'm sure will close enough for small
jobs 35mm being the outside. why not check Carba -Tek Cataloue 2008.
for small turning a 16mm Jacobs chuck is what I use.
Cheers Tony:):)
PS would love to see some of your turning.

Skew ChiDAMN!!
12th March 2009, 05:50 PM
However, I have a more immediate need for turning small diameter pieces, so what are the options to do so?

What do you call small? I used to turn lace bobbins from 5mm dowels, and still regularly turn small goblets, etc. that'll literally fit inside a thimble. Admittedly I use pin-jaws on the SN2, but the Vicmarcs have a close equivalent.

Smaller than that and a jacob's chuck would be alright... but even then I'd stick with the pin jaws and simply turn that extra mm off the blank. After all, you can turn a faceplate mounted 12" blank down to a toothpick - if you want to waste all that wood! :D


Another question: are there any other mandrels similar to the pen mandrels but with different (smaller and larger) diameters with MT2 tapers?


There are only two std. sizes for a pen mandrel, but there's nothing stopping you from machining the appropriate thread on one end of whatever size rod you want and screwing that into an MT instead.

I wouldn't go smaller than a slimline pen mandrel for the same length though...
you'd be asking for trouble with flex then.

Or you could simply make long bushings of varying diameters to slip over the full length of an ordinary pen mandrel.

aak
12th March 2009, 07:16 PM
Hi Tony, Skew,

I am under the impression that the standard jaws can grip both in compression and expansion mode. The compression mode requires that the item turned has a minimum diameter of 33mm. See also http://www.cws.au.com/cgi/index.cgi/shopfront/view_product_details?category_id=1107146803&product_id=1107456660 I also understand from Jim, that if I were to use the foot part of the jaw then there would be only a few (3-5mm) to grab the piece to be turned, which obviously would not be very safe.


I am also under the impression that the 25 and 35mm pin jaws are supposed to be used in expansion mode only, that is what the 25 and 35mm refers to. Without seeing them in my hand I can't make a valued judgement on their usability in compression mode. Hence I am waiting for Jim to have it in stock.

As far as MT2 taper modifications are concerned, I simply do not have tools like metal lathe to drill and tap a hole into the MT2 and to cut threads onto round stock or to reduce the diameter of a pen mandrel to a size I need. By the way, I would like to have shorter than pen drill mandrels (up to 2" long) and 3mm diameter and up.

The small round stock I was referring to was down to 3mm and up to 25mm. However, either way, I am back to first matching one of the ER25 collets to the stock for the smaller sizes. To my knowledge the collets only go to 5/8". So from 5/8" to 1" I am still without a chuck. Hence the question "how you guys do it?"

Regards
Andy

RETIRED
12th March 2009, 07:19 PM
I think you had better come over and see me Andy.:)

aak
12th March 2009, 07:23 PM
Thanks , I will call you to arrange a time for Sunday or for next week when you are free.

Skew ChiDAMN!!
12th March 2009, 07:59 PM
Good onya, ! :2tsup:

Andy, until you get over there I'll give you some waffle to think about. :wink:

I don't use any of my jaws in "just one mode." I'll even use Cole Jaws in expansion mode under certain circumstances.

Now, it's true that pin-jaws aren't designed to be tightened fully in compression mode, but there are two circumstances where they still work very well that way:

1. Let's say I wanted to make a series of small pieces from 5mm-8mm dowel. I'll poke a length a couple of feet long through the headstock and grip it with my pin-jaws in compression mode, leaving just enough protruding to turn one piece.

When finished, I'll back off the jaws, slide a bit more dowel through, then repeat the process. Of course it has to fit through the headstock for this to work, which is why I asked "how small."

Because the jaws are supporting the wood along the whole length of the inside of the jaw, and because when they're nearly fully closed they're nearly clamping all around the dowel surface, they don't have to be overly tight to grip the wood well enough to work it.

2. I'll occasionally also use the pin-jaws in compression mode for larger pieces, say up to about 40mm diameter. However I prefer to leave the blank square (and it needs to be truly squared, not "sort of square." :rolleyes:) and clamping the faces so the corners protrude between the jaws, preventing the piece from spinning in the chuck.

Best used when only turning short blanks, probably only a max of 50-60mm hanging out of the chuck, unless you're also using tailstock support. And the blank should be pushed all the way into the chuck, so that (again) it's being grasped by the full lengths of the jaws and not just the tips. With the corners stopping the spin, the chuck only needs to be tightened just enough that the blank doesn't fall out. Any tighter is pointless. :)

aak
12th March 2009, 09:43 PM
Good onya, ! :2tsup:

Andy, until you get over there I'll give you some waffle to think about. :wink:

I don't use any of my jaws in "just one mode." I'll even use Cole Jaws in expansion mode under certain circumstances.

Now, it's true that pin-jaws aren't designed to be tightened fully in compression mode, but there are two circumstances where they still work very well that way:

1. Let's say I wanted to make a series of small pieces from 5mm-8mm dowel. I'll poke a length a couple of feet long through the headstock and grip it with my pin-jaws in compression mode, leaving just enough protruding to turn one piece.

When finished, I'll back off the jaws, slide a bit more dowel through, then repeat the process. Of course it has to fit through the headstock for this to work, which is why I asked "how small."

Because the jaws are supporting the wood along the whole length of the inside of the jaw, and because when they're nearly fully closed they're nearly clamping all around the dowel surface, they don't have to be overly tight to grip the wood well enough to work it.

2. I'll occasionally also use the pin-jaws in compression mode for larger pieces, say up to about 40mm diameter. However I prefer to leave the blank square (and it needs to be truly squared, not "sort of square." :rolleyes:) and clamping the faces so the corners protrude between the jaws, preventing the piece from spinning in the chuck.

Best used when only turning short blanks, probably only a max of 50-60mm hanging out of the chuck, unless you're also using tailstock support. And the blank should be pushed all the way into the chuck, so that (again) it's being grasped by the full lengths of the jaws and not just the tips. With the corners stopping the spin, the chuck only needs to be tightened just enough that the blank doesn't fall out. Any tighter is pointless. :)

Thanks Skew,

I found both points above very useful and easy to understand.

Regards
Andy

Tornatus
12th March 2009, 10:22 PM
:whs: Plus - In my first response to your original post I mentioned the Vicmarc Long-nose Jaws. The advantage of these over the Pin Jaws is that they are much stronger, having a "buttressed" base, and so can readily be used in compression to grip small diameter blanks. From memory, they close down to a minimum internal diameter of 6mm.

Anything smaller than that, I would use my Jacobs Chuck, but as Skew noted, you would not want to grip things that small too tightly, anyhow. I must admit I am having difficulty understanding just how small the things are you want to work on - the smallest pieces I have worked on would be lace bobbins, and my Long-nose Jaws hold them quite nicely.

Hopefully, will soon sort you out! :;

aak
13th March 2009, 07:26 AM
:whs: Plus - In my first response to your original post I mentioned the Vicmarc Long-nose Jaws. The advantage of these over the Pin Jaws is that they are much stronger, having a "buttressed" base, and so can readily be used in compression to grip small diameter blanks. From memory, they close down to a minimum internal diameter of 6mm.

Anything smaller than that, I would use my Jacobs Chuck, but as Skew noted, you would not want to grip things that small too tightly, anyhow. I must admit I am having difficulty understanding just how small the things are you want to work on - the smallest pieces I have worked on would be lace bobbins, and my Long-nose Jaws hold them quite nicely.

Hopefully, will soon sort you out! :;

Hi Tornatus,

Thank you again. I have not forgot about the Long Nose jaws, but according to the specs it only closes to the 25mm. See:http://www.cws.au.com/cgi/index.cgi/shopfront/view_product_details?category_id=1107146803&product_id=1107453929. Also, a few of the recommendations were that I should only get the standard jaws first and decide later which jaws to get in addition.

I did not know what lace bobbins are so just looked it up on the net. Their diamater seems to be small just like the items I need and/or want to make, but their lenths is much longer.

You say: "you are having difficulty understanding just how small the things I want to work on". Well they are one offs or a few of the same . they could be as small as 10mm x 10mm x 10mm or 10mm diameter x 25mm long or 25mm diameter x 12mm long, etc. I normally have a good copy I need to replicate or a damaged item I need to recreate. They can be usually made from plastics, soft metals and steel. So what are these small items?

I like to fix and restore things. Have a few different hobbies and for some relevant qualifilcations. I enjoy restoring and/or fixing electronics equipment that beside fixing the electronics also need various knobs, tiny poolleys, rods, extenders that are difficult to find original replacements for.

I restore fishing reels, they usually need new handles (10 to 12 mm diameter x 30 mm long with hole in the middle). I also like to make my own floats. Yes, I can and I buy some, but I like to make them.

I restore musical instruments for over 40 years. Some instrument were made/date back to over 100 years ago. They need tuning peg knobs from wood or bone that can't be purchased. Have made them before without a lathe, but the lathe will make it much easier to reproduce them.

I also make jigs to make my work easier and/or repeatable. They are my design or modifications of other peoples ideas I have seen or read somewhere. Again, they need parts that I need to make.

I know most people have one or two specific areas of wood turning like bowl turning, platter turning, pen turning, etc. that they enjoy doing. I am different, I will make some of them too, but they are not the main reason I got the lathe for as you can see from the above. Sorry if that disappoints some.

Regards
Andy

DJ’s Timber
13th March 2009, 09:03 AM
I'm heading into Melbourne today, so whilst I'm there, I'll pick up some of my gear and take some pictures of my 25mm & 35mm pin jaws and my Long Nose Jaws. Pretty sure that they all have the same internal grip size of which is 7mm I think. The advantage of using the 35mm and long nose is that they also have the inner ring of screws to lock the jaws to the slides whereas the 25mm don't which means that you can use them in compression.

aak
13th March 2009, 09:40 AM
I'm heading into Melbourne today, so whilst I'm there, I'll pick up some of my gear and take some pictures of my 25mm & 35mm pin jaws and my Long Nose Jaws. Pretty sure that they all have the same internal grip size of which is 7mm I think. The advantage of using the 35mm and long nose is that they also have the inner ring of screws to lock the jaws to the slides whereas the 25mm don't which means that you can use them in compression.

Thanks DJ, I appreciate your thoughts and looking forward to the photos. The drawings in the link may not be correct, however, that is all I could go on.

Regards
Andy

orificiam
13th March 2009, 12:27 PM
Hello Andy-- No need to be sorry for turning things that bring Joy to your life,
At our age we've the right to choose .
I turn for a Hobby so I can turn what I like-- no custmers to satisfy.As long as it bring you plesure who cares what others think.--:):)Happy turning Andy.:):)
Cheers Tony.:2tsup::2tsup:

Tornatus
13th March 2009, 04:59 PM
I have not forgot about the Long Nose jaws, but according to the specs it only closes to the 25mm. See:http://www.cws.au.com/cgi/index.cgi/shopfront/view_product_details?category_id=1107146803&product_id=1107453929.

I know most people have one or two specific areas of wood turning like bowl turning, platter turning, pen turning, etc. that they enjoy doing. I am different, I will make some of them too, but they are not the main reason I got the lathe for as you can see from the above. Sorry if that disappoints some.

Regards
Andy

Aha! They've gone and moved the goalposts again! Now that I have looked at the specs on the link you provided, I can see that the latest version of the Long-nose Jaws is quite different to mine (which were purchased about four years ago). They have drilled out the centre for reasons I don't understand, so now the jaws are apparently lighter, weaker and much less versatile. So I take back the recommendations I made about these jaws, and apologise for any confusion caused by the fact that Vicmarc have stuffed up a perfectly good design!

As for your choice of woodturning projects - mate, that is entirely for you to decide, and it is unfortunate if you have gained the impression that some of us were "disappointed" by your choice. I just found it hard to understand from your earlier posts exactly what you were trying to achieve, but now that you have explained the nature of the things you want to make, I am impressed by your dedication to restoration. In view of the range of items you want to fabricate, maybe you might have been better off starting with a small metal-working lathe, which could also be used for wood - but I guess it's a bit late to make that suggestion now! :U

aak
13th March 2009, 06:22 PM
Aha! They've gone and moved the goalposts again! Now that I have looked at the specs on the link you provided, I can see that the latest version of the Long-nose Jaws is quite different to mine (which were purchased about four years ago). They have drilled out the centre for reasons I don't understand, so now the jaws are apparently lighter, weaker and much less versatile. So I take back the recommendations I made about these jaws, and apologise for any confusion caused by the fact that Vicmarc have stuffed up a perfectly good design!

As for your choice of woodturning projects - mate, that is entirely for you to decide, and it is unfortunate if you have gained the impression that some of us were "disappointed" by your choice. I just found it hard to understand from your earlier posts exactly what you were trying to achieve, but now that you have explained the nature of the things you want to make, I am impressed by your dedication to restoration. In view of the range of items you want to fabricate, maybe you might have been better off starting with a small metal-working lathe, which could also be used for wood - but I guess it's a bit late to make that suggestion now! :U

Hi Tornatus,

No need to apologise, in fact I am glad this change of jaw specs got discovered. I could not understand for my life, how on earth I do not see in the specs for the jaw what you see when you are using your jaws. Now it is explained! Different specs!!!

As far as metal lathes are concerned, I have attended a metal lathe turning course a few years ago. To be honest I did not enjoy it even though I learnt quite a bit. A metal lathe is far to much a greasy mess for me. Mind you I only turned steel as part of the course. For plastics I would have not needed to use cutting oil. I did not mind the part of turning, but hated the clean up afterwards. We had to leave the lathes squeeky clean. Not that I see anything wrong with that. I just hated the cean up.

I also turn wooden handles and other larger pieces and really do enjoy using the wood lathe, despite being an absolute beginner. It was the right decision for me to get the VL100. Having said that the lathe is just another tool to do a few tasks far better than any other tool can do. At the end of the day they are bought to make my life more fun and I find a lot of pleasure doing task as well as they can be done. While I do not always achieve that, a quality tool is certainly a good place to start to occassionaly succeed.

I was not disappointed by your comments and saying that others may have been disappointed with my choice of turning were not the best choice of words on my part. However, I know that someimes I find it less than easy to convey my thoughts to others in English. In this case, saying that I needed to turn small objects did not quite convey what I wanted to say. I think most people's train of thoughts are along the lines of what a lathe is usually used for and I did not make it clear that my needs regarding the lathe are different from that. Hopefully it is now clearer where I am coming from.

Before I forget, thank you Tony for the kind words too!

Regards
Andy

DJ’s Timber
13th March 2009, 07:34 PM
Haven't forgotten you Andy, have bought the jaws back home from my folks now, just gotta find the right boxes now. Have only just finish unloading the ute and trailer, so I'll find them tomorrow afternoon when I get home from work and get those pics up for you :2tsup:

aak
13th March 2009, 08:01 PM
Haven't forgotten you Andy, have bought the jaws back home from my folks now, just gotta find the right boxes now. Have only just finish unloading the ute and trailer, so I'll find them tomorrow afternoon when I get home from work and get those pics up for you :2tsup:

Hi DJ,

No Problems, There is no need to rush really. I have a million unfinished projects and another million that I have planned to do, but yet to start. I will not be making any further decisions on this until I visited and then Jim.

Also, as Tornatus said, his Long Nose Jaw is different from the new ones. So I may need to look for a second hand one though it is unlikely that one will turn up.

Regards
Andy

DJ’s Timber
17th March 2009, 10:07 AM
First up is my 25mm jaws of which I have ground done to about 22mm hence why they look a bit different :roll:

99506

35mm Pin Jaws

99510

Long Nose Jaws of which I bought at the Working with Wood & Timber Show from Vicmarc in their clearance bin just last October so there must still be some floating around and no they're not for sale :;

99508

And finally I thought I'd throw this in for comparison as well, a Vermec 25ER Collet Adaptor (http://vermec.tripod.com/PDFs/colletadaptor.pdf) which screws straight onto the spindle. You can order these direct from Enzo at Vermec (http://www.vermec.com/index.html) or alternatively get Jim from CWS to order one in as he does sell some of their gear some I'm sure Jim would be happy to do so, hey Jim :U

99509

I reckon if you're mainly after jaws for use in the compression mode, then the 35mm Pin Jaws should work for if you're not able to source some long nose jaws. As you'll be able to see from the pics I have posted, the 25mm will not work as well in compression mode as they don't have the inner ring of screws holding the jaws down and they will lift if you apply too much pressure.

aak
17th March 2009, 11:25 AM
First up is my 25mm jaws of which I have ground done to about 22mm hence why they look a bit different :roll:

99506

35mm Pin Jaws

99510

Long Nose Jaws of which I bought at the Working with Wood & Timber Show from Vicmarc in their clearance bin just last October so there must still be some floating around and no they're not for sale :;

99508

And finally I thought I'd throw this in for comparison as well, a Vermec 25ER Collet Adaptor (http://vermec.tripod.com/PDFs/colletadaptor.pdf) which screws straight onto the spindle. You can order these direct from Enzo at Vermec (http://www.vermec.com/index.html) or alternatively get Jim from CWS to order one in as he does sell some of their gear some I'm sure Jim would be happy to do so, hey Jim :U

99509

I reckon if you're mainly after jaws for use in the compression mode, then the 35mm Pin Jaws should work for if you're not able to source some long nose jaws. As you'll be able to see from the pics I have posted, the 25mm will not work as well in compression mode as they don't have the inner ring of screws holding the jaws down and they will lift if you apply too much pressure.

Hi DJ,

Thank you for the photos. They help a lot to understand. If all goes well I will visit Jim Thursday.

If I am not mistaken the jaws in the photos are different from the new Vicmarc jaws (every one of them). At least this appears to be the case based on the web published drawings of the new jaws.

Tornatus picked this up first with the Long Nose jaws and it appears to be the case for the 25 and 35 mm jaws too! It seems that Vicmarc has changed the jaws for some reason.

No, I was not going to ask whether you would sell these jaws. I only asked Eliza because she said it was a pain to change them and she bought another chuck.

As far as the ER25 collet adapter is concerned, I have the ER25 chuck that has a MT2 morse taper that fits the VL100 and I bought a draw bolt for it, so that it can't fall out. So my question is whether the following is correct: the Vermec ER25 collet adapter would allow me to use any of the ER25 collets, but without the need to use the ER25 chuck and draw bolt? Otherwise the fuctionality is identical or have I missed something?


Regards
Andy

DJ’s Timber
17th March 2009, 11:33 AM
So my question is whether the following is correct: the Vermec ER25 collet adapter would allow me to use any of the ER25 collets, but without the need to use the ER25 chuck and draw bolt? Otherwise the fuctionality is identical or have I missed something?

That is correct, just a different mounting medium, yours go on via MT and draw bolt whilst mine screw on same as a chuck.

Assuming yours is something like this

99517

aak
17th March 2009, 02:40 PM
That is correct, just a different mounting medium, yours go on via MT and draw bolt whilst mine screw on same as a chuck.

Assuming yours is something like this

99517

Thanks DJ. Yes, mine is like the one in the photo

Regards
Andy