Lets design a clamping jig

[LineLefty]

Here is the connundrum.

I have a good solid inherited workbench made from 3mm steel angle. with a three layered MDF Top. It's brilliant, weighs a tonne.

I have a good face vise but no tail vise. Obviously the traditional tail vise isnt applicable on a steel bench. Now I do a lot of hand planing and I'm having trouble holding the boards in place on the bench top.

A bench stop at one end is not really working, I need the board to be clamped. Yet I'm having difficulty coming up with a solution.

The perfect option would be a row of dog holes with a Veritas "Wonder Dog"

http://www.fine-tools.com/G307968.htm

But for $90 odd dollars in Australia, I'd like to try to solve this myself before splurging.

If there was some way I could screw a threaded rod horizontally throu a 3/4' dowel, I'd be right. A home made wonder dog.

Help Jigmakers!

[Wongo]

Would it work?

[LineLefty]

Thanks Wongo,

I'll give the wedges a try. It would cost me $0.00 to try.

Not sure if it would work for a single row though. I dont usually plane sheets of MDF!

[himzol]

Lefty,

Why go through the trouble of threading a dowel, why not weld a nut ontop of a 3/4 metal rod. Or even buy a cheap G clamp and cut the threaded end of this and weld it onto the 3/4 metal rod.

just a thought,

Himzo.

[LineLefty]

Great idea, but my welding experience and/or equipment = 0

And would the weld be strong enough?

[Sturdee]

If there was some way I could screw a threaded rod horizontally throu a 3/4' dowel, I'd be right. A home made wonder dog.

Help Jigmakers!


Adam, how could I resist a plea for help. :D

One of the projects that is on my to do list is replacing the surface of my workbench and incorporating various hold-downs, dogs and clamping systems based on ¾ inch dowel holes.

Underneath the bench surface I will be placing captive nuts so that you can insert home made clamps with a threaded bolt through the dowel holes to clamp the work to the bench. I have a copy of some sketch plans and description out of an old magazine that shows how to do this and if you want a copy send me a pm with a mailing address.

If you really want to make a homemade wonder dog I suggest that you glue a small rectangular piece of wood onto your dowel and then drill the hole for your threaded rod and use a T-nut against one side of the face of the block. However a more elegant way of doing this is to make the T-nut captive by glueing a small piece of wood against it similar to the way I made the Sturdee handscrew clamps.

If you make it post some pictures.


Peter.

[DanP]

Don't bother trying to weld bits of G clamp to anything, they are cast iron and with out the correct equipment/techniques, the welds will literally fall apart.

If you use a piece of round bar to suit the holes in your bench and have your local engineer drill and tap it to a standard bolt size (suggest no less than 3/8" prefer 1/2") Get a long bolt which is threaded through to the head. Get a small piece of hardwood with a blind hole drilled in it big enough to take the end of the bolt. The wood will protect the work. Simple but it should work. If you use a ratchet to tighten the bolt/clamp you will not mark your bench.

Dan

[Dean]

I think I have the answer if you are willing to spend a little money and order in from overseas.
I've just finished reviewing the Kreg Universal Bench Klamp, which you should be able to mount into your MDF by routing out a place for it.
I'd imagine its probably ideal for your situation, assuming you have a few dollars to buy it. I guess the only downfall is that it is an 'overhead' type clamp so probably not ideal if you were trying to plane thin stock the full length - the clamp has to hold down onto some part of it).
Have a look at my website for the review (its part of the Kreg K2000 pocket hole system review).

It has some awesome clamping potential and I have used it to secure boards for planing without any drama. Plus, its both a permanent and portable solution. You can fix it direct to your bench by routing out a space for it and securing it with screws. You can then remove the clamp assembly and the metal plate stays flush with your workbench. Alternatively if you don't want to destroy your bench, you can fix it to a large piece of 19mm or large ply or MDF and then just clamp down the ply/MDF to your table and make it a portable option. Works great!

Gregory machinery in Brisbane is the Kreg Dealer, but I don't think they stock this particular item. You could try calling and asking them to get some in, otherwise you have to order in from overseas. Price is US$39.99

Hope that helps!

[LineLefty]

Thanks for the suggestions guys, I really appreciate it.

A few points:

1) I've seen the kreg dean it's OK but if I wanted to send 39US plus P&H I'd just get a wonder dog from carbatec and be done with it. I can survie with a bench stop, this problem is in the "it would be nice to have" category whilst my hard earned cash goes to the "absolutely can not get by without it" tools.

2) You say "take the steel bar to your local engineer to get drilled and tapped" Do you mean "Metal Worker" in the yellow pages?

3) Sturdee, your idea sounds good. A wooden contraption will be more forgiving to a chisel or plane blade. I 've read it 5 times and still cant get a good picture, i'll draw a plan.

I nearly had the perfect set up. A brass plumbing threaded t-junction, except the threads didnt extend all the way through.

[DanP]

Adam,

I'm in the country and they do what they call 'engineering' here. They are machinists or in the old terminology, fitters and turners.

Dan

[Sturdee]

Sturdee, your idea sounds good. A wooden contraption will be more forgiving to a chisel or plane blade. I 've read it 5 times and still cant get a good picture, i'll draw a plan.


Adam,

As I haven't made a jig for a while (getting withdrawel symptoms :D ) I've decided to bring the project of making dogs and wonderdogs forward.

This morning I spent about an hour cutting, drilling and sanding the parts ready of assembly which I'll do tomorrow. I'll take photos as I go along, as a pic is worth a thousand words :D , and post them hopefully on Sunday.

Peter.

[LineLefty]

Excelenté! Thanks.

I've just read through your handscrew and other jig posts again. I sincerely apologise for calling your design a "wooden contraption"

Believe it or not, but I've never actually used a T-Nut before, so before I go and ask more questions I'll go and jam some into a dowel and see how they work.

[outback]

Sounds like Sturdee and I are on similar courses re benchtop construction/reconstruction/rehash/rebuild/refit/fix up.
I was looking to simply making dog holes and making home made thingys similar to wonder dogs, but I'll certainly wait to see Sturdees idea, sounds like it might be a go.

[Rocker]

When I saw this thread, I just had to run out to the shed and make my version of a wonderdog. It took about 20 minutes. I cut a 150 mm length of 19 mm dowel and glued it into a hole throught the middle of a 35 x 35 x 60 mm piece of jarrah. I then drilled an 8 mm hole angled down at 3 degrees through the jarrah and dowel; tapped it with a 3/8" thread; cut a 150 mm length of 3/8" threaded rod; fitted a wing-nut and lock-nut and drilled a blind 3/8" hole in a bit of wood to fit to the end of the rod, and Bob's your uncle. it works fine :)

Rocker

P. S. I already own a couple of genuine wonderdogs :D

[Rocker]

Aother pic.

Rocker

[LineLefty]

How did you thread the piece of jarrah?

(Thanks heaps btw I cant believe the response I've had here!)

[Sturdee]

Excelenté! Thanks.

I've just read through your handscrew and other jig posts again. I sincerely apologise for calling your design a "wooden contraption

No apologies necessary.


Peter.

[Rocker]

Linelefty,

Buy a 3/8" tap from Bunnings; drill an 8 MM hole first; chuck the tap in a drill-press, then turn the tap by hand (NOT using the drill-press motor) to get the tap started in the hole. Then clamp the jarrah in a vice, and turn the tap with an adjustable spanner until it emerges through the jarrah. The attached pic shows me starting to tap a thread in a different piece of jarrah.

Rocker

[outback]

Mr Rocker,
Clever clever bastard!

To linel, I have heard in a previous thread about strengthening the thread you cut by using cyano glue. Haven't tried it, but I will now.

[Rocker]

Outback,

It is not necessary to strengthen the thread in jarrah. So long as you don't try to tap into the end grain, the thread will be fine.

Rocker

[ozwinner]

Anyone seen my cat?


Al

[bitingmidge]

Eastie saw it last I think.... (http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showpost.php?p=65247&postcount=14)

Hope all is OK!

P :D

[himzol]

Hi Adam,

As Mr. Kotter used to say "I went away for a while, now I'm back".

If your still looking at buying Mik International have the Wonder dog for $56.71 and the wonder pup for $49.35, they are currently having a sale so check out the web site.

regards,

Himzo.

[Rocker]

If you are thinking of buying, I would recommend paying the few dollars extra for the wonderdog rather than the pup. The extra length is often useful. The same goes for the brass dogs.

Rocker

[LineLefty]

Theres no way I'd spend $56 on such a simple piece of kit. The only reason it costs that much is because of the low volume imports.

In other news, I solve my problem on the weekend. I dont have a photo yet but when I put the rest of the dogs in I will posta photo.

Basically It took a 1inch dowel and drilled a 1inch hole in a small peice of jarrah. glued the dowel into the hole. Drilled a hole through the whole thing (at a slight decline) and then hammered a 3/8 T-nut into the back end of the square piece. A bit of threaded rod, a bit of pine on the end and it works a treat! All I need now is some way to get leverage on the rod (At the moment it's visegrips.


Thanks for all your help everyone. I was going to thread the jarrah but the Sutton tap was about $14 from bunnings and a T-nut was 40c so I thought I'd try that first.

A final tip. Next time, I'll hammer the T-nut in first and THEN cut to size. Ouch!

[Rocker]

Linel,

Why not just use a wing-nut with a lock-nut, as I did? See my previous post. It provides adequate leverage to tighten the rod for clamping your workpiece. The advantage of the genuine wonderdog is its low profile, which means it does not get in the way when you are planing. But you can easily get around the problem by using a piece of thin board as a spacer.

Rocker

[Sturdee]

..... Drilled a hole through the whole thing (at a slight decline) and then hammered a 3/8 T-nut into the back end of the square piece. A bit of threaded rod, a bit of pine on the end and it works a treat! All I need now is some way to get leverage on the rod (At the moment it's visegrips.



Adam, I made mine similar to that and used 1/4 bolts ( as I had them in the workshop) but was not satisfied. Too much flex in the bolt so 3/8 look the way to go. The other thing I found was that is better to use a square block if the hole in the bench and the dowel is a loose fit.

For leverage I used two nuts tightened against each other. Then you can use either a small ratchet nut spanner to tighten it or push on and glue with epoxy a small handle onto the nuts.


Peter.

[LineLefty]

the finished product

[Rocker]

Houston (er, Perth), we have a problem. The tee-nut is on the wrong side of the jarrah - when the threaded rod is tightened the pressure would tend to unseat the nut. I have considerable doubt also whether the clamp on the end of the rod would grip it effectively enough to tighten it properly. Two nuts (one a wing-nut) tightened against one another are what you need. Where is SilentC's former signature (something about a roar in the head) when you need it?

Rocker

[LineLefty]

OK thanks,

as you can see I need help! When it's pointed out to me, it's bloody obvious that the T-Nut is on the wrong side..........It does grip though, but probably not for long.

Also, the clamp is only temporary, I'm going do the wing nut and Nyloc thing (thanks for the tip) but I havent hada chance to get to the hardware yet.

Thanks again

[Rocker]

Linelefty,

You don't need a nyloc nut - an ordinary nut tightened against the wing-nut will do the job. If you used a nyloc nut, you would have to put it on from the far end of the rod, and, by the time you had wound it down to that end, its locking properties would be shot anyway.

Rocker

[stevephillips]

Ok Ive posted this before but Ill have another go and see if anyone is listening . Ive been using these clamps for a couple of months now and they are MINT!!! First buy; a length of 19mm (or 20mm) booker rod, a length of 10mm booker rod, a 10mm tap, 10 X 10mm nuts, a length of 10mm key steel. Then cut the 19mm rod into 130mm lengths and drill and thread them in the center and 4mm down from the top. Cut the 10mm rod into 120mm lengths and turn the ends (8mm back) down to 6mm. Cut the key steel into 50 or 60mm lengths and drill a 6mm hole in the center of them, countersink with an 8mm drill to about 5mm. The turned ends of the 10mm rod go into the key steel and is peened over in the countersink to stay put but turn freely. This rod can then be put in the top or middle hole depending on what kind of clamp you need, two nuts are threaded onto the other end and tightened against one another.
:eek:
Check out the attachments anyway, they are more helpfull than my drivel.
Im currently clamping a bed frame with them thats nearly 2m long the length is only limited by the timber available to you.

[LineLefty]

Thanks Steve thats really great info. I'm sure a lot of people will read that piece with interest. Althoguh may edit it and split it into paragraphs!

Theres a couple of bits that I'm not following though.

=> Booker rod is essential threaded rod no?
=> A normal Sutton type 10mm tap will tap through steel? Surely not.
=> Turning metal is not something I've got the capacity to do at home, what exactly do you mean by "peened over" You've got a rod in a hole. I'm confused!

Now after making your own, can you understand why I was loathe to spend $60 on a wonder dog when it is such a simple tool?

[Ivan in Oz]

Theres a couple of bits that I'm not following though.
<SNIPS>
=> Booker rod is essential threaded rod no?
=> A normal Sutton type 10mm tap will tap through steel? Surely not.
=> Turning metal is not something I've got the capacity to do at home, what exactly do you mean by "peened over" You've got a rod in a hole. I'm confused!

Now after making your own, can you understand why I was loathe to spend $60 on a wonder dog when it is such a simple tool?

G'Day,
I've got myself lost trying to follow this and am waiting for the next post.
I'll but in instead.

=> Booker rod is essential threaded rod no?
YES, often Galvanised

=> A normal Sutton type 10mm tap will tap through steel? Surely not.
Shirley will ;)

=> Turning metal is not something I've got the capacity to do at home, what exactly do you mean by "peened over" You've got a rod in a hole. I'm confused!

This is what you use a "Ball Peened Hammer" for,
I kid you not.

I've banned myself from the workshop for a while.
I've just come back onto the list after an absence :o
Then I go and submit a bit about safety;
afterwhich about a couple of hours later;

I take the side out of my fingernail with the table saw :( :mad:

Anyone want to purchase an Elu 'Flip saw'?

Count

[stevephillips]

Im sorry that the instructions were hard to follow. But thank you Ivan for clarifying a couple of points. I must have inherited my great Grandmother's aversion of punctuation. She wrote letters bereft of comma or full stop.
The key steel has a small hole that opens to a larger diameter hole.
The 10mm rod can be chucked up in a bench drill and 8mm at one end carefully filed down to 6mm.
This end is pushed into the keysteel from the 6mm to the 8mm and the very end peened over a bit just to keep it from dropping out.
Is that a bit clearer??
The at other end of the beams used in making these clamps just a length of 19/20mm booker rod can be used.
You can thread on a nut to rest up against the clamped wood and keep the rod from sliding out.
These clamps should you accept the challenge and succeed in making them should cost around $48 for five pairs(this is dependant on your supplier of bits) . ONE equivelent of a pair of veritas clamps will set you back $58.
I estimate Ive saved $242.

[LineLefty]

got it, thanks

[troutface]

I've banned myself from the workshop for a while.
I've just come back onto the list after an absence :o
Then I go and submit a bit about safety;
afterwhich about a couple of hours later;

I take the side out of my fingernail with the table saw :( :mad:

Anyone want to purchase an Elu 'Flip saw'?

Count
OUCH!! Typing one-handed as surgeon has just rebuilt two pinkies that kissed a router bit @ 18,000 rpm! Not quite what I meant when I said I wanted "to keep my hand in". SWMBO has banned me from the workshop..... but she does go shopping, y'know :D .
Anyway, I made a mitre jig for my disc sander/linisher to dress ends of mitre cuts and still keep them at 90o (sorry, can't superscript) when assembled, but need to clamp the two pieces either side of the jig. I am looking for a bench dog type of solution, but also think that a coupla bits of dowel and a wedge or cam lever may work.
My pride will not allow me to buy a solution, when for double the cost and a few months of trying, I could make some. I am very determined and still possess 8 good fingers!
In the meantime, I am looking for tools that don't bite back and a missus who shops more!