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mickelmaster
16th June 2009, 08:14 AM
Hello all, I already have a thread for this in general woodworking because im also going to make a board but was recommended to put one in here too because im having some troubles with turning as im new at it. So far ive done my kings and queens and almost completed my first bishop, this is my year 12 final job, I chose to do it to learn more about turning. Anyways heres a pic of my first pieces.

Rum Pig
16th June 2009, 08:50 AM
Looking good so far:2tsup::2tsup:

Were did you get your design from?
What timber are you using?

Ed Reiss
16th June 2009, 12:15 PM
MM...for the limited experience you've had in turning, the pieces done so far are looking good. Luck with the rest of 'em & post a pic of the finished board. Good job:2tsup:

Texian
16th June 2009, 01:01 PM
Looking good there Michael. By the time you finish the set you will have learned a lot. Looking forward to seeing the whole set. Wish I had started turning at your age.

jefferson
16th June 2009, 02:17 PM
Michael,

I found that book I was telling you about. Mike Darlow, Turning Chessmen. If you want a loan of it, send me a PM with your address. There is a lot of good stuff in there on shapes etc.

Jeff

mickelmaster
16th June 2009, 05:45 PM
Thanks all for your comments, Thank-you once again Jeff, I dont think ill borrow that book as ive already started and because im doing them at school it could get wrecked but thanks for the genorosity, much apprecianted, for wood im using Kwila and Victorian Ash for the pieces and for the board, Jarrah and Tasmanian Oak. The plans I got off a site somewhere, sorry dont know where. Update, today I stuffed up my first piece, it had a small chip out of a bead at the base when I was making a bishop so I turned it into a pawn. Now I cant show you pics of them because theyre at school and I have to use them as templates to make the other pieces. Once again thanks for all the comments, have a good one.

Ad de Crom
16th June 2009, 06:25 PM
Michael, look damn good for your first try. Much better than my first turning.
Getting used to handle tools is a matter of time, as it is with everything you're doing the first time.
Great job, keep em coming.
Ad :2tsup:

tea lady
16th June 2009, 06:57 PM
Good job. Must get back to mine. :rolleyes: Might make it fir this father's day. I started with the pawns. Now I have 12 differant pawns.:doh: I'lll just tell Dad his eyes are going.:D

mickelmaster
18th June 2009, 08:03 PM
Well finished my second bishop today so heres a picture of it, will post the other pictures when i get all 4 of them done. It has a few chips :( and the part at the bottom where it tapers towards the bead is on too much of an angle but otherwise its good :)

mickelmaster
19th June 2009, 03:49 PM
i was just wondering if theres a way to reduce chipping in general, i need the tools sharpened because they are quite blunt, could that be the cause?

Skew ChiDAMN!!
19th June 2009, 05:11 PM
If you mean tear-out, then "Yes. yes and yes." :yes: For actual chipping, it's only "Yes."

Blunt tools can pry out small chips, where a sharp tool wouldn't... Much like cutting paper with sharp & blunt knives.

If you see a small crack in the blank, you can seal it with a touch of CA glue, wait a few minutes and then continue turning. You can also glue small pieces back in this way, with care. But the best solution is to use sharp tools at all times and only use such repairs when absolutely necessary.

PS: Yes. :U

mickelmaster
19th June 2009, 05:56 PM
Thank you, now to getting the teacher to sharpen the tools is another story...

Skew ChiDAMN!!
19th June 2009, 06:04 PM
Ah, yes. School lathes... :sigh:

Ideally there'd be a sharpening station set up right next to the lathe, as when turning our harder Aussie woods the chisels may need to be sharpened every 5 to 15 mins of turning or so. Waiting for someone else to do the sharpening would be... frustrating.

However, schools being schools, I wouldn't hold my breath over it.

You're doing well so far; a chess set can be a challenge even to an accomplished turner. :2tsup:

mickelmaster
20th June 2009, 08:17 AM
Wow every 5 to 15 minutes! Ive been using these tools for about 5 or so hours now (all up) and they started out fairly blunt, im finding it quite simple really, just gotta take my time which unfortunately I dont have much of. now with the vic ash when i sand it on the lathe it still feels quite rough, should i slow it down and go to maybe 800 if the teacher has some? Because at the moment i have to go from 180 to 240 to 400 and thats it still at a speed of 2000. thanks very much guys your being very helpful :D

Skew ChiDAMN!!
20th June 2009, 08:46 AM
5 hours!? :oo: [shudder]

Yep, every 5 to 15 mins. Give or take, depending on the character of the wood. It makes sense, if you think about it.

Let's say your chessmen are 20mm diameter. So the chisel is cutting a bit over 60mm every revolution (well... 20 x pi, but 60's close enough) At 2000RPM that's 120 metres every minute. 5 to 15 minutes might sound quick, but the tool has cut a LOT of wood in that time. Way more than any hand-tool.

When sanding, you want to slow the speed down, at least halve it. I'd use a 320 grit after the 240, if you have some. After the 400, if you want/need to go finer then you're better off to use 600 before the 800.

Skipping grits makes sanding more of a chore than it needs to be... you should use the 180 grit to remove all the tooling marks (and, alas, tearout) so that when you move on to the 240 grit, all it has to do is remove the sanding marks left by the 180.

The 320's job is just to remove the sanding marks left by the 240. And so on.

If you try to use 400 to remove marks left by 240, you'll be there for three times as long... and sanding's a boring enough a job as it is. :rolleyes:

Actually, I say use the 180 grit to remove the tear-out, etc, but in really bad cases you sometimes have to start even lower. On the other hand, when your tools are nice & sharp and you've got good technique you can often start sanding at 240 grit.

If, when you say it's "still rough" after sanding, is it because of tear-out? If so, then you need to spend longer with the 180 grit, until it's all gone. (Which can play havoc with the shape, and ruin the "crispness" of the lines.) Really, you need sharper tools... they 'd give a better finish from the word go. But sandpaper covers a multitude of sins and many of us turners rely on it. :B

mickelmaster
20th June 2009, 08:49 AM
Thank you very much, most helpful, when i say its still rought it appear as if though the grain has come out of the wood, very hard to explain :P

Skew ChiDAMN!!
20th June 2009, 08:51 AM
Yeah, that's tear-out. Caused by bad tool technique and/or (can you guess?) blunt tools.

I reckon you can guess which is the most likely culprit. :U


(The reason it's called tear-out is 'cos the grain has literally been pulled apart, instead of being cleanly sliced. It's usually - but not always - worst in areas of end-grain.)

Christos
20th June 2009, 09:09 AM
This is a little side tracking from what has been said but I just want to say that the Bishop looks good.

mickelmaster
20th June 2009, 10:30 AM
Thanks Christos, its probably tear out but I dont get it with the kwila?

mickelmaster
22nd June 2009, 04:56 PM
Alright, finished my other two bishops today and almost finished a rook, having sharpened tools made it alot easier, except for a smal skew chisel I used, its now really hard to do beads, any idea whats happening there?

jefferson
22nd June 2009, 07:49 PM
Michael,

I suggest that you try using high magnification specs when turning the tiny beads and ball on top. Good lighting is essential too.

Perhaps also try using a small spindle gouge instead of the skew (it works for me, sometimes anyway).

What size skew are you using?

Jeff

artme
22nd June 2009, 08:02 PM
Doing well. Take note of Skew. He has eminently sensible and practical suggestions for all of us.

munruben
22nd June 2009, 08:09 PM
You are doing a great job Michael. :2tsup:

mickelmaster
22nd June 2009, 09:09 PM
I dont know what you mean by high magnification specs, unless its those glasses like things, but we dont have them at school, and lighting is fine, unless its in relation to the camera, i dont have a digital camera so im only using the webcam, ive no idea what size spindle gouge, but i find it the easiest tool to use for the beads, because they are so small. Thanks for the comments everyone, much appreciated :D

mickelmaster
24th June 2009, 06:08 PM
Oops, I meant I like the skew I find it the easiest tool to do beads sorry. But today i finished my second rook so, here it is. Problems with this were that I found it hard to do cove at top, sanding wise that is, and cutting didnt go so well (for the brick like parts, dont know if you can see them in the picture) as you can see there is splintering on the cut on the right side. Probably the highest quality picture yet!

artme
24th June 2009, 08:23 PM
Wonder if it would pay you to stabelise the wood with sanding sealer before you cut the turrets.?

mickelmaster
24th June 2009, 09:21 PM
No sanding sealer at school i already asked.

Skew ChiDAMN!!
24th June 2009, 10:40 PM
You could try flooding with CA to strengthen the wood. The cheap tubes from the $2 shop - 6 or so for a couple of bucks - will do the trick nicely; more expensive stuff is a waste.

Best tried on a scrap piece first, as the CA will soak into the timber and cause a colour shift.

The easy solution is to use CA as the finish as well. This is pretty well described in the pen-turning part of the forum, although you do need a better quality CA for a good finish.

mickelmaster
25th June 2009, 07:58 AM
But wont that make the pieces ive already done look wierd? I was also hoping to finish it with danish oil to learn new techniques. I think the main reason it splintered is because im using a very coarse toothed saw, trying to find a finer one but no luck so far.

artme
25th June 2009, 09:58 AM
Try a Japanese Saw. They work on the pull stroke. You can get ones with very fine teeth.

mickelmaster
25th June 2009, 04:52 PM
Im doing this at school, dont have anywhere to put tools at my house.

Skew ChiDAMN!!
25th June 2009, 05:25 PM
But wont that make the pieces ive already done look wierd? I was also hoping to finish it with danish oil to learn new techniques.

It's one of those things where you'd want to do a test-piece to see; if you want quality you gotta expect a bit of extra work. [shrug] Mind you, I'd prefer the Danish Oil myself... I only use CA when necessary and rarely as a finish.


I think the main reason it splintered is because im using a very coarse toothed saw, trying to find a finer one but no luck so far.

That'd explain it. :D Surely your class has a fine-toothed dovetail or tenon saw? (I'd use my dozuki, 'cos I got one! :p)

mickelmaster
25th June 2009, 05:28 PM
I finished my other Rooks today, spent 3 of my 4 lessons doing manual arts so it was good. Found a mitre saw that worked quite well, though not completely straight it didnt chip the pieces. I also found that all the rooks are different heights :doh: cant tell unless they are next to eachother though so I dont mind, and unfortunately even though i would like to spend more time on each piece, I dont have time to spare, still have to make the board and drawer yet, besides the other 19 pieces.

mickelmaster
26th June 2009, 05:30 PM
Todays work, made 7 pawns and a knight, 2 pawns broke and I stuffed up the knight.

jefferson
26th June 2009, 09:42 PM
Michael, never mind, you're doing fine.

I assume you are using a template for the pawns and calipers?

One of the masters here on the board measures 24/7. His lathe goes on and off, on and off, always checking. (Ken W's idea of a "long way off" is .1 of a mill. Anal, isn't it?)

I've also heard it said that you must make dozens of pawns to get a good set, so don't despair. And I'm looking forward to your board too.

Jeff

mickelmaster
27th June 2009, 07:14 AM
I have an original pawn, yes, but am currently trying to make an original Knight and its proving to be a hard task. I had a couple more pawns break on me yeterday, maybe 4 in total but 2 i could save and hand sanded the ball to a close enough shpae for me, if it looks kind of out atleast you know I made it:p In furniture and the like im alot pickier though so dont worry, its just that i dont have time or timber to make a excellent chess set but more a satisfactory one, i dont mind, after all its my first time properly on a lathe eg. not just making a straight pole. Thank you everyone for your kind comments and suggestions, youve been of much help.

rodent
2nd July 2009, 01:06 AM
mike your teacher ( being teachers ) might not have told you but when spindle turning you go from the large down hill to the small diameter . You cut down hill all the time , or you will get grain pull and tear out . Sorry guys but it is a beginners problem .

mickelmaster
2nd July 2009, 07:03 AM
I dont quite know what your saying? Is it that i will have a tendancy to taper the piece? Sharp tools and more time sanding has helped reduce the tear out but they are still quite dodgy tools, I think the reason both pawns broke is because i was turning a piece that was too long and the grain is very rough close to the centre of this piece of wood at the moment.

mickelmaster
2nd July 2009, 07:06 AM
Ill be sure to get better pictures of all the pieces and my other projects too when i get my hands on a digital camera.

Skew ChiDAMN!!
2nd July 2009, 11:30 PM
"Cutting downhill" means cutting in such a way that the grain is always supported by the underlying grain. Otherwise the edge of the tool is lifting the grain, causing tearout. (It's the same when using a handplane. With grain sloping one way the wood planes nicely, but cut "against" the grain & the plane digs in and tears out chunks.)

eg. when cutting a bead, you start at the centre (or "top") of the bead and cut down one side, then return to the top and cut the other side.

When cutting a cove, you start at the side and cut to the middle, then move to the other side and cut to the middle.

You should try to avoid just cutting from one side to the other side in one move.

tea lady
3rd July 2009, 01:06 AM
Todays work, made 7 pawns and a knight, 2 pawns broke and I stuffed up the knight.Stuffing up a few just means you're getting better. :cool: Starting to push the bounderies. Gotta know where the edge is.:cool:

mickelmaster
3rd July 2009, 08:34 AM
Thanks Skew, once again :p, i knew about the beads, but didnt know it applied to the coves too. It wasnt that ive gone any smaller or anything, i just have a longer piece to start with because im making so many its easier to do one after the other instead of having to do them all individually, but i dont think I have much choice, im on school holidays so havent done anything this week, next week is still holidays but im doing work experience at a furniture making place in currumbin, I cant wait, even though ill probably just be cleaning or something.

tea lady
3rd July 2009, 10:53 AM
next week is still holidays but im doing work experience at a furniture making place in currumbin, I cant wait, even though ill probably just be cleaning or something.Hey! Sounds good!:2tsup: I bet there's someone there that would help you, too.:cool: (And ya learn a lot just by watching. )

mickelmaster
3rd July 2009, 11:00 AM
Indeed, I dont think they do much woodturning though, they specialise in the old school roll top desks, and then some more contemparay furniture I guess. Have a look. Click Here
(http://www.currumbinwoodworks.com.au/)

tea lady
3rd July 2009, 11:10 AM
Indeed, I dont think they do much woodturning though, they specialise in the old school roll top desks, and then some more contemparay furniture I guess. Have a look. Click Here
(http://www.currumbinwoodworks.com.au/)Not inspired by roll top desks, but the other stuff looks pretty specky.:cool:

mickelmaster
3rd July 2009, 11:18 AM
Well its the skills to learn that im after, I would love a rolltop desk, but only if I made it.

mickelmaster
21st July 2009, 05:46 PM
Havent updated this in a while becuase not much has happened, i finished all the pawsn and theyre all the same basic shape :P not identical but close enough for me, still have to do the knights but we have some others who need the lathe that i use so im letting them have it as i need all the tools sharpened again anyways, so for now ive made a start on my board.

nalmo
21st July 2009, 06:48 PM
Chess pawns could be the subject of the next turning challenge. Produce a drawing with the required shape, detailed & dimensioned, and 16 people have to submit 1 pawn each (specified light or dark colour) to be checked against the specification. Points awarded (or deducted) depending on accuracy for each of a certain number of critical dimensions.

tea lady
21st July 2009, 11:56 PM
Chess pawns could be the subject of the next turning challenge. Produce a drawing with the required shape, detailed & dimensioned, and 16 people have to submit 1 pawn each (specified light or dark colour) to be checked against the specification. Points awarded (or deducted) depending on accuracy for each of a certain number of critical dimensions.and we can get some carvers to do the knights, and Roobo can do one king and Cliffy the other .:think: or maybe the queen? And Ken W can do a bishop? and Ttit a rook.:D I can feel a bun fight coming on. :duck: