Thread: Am I wasting my Time with woodwork?

She'll be right, mate. We all get down now and again, no matter how big a shed or how many tools.

If the woodworking is frustrating you (as it certainly can do--bugger!) then stay off it a while or you'll grow to hate it. If you decide you want to continue, sit and spend some time thinking through your challenges. For example, how can you have a decent bench without spending a fortune? Perhaps you can find an old heavy door to fasten on top of a couple of sawhorses you make yourself from the dodgy timber you already have.

Ask questions in this Forum before you spend a lot of money. Blokes here are more than willing to help a mate with ideas and sometimes even more.

A small shed area just means small projects. There are a lot of beautiful things made in small areas with only a few tools but the proper patience and practice.

Most of all, don't stress out over it. It's not worth it. WW is supposed to help us relax and to be enjoyable. If it isn't doing that, the game's not worth the candle.

Take a deep breath, maybe have a pint or two, and come at again.

Originally Posted by thumbsucker

I am in need of advice.
So I have a case of the blues, being broke and living in the big city, is not conducive to this very expensive hobby.

I am my own hardest critic, and I expect allot from myself, however after one years of trying, I am on the verge of saying that enough is enough.

My advice is..don't give up mate. There are plenty of forumites around your way. Make contact with some of the, and see if you can visit their sheds and check out whats needed to give you some peace of mind. I wish my body was in good enough shape to be able to hear only the swish of a nice handplane over a piece of timber. If you want a bench to work on safely AND comfortably visit a building site and see if you can pick up some secondhand hardwood 100x50's and glue/nail laminate them for legs and skirts and whack a couple of sheets of trudek on for a top. If you want a woodwork vise I have a near new 6" one I'll give you. Say the word and I'll send it over. Not charity just giving a leg up.
Cheers and chin up.
Mike

AHEM!!.. COUGH COUGH... HEY YOU NODDY!! YEAH YOU!! Stop sucking yer thumb pull up yer socks an listen up... alright? ALFRIGGINRIGHT thats bedda

Okay now yer uncle Dingo yer ol mate Shane is gonna give yer a wee talking to... STOP BLOODY WELL SUCKIN YER THUMB!! ... right now sit back have a cuppa an mull over me words young fella

1) Many MANY MANY people who make stuff from wood DONT have or DIDNT have tools when they started... YOU ARE NOT ALONE OKAY?

2) Many MANY MANY people who make stuff from wood make bad poor or wrong decisions with regard to their choice of sheds... ooops I mean wood

3) TAKE YOUR BLOODY TIME!!... its a passion... its a joy... its a great thing to be able to create something from a raw (or dressed) peice of timber and turn it into something wonderful... even if a tad amatureish... remember for every Japanese expert for every Kernov for every Derek dazzler skew Neil or Midge theres at least 100 buggars blundering along without a clue... but having a go just the same

4) Remember WHY you started doing it

Okay so thats outta the way now for the good bit!!... a bit of history (note some time line continuum factors may not be quite accurate as Im writing from my shoddy unreliable memory but its close enough)

I started without a SINGLE CLUE a fair few years ago not bloody one... but along the way I picked up a thing or two just small things from chippies and others with the same interest in timberworking... I recall my first buy was a timber handled hammer a nail bag and a timber handled hand saw... okay I had to buy them cause the Chippie I was workin with was a tight buggar and got sick of supplyin me with hammers nailbags and hand saws but Reg was like that top bloke good chippie but a tight buggar... then over time I bought a plane peice of utter crap cause I didnt have a clue remember but I used abused cussed and swore at it... then a few years later I scored by accident an hand held electric plane (I borrowed my cousins and cause I was without a clue I sorta accidently sliced through the lead and so I bought him a replacement one and kept the one I cut the plastic sleeve on) so I now had a hammer a hand saw a plane and an electric plane... and with these I created albeit roughly dining tables chairs picture frames and the like... but the finish was always rough so I wangled enough money from the missus and scored a cheep Makita sander... then a couple of years later I managed to score a bargain of a Metebo circular saw and the gods were smiling on me cause Id started to really hate that blunt hand saw something shocking cause I was without a clue I never learnt how to sharpen ANYTHING... then I bought a drill press why I really dont know but I did a whoppin great floor press it was stood in the corner and glared at me cause of course because I didnt have a clue Id forgotten to buy any drillbits and cause we lived quite a long distance from anywhere and only went to town once a month and Ive got a shocker of a memory so I kept forgetting to get drill bits... this was over a period of about 10 yes 10 years!

Did I have a shed as big as yours? Yours would have been a bloody sheer treasure! I was using a corner of the missus's laundry! LITERALLY!

So a few years later we moved south and set up house in the big smoke... but still I didnt have a shed so I used the front living room as my shed... Fair dinkum!! AND I have pics to bloody well prove it!!... and the bruises from the beatings ...then we managed to find enough money to buy a shed a nice 3mtr x 3mtr garden shed... and that was my woodworking gardentool shed for 5 years... then I managed to scrape and save enough to go to the woodworking show here in Perth where I managed to find that I had enough money to buy a table saw and a 12in thicknesser... so I bought them... but where to put them never occured to me cause I was without a clue I hadnt considered that the then present shed would be too small for them... I just KNEW I wanted needed and must have them so I did... for the next few months they resided in the front living room in their boxes in a corner

So after awhile we managed to get together enough money to buy a 6x6 double garage for a workshop for me... remember here I was also collecting timber all this time none of it covered all of it stacked wrong cause I was without a sodding clue... then I returned to the woodshow the following year and cause I didnt have buggar all money on me as Id sorta forgotten the bloody wallet of course and only had the cash in my pocket but I managed to find the "old tools" stand and managed to cadge a couple of old spokeshaves and a bench plane from the bloke who musta seen me coming a mile away and took my money with a huge grin...

So a couple of years passed and we moved again and from that move it was decided that there would be enough of a return from the sale of one house and the purchase of this one so that I could buy the shed of my dreams and the tools I considered necessary to achieve my dreams of woodworking into my retirement... someone forgot to tell the rain gods and the gods of the creek that splits through the property that the money was needed for my shed and tools cause it phissed down and the creek rose and kept rising until t literally washed 90% of our gear away... luckily for me most of the tools I had been buying were safely still in their boxes up on the high ground in a seatainer that only got 6in of mud and slush through it

So... the shed of my dreams became the shed we could afford and way way less than the intended shed (down from 30mtrs x 18mtrs x 4mtrs to 9mtrs x 6mtrs x 2.7mtrs and I was lucky at that cause it was on special) but luckily most of the tools were still okay and already bought.

What Im saying mate is that you really REALLY have to settle back and take your time... remember that what you have now is only temporary and even to the most organized among us the future is UNKNOWN... so although it may seem like you should just pack it in and walk away things have a way of changing as time moves on... and no matter what there are others that either are where you are now or have been there

It DOES get better!!

Now... wheres the flamin pics of whatever the blazes you called the things you made??

OH!! And like me you could go to a garage sale and just buy a wooden dining table and use that as your workbench... mine was teak then jarrah then I actually made a rough as guts Tuart workbench that cause I was without a clue at the time was built using 1 month on the stack from being a bloody great 60mtr tree in the garden wet its sorta taken on some REALLY INTERESTING shapes!! But even so until last month I was still using it as a workbench... last month I got really ambitious and actually sliced diced and created a flamin bobby dazzler of a workbench the creation of which is on the forum (including pics!!) but a table is good as a workbench if you have nothing else.

AND!! FINALLY... there is no such thing as "wood that is just shhhit and not fit for building anything" even such crap as crapiata has its place in woodworking.., so its no good as a workbench USE YOUR IMAGINATION!! create something else from it!! ALL WOOD IS GOOD WOOD

Now I will buggar of for a few ticks and get a cuppa while you get some pics on this thread... if you please

Your workbench frustration is why some of us think building the hardwood woodworking bench is a terrible early project. There's a lot going on in terms of technique and wood-knowledge. Just get some table and reinforce it. That Workmate, or some end table, or something else can be fixed/improved. Never, Never, NEVER let making a great bench be a show-stopper.

G'day Thumbsucker

I found myself in a similar situation a few years ago. I made a couple of chests and a TV cabinet from Rimu. The stuff wasn't dry enough and it shrank, split and warped. Worse was I had made one of the chests for my Sis-in-law as a present. I gave up for quite a while after that thinking I'd never get any decent wood, I was hopeless etc.

Over the past few years I have discovered that there are good imported hardwoods available in NZ. They are expensive but most of the things I make are fairly small. Walnut, maple, ash. What a difference to pine and Rimu!! You local timbers are also great.

The other thing I have found is that, for me, a saw bench/router table is essential. I spent many happy hours on my old Triton which my wife bought me for a birthday. You can pick up a Mk3 Triton for a small amount over here (maybe $100). I went to a tool auction the other day and a really nice Makita circular saw went for $20. So you can get a basic system for a reasonable price. I made a Grandfather clock on that - it just takes longer.

Regarding a bench, I have seen quite a few good school benches over the last couple of years on the local e-bay equivalent - I guess the schools are upgrading to chipboard benches and the new Chinese Irwin vices, or maybe they just dont teach woodwork any more. They go, sometimes with an older Record vice (I got 2 large almost unused record 52Es (I think that is the number) for $70, from a school sale), for less than $100 often - much less than the wood and they are often very solid looking. I'm sure the same things will come up more frequently in your part of the world. If it is too big for your space, chop it down, but it is likely to be made of solid stable timber.

Some woodies make benches that are works of art in themselves. Personally, I like to hammer, glue, drill, plane, file, etc on my bench so it is just a thing to attach a vice to and put stuff on. I'm not precious about my bench!

As Shedhand says, the alternative is a second hand timber place. Just watch out for nails!!

I think having the Triton a second hand router, second hand circular saw and some second-hand planes and my grotty bench (and a GOOD vice)made such a difference and were a real turning point for me.

Hope you keep going

I do understand your position and it is indeed tough to cope with.

I live in a small apartment ("2 bedroom")and share a small bedroom with my roomies lapidary stuff and it is TIGHT. Also not rolling in it to afford lots of really good supplies. It has taken some time to accumulate some reasonably decent tools and wood and learn to arrange the work area for max efficiency as well as learning to do the best with what I do have (still better than sitting around and watching TV). I do spend a a lot of time taking things out and putting them away, sometimes more than I spend actually doing something. Clean up is generally a serious job all in itself.

Take the long view and improve what you can as you can.

Best advise I can give you comes from my quotes file :

"Never Give Up, Never Surrender!" --Galaxy Quest

"What you spend years building may be destroyed overnight. Build anyway." -- Dr. Karl Menninger

"While it is not working, *uck with it." -- Jean Wilson.

You apparently have done some good work in the past, just keep on going on and doing the best you can and in time you will learn to function with what you have and accumulate more and better tools and supplies. God knows how wonderful it must be to have sufficient funds and room to swing a cat (I can swing mine here but wouldn't as they would get hurt in the process bouncing off stuff ).

Yes, it is trying and Yes it is frustrating at times.

But when you get something nice done it will all be worth it.

Hang in!

Take care, Vikki.

TS, just knock up a work bench from 90x35mm construction wood for now, 2 rectangle frames for the legs, a piece of 6~12mm ply/chip/mdf to brace on the back/rear, 2 stretchers at the bottom and 3 across the top, grab a internal house door for the top(or what ever sheet goods at hand.
Buying all of the materials from a recyclers should be $50~100, even cheaper if you scrounge around.
My own bench cost about $30...

If you need a basic bench design using 90x30mm put yer hand up... ye shall receive!

haha in answer to yr basic questions Thumbsucker, obviously you are wasting yr time so give it up right now and burn all yr crappy wood! sell yr tools and never go near woodwork again.

In reality you are just going through what all of us do in developing new skills and learning about an age old craft.

yr table top probably warped cos u either had the wrong wood or didnt do something right, like match the grain or brace it properly yr legs split for the same reason..maybe the wood wasnt aclimatised or whatever, or dry, u didnt mention what kind or wood.

Just pull back and recognise the need to learn from yr mistakes, from others and that everything u do is in development. Enjoy it, there is much to be learnt, learn about wood, learn about technique, learn about yr own creative or technical functions.

Sometimes small stuff is better cos if u stuff it up u waste less wood.
Sometimes its bets to follow a gut instinct for a aprticular type of woodworking (making traditioan wooden weapons as u mentioned).

Sometimes its just a raw love of wood...

Up here in Cooma we have what they call a men's shed. It is in an old railway shed,open a couple of days per week, it is a place to meet and work. check out where you live if they have something similar.

Yeah - I'll just make some noises similar to what's been written above. I've been butchering wood for about 50 years, ever since starting woodwork classes in grade 7 and I STILL have projects that just don't go right! Sometimes, I think the only skill I have really improved on in the last 30 years is fixing stuff-ups. An old chippie once told me (and I notice one of the regular forumites has it as his signature line) "The bloke who never made a mistake never made anything" - I cling to that dictum, some days! It is true though, that we often learn more from disasters than we do when things go smoothly all the way.

Like many others on the forum, I can all too well remember being in your shoes. The bug started to bite me when I was a very broke undergrad in the 60's, and it was really from necessity - 'fixing' some old furniture out the back (under an awning which kept a bit of rain off) with a very meagre set of tools, on a bench cobbled up from some salvaged fenceposts with half a top, and the crappiest cheap vice which has long since taken up its most useful role (landfill). Wood was a bit more plentiful then, but just as hard to come by, and as a proportion of my income (or lack of it) just as expensive.

Anyway, it's been a long road, with lots of ups and downs, and there have been times when I was ready to chuck it away out of frustration at not being able to do things as well as I would have liked, or not having a decent work space. And you look at nice stuff other people have done, which can be inspiring or disheartening, depending on the mood you're in! But if you plod along and try to tackle something a bit more difficult as your skills and knowledge improve, yor satisfaction levels should rise consistently. There is such a plethora of information available now, which is maybe a curse as well as a blessing to a beginner, as some of it can be conflicting!

So I second the advice someone has already given - try and find a mentor to help you find your way, or join a club if there's one close enough - even if you sit at the back and just listen, you'll start absorbing some of the cumulative wisdom on offer. I'm really glad I persisted, it's been a very satisfying sanity-preserver, and I have managed to make a couple of things I can bear to look at without cringing.

Cheers,

See what Dingo says? and what Harry says?

If you poke around here a bit you'll see I've got a bench made of solid oregon, 80mm thick top and looks perfectly clear, and I've just built one for my brother out of old hardwood (search for "bicycle bench"). Neither of them cost a bean.

I mean it. Both were entirely from demolition or reject timber. Except for boats, and the stash of reject hardwood ($100 per cubic metre), I haven't bought timber for a project.

On the "show us your bench" thread, you'll see some pics I posted illustrating how to align the bench top timber to stop it cupping. Your problem is as much to do with inexperience as the timber, but a sheet of MDF will fix it (which you can get for free if you hunt around) - check out our demountable recording studio which only cost us a few screws and a bit of glue for an example.

Check out any of Wongo's construction threads. His rocking chairs, linen presses, tele units were all built out of reject timber. He may butt in here and correct me, but I reckon he's built half a dozen things for less than $200 outlayed on timber.

I do have a flash workspace with a few tools now, but if you search for "Goat Island Skiff" you'll see an example of what I used to do with the same number of tools as you. A spoke shave, a #4 plane and a hand saw. (Admittedly I borrowed a sander and a triton for the hard bits!). At the time I was working in a corner of a garage about 1 metre by 3, my workbench was made from cheap pine discarded from building sites because it was too twisted, with a top made of six pieces of small particle board flooring offcuts.

None of the above is to illustrate how clever I am, it's to prove Dingo's point!

If you give up, it's you that gets hurt, not us... so what's it going to be eh?

There's free material everywhere, all you need is practice!

P

Ok, Nah your wasting ya time... Pack all your tools and wood, then send them to me

Ok now seriously, as the others said, for a workbench, remember it is a toll. It doesnt need to look flash, write off your previous attemt for the moment (Dont toss it out, Maybe you can reserect it at a later date). Get some second hand construction timber and some MDF and knock together a simple bench (Mitre 10 even have a free plan, or drop a line here).

As for the enthusiasm well, where in Melbourne are you, maybe someone here is close and can come around to give you a boost or maybe you can visit their shed for some insperation. I know if you are over my side I would be willing to come have a talk (Not that I am any good at this wood working thing)

Have you thought of joining a local woodies group? They may have access to tools you dont. I know if you are anywhere near me, the group in Templestowe have a huge workshop, and the guys in ringwood/Croydon are very welcoming (There is a couple here on the board).

Chin up, it isnt all bad, it just feels like it. Keep hanging out here and dont be afraid to ask.

Hi Thumbsucker,
Some sage advice there, mate, so you're not alone! We've all been through it, and some of us have a reasonable array of gear in decent sized sheds that have trouble getting the time (or permission ) to make the most of of it!!
Regarding the small space, you have to see it as a challenge. Space effective storage, mobile tools and benches etc. Maybe a bench half that size is the answer...or do you really need a bench in the accepted form for spoke shave work? Perhaps more of a carving bench; or a shaving horse, ideally suited to drawknives and spokeshaves. I recently posted a link to a combination carving bench-cum-shaving horse. Things like that could allow a bit more space for a machine or two when money permits. Perhaps a cheap SCMS and a small bandsaw would be better than a tablesaw for what you are making, and any breaking down could be done elsewhere (as in Forum contacts). My dad built a workbench 40 yrs ago from salvaged pine boards which he laminated together with clinched nails in order to get decent sized legs, and it still stands in the workshop today
Head up mate, think of the beauty in timber and the pleasure gained from working it, not the trouble in getting to it

Cheers,

Hey TS

What they all said in their different ways.

I know you aren't really going to give up - you wouldn't have asked your question of a group of woodnuts if you really wanted us to say "Give it away".!!

There isn't a project I have done that didn't involve a stuff-up. You learn from them.

As another alternative on the workbench, how about looking at beefing up your Workmate. A bit of imagination and you may well be able to cobble some sort of metal replacement screwed together from miscellaneous metal bibs and bobs from a hardware store to replace the plastic bits that are worn out. We all do things like that - did you see that Derek Cohen makes knobs for his beautiful home-built planes by taking a suitable nut and sticking a brass hose fitting on the outside and a piece of brass on the top so it looks like a solid brass knob. If it's good enough for him to bodge things together, it's good enough for me (and probably you). If you fix up your Workmate you can keep working on that while you make the bench of your dreams in a way that doesn't turn into a nightmare!!

So, TS, chin up and get back into your shed, lad.

Cheers

Jeremy