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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lappa View Post
    Frost Brad points kits are carbon steel not HSS, whereas Sutton individual Brad points are HSS
    I have a few brad points from LV. They are brilliant. I have some sizes in tct as well. Also have a set of festool centrotec bits and are on par with the LV bits.


    Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

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  3. #17
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    Thanks guys. Frost might be sold by Sutton, but the ones I got were NOWHERE near the quality. Couldn't even use some of them, ended up getting so huffy I threw the set in the bin (after complaining to the boss at the store, who said, 'yes, that's why they were in the cheap bin, you cheapskate' )

  4. #18
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    This is the first I've heard of this. I think it could have some truth, but may also ultimately be overthinking it.

    All I can recommend is what I've used personally, and that is the Colt 5* FCE High Speed Steel bits. They cut clean and straight, and they exit cleanly too when sharp, which they retain for many, many holes. 5 out of 5 stars (no pun intended...). These have pointed cutting edges, not rounded.

    Good luck,
    Luke

  5. #19
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    Leonard Lee gets into quite a discussion of the 3+ different kinds of brad point drill bits and the related sharpening methods (p 196 - 198.)
    Then, all of those from Utility to Carbide-tipped are available from open stock and sets in the Lee Valley catalog.

  6. #20
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    This is the first that I have heard about two different types of brad point drill bits.

    Personally I have used several different brands of drill bits, Frost, Colt and the Supercheap Auto ones. I can not say that I have noticed anything different between any of the brands. I do take it slow when drilling so that I can remain as straight as possible.

  7. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bendigo Bob View Post
    Thanks guys. Frost might be sold by Sutton, but the ones I got were NOWHERE near the quality. Couldn't even use some of them, ended up getting so huffy I threw the set in the bin (after complaining to the boss at the store, who said, 'yes, that's why they were in the cheap bin, you cheapskate' )
    This is wrong the item sold was not fit for purpose and should have been taken back to the store. The store owner is at fault for knowing selling something that is faulty. I am sure the department of consumer affairs would be interested to know how this person does business.

  8. #22
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    So I did my little grinding experiment to try to match the negative spurs on carbide CNC bits and it was a painful, but mostly successful exercise.

    IMAG2477.jpg
    IMAG2476.jpg
    IMAG2474.jpg
    IMAG2475.jpg

    Drill on the left is how I normally grind, right is the test

    IMAG2482.jpgIMAG2481.jpg

    Normal on the right, test on the left

    IMAG2480.jpg

    Top hole is with my normal grind, bottom with the negative spur test bit, timber is NZ Beech. There is a tiny bit of tearing with my normal grind and, while the negative spurs did prevent tearing, the edge of the hole is very slightly raised - probably due to my inability to get enough back clearance on the spurs. The test bit was also a slightly harder to push, but I'm putting that down to my clearance angles as well.

    IMAG2483.jpg

    It's interesting to note that the drills in the W.L. Fuller link are ground differently on the OD as well as the top. The softwood OD relief appears to stop some 5-10mm from the end of the bit, which allows them to have the pronounced curve on the ends of the spurs. The hardwood drill OD relief goes all the way through and has a much smaller unground portion, making the curved spurs impossible to grind (probably why I had so much trouble in my test). It would be interesting to see if there's enough un-relieved OD on the softwood bit to allow the leading edge of the spurs to keep the proper shape when the bit has been re-sharpened enough times to get past the completely unground section.

  9. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Christos View Post
    This is wrong the item sold was not fit for purpose and should have been taken back to the store. The store owner is at fault for knowing selling something that is faulty. I am sure the department of consumer affairs would be interested to know how this person does business.
    There are drill bits labelled as brad point, but they are NOT brad point drill bits. A proper brad point drill bit DOES have "spurs", the thin and sharp cutting edges that slice the grain as the bit pierces the wood. Many, including Bordo sell what THEY call brad point drill bits, but they are NOT brad point. See the link below.

    I purchased two of these purported "brad point" drill bits only to find that they are ground almost the same as a normal drill bit. The ONLY difference is that the cutting edges form an inverted "V" shape when compared to a normal grind. What this does is ONLY change the cutting angle and to some extent causes the outer edges of the drill bit to tear the grain more than a normally ground drill. I rang Bordo and advised them of their mistake and suggested that they do not sell these as brad point drill bits as they are not true brad points. My comments were accepted (but probably have no effect). I returned the drill bits to the place of purchase as the Bordo customer service said they would reimburse the supplier (Beyond Tools) for the used bit (only drilled twelve holes).

    I received a full refund and purchased a dowel drill with a PROPER brad point. Fortunately the holes were only for (adjustable) shelf pins so the depth requirement was only 8mm.

    The Beyond Tools owner insisted they were brad point drill bits, but they are not. The "spurs" did not exist as TRUE spurs but ONLY the outer corners of the cutting edge. Look at the image in the link below. You will also notice that the brad "point" is not a true brad point, but a "fat" spear point, a legacy of the inverted grind.

    Be aware that these drill bits do not produce a hole any better than a correctly sharpened normal drill bit!



    https://www.bordo.com.au/product-ran...7033&catId=112
    Kind Regards

    Peter

  10. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrFixIt View Post
    Be aware that these drill bits do not produce a hole any better than a correctly sharpened normal drill bit!
    First of all, they do. The hole on the left is with a 10mm "fake" brad point bit (self ground), the hole on the right is with a 10mm split point twist bit fresh out of the box. There is a noticeable fuzzy edge from the twist bit.

    IMAG2493.jpgIMAG2491.jpg

    Second, even if the holes were the same, twist bits tend to wander when starting while brad points (even the "fake" ones) don't, which is one of the main reasons for using them.

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