Thread: Domino vs Dowelling Jig

Originally Posted by Midnight Man

Well, the bulk of stuff I need to make will be using 16mm Melamine - it'll be kitchen cabinets, and storage type cabinets for several other rooms. So, the sort of stuff where 16mm Melamine kind of disappears like coins in a slot machine.

From there, I want to make some outdoor furniture, some occasional chairs and coffee table - likely enough, anyway. And truthfully, some of that would require tenons larger than the Domino 500 could accommodate, so I'd be likely enough chipping out mortise & tenon on that stuff with a few chisels and some nice music in the background... maybe

Boiling it down, I know there's a lot of melamine work - there is likely to be shaker style kitchen cabinet doors (probably maple or similar). From there, it's a lot more undecided at this stage.

In my mind, and given feedback to date, I was thinking of the Domino 500, assuming it is up to the task of the melamine carcasses (I believe it with some Titebond to glue joints should be?). If it falls into disuse, my understanding of Festool is that it retains good resale value, so I could always sell it, and then realise the next day I need it (which is what always happens, right?)

Some of the guys have already said this I think . Why would you domino a 16mm Melamine carcase for just standard household storage work ? This sort of thing is just screwed and then a back slid in side slots and nailed at top and bottom. Its fast and strong enough for the throw away every 20 years Melamine Rubbish.
Or have I missed something above ?

Get a Domino , its going to be good for doors and furniture . A few things I like and now understand since buying the 700 is , the Domino's ability to do wider than standard supplied Beech Domino's , Ive been using it to give me 120 wide x 10 mm thick Oak tenons. For joining large mitered tops . Whit I'm getting at is when you own a Domino you will realize your not stuck only using the supplied domino widths , just the thickness dominated by cutter diameter.

Another great thing I saw a guy do and now do myself is . Making my own Dominos . There is a Youtube thing on it somewhere. Instead of the "cut them out of hard wood then run them through a cutter to give the edges like the Originals have " way , this guy just cut them out of softwood and left the square edges to compress into the female domino hole . He also cut them slightly less in width so your not trying to compress to much . Its pretty fantastic I think . Nothing is going to replace traditional mortise and tenons for me . love the Domino though , I Hate doweling .

But as I said before , if your setting up to build all you are talking of , You need one of each . And more . Doweling ability as well as hand tools , benches and work tables, compressed air and all the tools as well . Why stop ?
Spend .

Rob

Originally Posted by auscab

Just buy both

Agreed. I have a few tools that I only used once/twice since purchase and then put away, because I've found a better way to do it.

You may find Dowelling jig more suitable for what you make/do, same can be said about Domino.

Just yesterday I had to do one 14mm x 100mm domino mid air (because I have forgotten to do it when its on the table top) there is no support in any direction (it can be done with support but just takes time). I dont think you can do that with table top dowelling jig...

The Doino is very very versatile, I even use it to cut out large holes in the middle of a panel - Because I dont have a router and jig saw.

Originally Posted by ian

I'm fairly certain that at least one forumite has one -- either personally or at work

That would be I...

The Lamello P-System is fantastic and definitely worth the investment, especially if you don't have any other dedicated machines/tools. Check out 'Tips & Tricks' or 'P-System configurator' if you need further convincing (soz woodPixel ).
Having said that, plate joiners / biscuit cutters are more widely used at work as this does come down to construction methods. All the work we manufacture is installed by us, so very little flat-pack work.
There are 3 'workshop' Makita biscuit cutters + personal cutters (also Makitas) with a pool of about 15 guys (number fluctuates due to installations). We have a CNC as well as a static borer (which was purchased for a large job and I don't think has been used again). 90% of the work we do incorporates manufactured board (unfortunately).

Don't get me wrong, the Domino is also a fantastic device/system, and the ideal scenario would be to have both a Domino + biscuit cutter / dowel system. I guess it comes down to:
- budget
- preferred joining methods
- % of materials utilised in your craft.

Originally Posted by auscab

Get a Domino , its going to be good for doors and furniture . A few things I like and now understand since buying the 700 is , the Domino's ability to do wider than standard supplied Beech Domino's , Ive been using it to give me 120 wide x 10 mm thick Oak tenons. For joining large mitered tops . Whit I'm getting at is when you own a Domino you will realize your not stuck only using the supplied domino widths , just the thickness dominated by cutter diameter.

Another great thing I saw a guy do and now do myself is . Making my own Dominos . There is a Youtube thing on it somewhere. Instead of the "cut them out of hard wood then run them through a cutter to give the edges like the Originals have " way , this guy just cut them out of softwood and left the square edges to compress into the female domino hole . He also cut them slightly less in width so your not trying to compress to much.

Both ideas are excellent!

The dominos are not expensive, but I dont use hundreds for a job (Im a tiny workshop).... but I'd certainly use more on any one job now using this method. I'll give it a crack.

The "uber-width" mega domino is a good one. This is almost like a full M&T.

Sorry to interrupt you learned gentlemen but I'm wondering if there is any DIY option for the twist and lock mechanisms you get with flat pack melamine kits?
Just to lock items in place where you don't want screws to be showing.
Or do those things require a CNC to align the holes accurately enough?

Originally Posted by DaveVman

Sorry to interrupt you learned gentlemen but I'm wondering if there is any DIY option for the twist and lock mechanisms you get with flat pack melamine kits?
Just to lock items in place where you don't want screws to be showing.
Or do those things require a CNC to align the holes accurately enough?

when I did my tech course we made one or two things using twist lock and other sorts of knock-down fasteners. I sort of remember using two different types at each end of a component so that we got to use different bits.

We did all the drilling using a drill press and horizontal borer. So doing a small number by hand is certainly doable.
From memory, the key was a very accurate layout.

Perhaps Hafele sell and alignment and drill kit for them?

https://www.hafele.com.au/en/product...3177900020023/

https://www.hafele.com.au/en/product...0d0ad00030023/

?

Originally Posted by woodPixel

Perhaps Hafele sell and alignment and drill kit for them?

https://www.hafele.com.au/en/product...3177900020023/

https://www.hafele.com.au/en/product...0d0ad00030023/

?

Thanks. I didn't know where to get them. Good to know if/when a pocket hole is unacceptable.

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

I hope you're sitting down when you give them a call to ask the retail price of the drill jigs.

IMO unless you're a commercial business or planning on building alot of cabinets its not worth it.

I like pin-and-cam, the only reason I didn't suggest it was because the discussion seemed to be about permanent joints, rather than knock-down.

Layout and boring by hand isn't too tedious, but you do need to get your setback from the edge right or they won't work.

Unfortunately, the relevant insert for that Hafele jig is not available locally, so it's not going to help you.

I think that perhaps this thread has certainly given the OP food for thought with all the knowledgeable content.

Personally I have always customised my tool requirements where my best fit for me would suit down the track.Over the years of course I have added the biscuit jointer a Makita ,then the small biscuit jointer like the Ryobi as mentioned in QCInspectors post.
Of course the Kreg came along then the Domino 500 & the 700.
I have never used dowels unless you could term a Domino a form of dowel?
All the above was an investment over time in what I thought at the time was my best option .

The whole crux of this thread is what is the best fit for him with regards the joining option,therein lies the $64000 question only he can answer given his intended financial outlay
The Domino has large outlay therefore you might it necessary to consider given your expected workload.
The Lamello is also expensive but expense is sometimes necessary if you have to work that option also but by all accounts a beautiful machine of Swiss design if I recall.

All the very best in what you decide to go with ,you surely can't be anything other than happy working with wood as a medium.

Originally Posted by ian

when I did my tech course we made one or two things using twist lock and other sorts of knock-down fasteners. I sort of remember using two different types at each end of a component so that we got to use different bits.

We did all the drilling using a drill press and horizontal borer. So doing a small number by hand is certainly doable.
From memory, the key was a very accurate layout.

here you go Dave.
I found the layout plans I did back then. Just draw it up so you know what the critical dimensions are, and then lay the dimensions out using using something like a marking gauge or dividers.

Originally Posted by auscab

Just buy both

You know, I had thought of that! But then, I'd stand around in the shed half the day debating with myself which one to use (I'm a newbie, so not experienced enough to know instinctively)

Originally Posted by auscab

But as I said before , if your setting up to build all you are talking of , You need one of each . And more . Doweling ability as well as hand tools , benches and work tables, compressed air and all the tools as well . Why stop ?
Spend .

Have been doing just that! Got table saw, band saw, planer/thicknesser, getting to build a workbench, got compressor, got bradder, and filling out on some hand tools.

For clarity, moved into a new place recently, so finally have room for a workshop. And now have a house we want to make improvements in - nothing urgent, it's OK as is, but we want to make it "ours" and do it ourselves... this was simply the "next question/decision in line" (Domino vs Dowels) and one I didn't have a strong opinion and clear research on

Originally Posted by elanjacobs

I like pin-and-cam, the only reason I didn't suggest it was because the discussion seemed to be about permanent joints, rather than knock-down.

My intention is no knock down, that is true. But the discussion is very interesting, and seems to encompass more than I originally asked, which is great, because I am learning more

Many thanks again to all responding, it's truly appreciated!

for many years i used the old stanley doweling jig with many a haphazard result moved on to the kreg when it first became available here in oz and was very pleased with this. Saw the Domino when first released couldn’t justify the cost at the time but lusted after it for a few years then the XL700 Domino was released and it coincided with a large order so that i could justify the cost. Brilliant worked as advertised never had a problem after a year or so i came up with an extension bit so i could fit the smaller bits which worked out well till it let go(mild steel) with a brown pants moment. Found the Seneca aftermarket bit and purchased it.
Since then it has helped produce thousands of joints with only 2 failures due to abuse.
I still use kreg for carcasses but for any tenon work it’s straight to the domino.