Near misses

**Alastair** · 26th October 2004, 03:39 PM

FWIW

A touch of alternative information, if only to provoke some controversy

Some years ago, at a woodcrafters' group meeting, we were having a talk on workshop safety, and had gone down all the conventional channels of reasoning, similar to those often voiced on this forum, and prevalent in legislation, where that applys.

A grizzled old timer, with a lifetime of experience in timber and general contracting volunteered a comment from the back of the audience, as follows:

"In all my years on the job, " came his voice, "I have never seen an accident happen, when someone was doing something (he knew was) dangerous!"

His point, when greeted by a barrage of abuse, was that when you are doing something which you know and appreciate as being hazardous, you are alert to the dangers, and take extreme care not to put your bits in the way of danger. It is when we believe that what we are doing is safe, or think that the machine is fully guarded, or don't think at all, that we are at extreme risk.

I often work with unguarded machines.

I turn. I have yet to see a guarded lathe. I am blo0dy careful what I am doing, however.

On the saw table, (home built) I have no guards. Even on a guarded machine, these are customarily removed for certain operations, like cutting tenons, using dado heads. The same with routers and spindle moulders. I however have seen the results of injuries, and have experienced kickbacks, and make sure when I work this way, that I am frighteningly aware of the gnashing steel teeth.

On the bandsaw, when cutting large timber, the guard is practically non existent. Does a bandsaw sever fingers more slowly than a circular saw? Ask any of the several 9 fingered butchers I have seen.

A jigsaw is usually considered safe. I thought so, until I came close to severing my LH little finger, which was under the piece of timber I was cutting. I no longer consider them safe, and make damn sure I know where my digits are.

While I was recuperating in RN Shore from a motorcycle accident, I shared a ward with 2 venerable gentlemen, recovering from microsurgery. One had reached into a safe guarded garden mulcher to remove a jamming stick. The other was using a push stick to run small timber through a regulation guarded table saw, while chatting to his wife. While distracted, the piece jammed, the push stick slipped, and he severed 3 fingers of his right hand, as it slid under the guard.

I finish with the following. Some years ago, I was made responsible for safety in the packing hall of a food manufacturing factory. And went enthusiastically off putting safety measures, and guards everywhere. My crusty old Scots manager took me one side, and explained that the only truly safe factory was one where the workers had gone home, and the front door was locked. There is no such thing as a safe machine, there are only safer operators.

It is more important to be aware of the hazards at all times.

I will now sit back, and await the flaming

Alastair

**AlexS** · 26th October 2004, 07:48 PM

Sorry Alastair, I have to disappoint you - no flame here. While I have no objections to guards etc., and use them where possible, I'm convinced that they are only secondary safety measures, and knowledge, attitude and attention are the primary factors in workshop safety.

**journeyman Mick** · 26th October 2004, 09:36 PM

The best safety device is your brain - properly engaged!
Unfortunately there's a lot of people that don't use theirs and/or don't understand the risks involved in their work process.

Mick

**chook** · 27th October 2004, 05:55 AM

Dear Alastair,

ABSOLUTELY TRUE. If an operation looks dangerous we take the care we should always be taking. I think that my SCMS and the table saw are the 2 safest machines I have for that reason. They look evil. But the harmless cordless drill, what damage could it do? But I know of a young man who drilled a hole in his finger with one.

And no guard or safety procedure will work if the brain is not engaged.

**Dewy** · 27th October 2004, 09:47 AM

Any tool can cause damage regardless of power.
When I was a kid I used to love 'helping' my dad.
One day I picked up his small hand drill then dropped it.
The bit broke off and the drill fell on the floor.
He started to tell me off when my mum told him to look closely.
The drill had gone through my leather shoe, through my small toe, the sole of the shoe and pinned me to the floor.
They had to carefully lift my foot up unscrewing me from the broken bit.
Over 50 years later and I stil have the scar and feel pain in that spot during cold whether.

**Glen Bridger** · 27th October 2004, 08:28 PM

Over the years I have had a few things go wrong at work and in my home workshop. I alway wear protective gear which has prevented or minimised injury. One scary incident was having a 48 inch linishall belt break and fly straight at me. I was wearing a full face shield which copped the impact. It was fairly well stuffed, but it did what it was designed to do.

Safe practises, guards and personal protective equipment will not stop all acidents/incident but they will minimise the risks, but more importantly minimise/prevent injury.

Glen.

**John Saxton** · 27th October 2004, 10:57 PM

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com...8868#post88868

I also am one of those having had the misfortune to accomodate part of my anatomy namely a finger to the wiles of a mind not on the job and whilst min or It was a wake -up call for me in dealing with all I have to employ at my leaisure.I cannot emphasise the need to keep our loved one's pain at our misfortune at a stress free level while we are otherwise engaged in their /our wishlists.

Ever mindful of the mishaps that await us in our eagerness to enjoy the pastime that we all love I thought it appropriate to post this link above which perhaps could bring us to mind of our actions whilst dealing with machinery.

Take Care enjoy what you love doing but do it safely with thought of others.

Cheers

**chook** · 3rd November 2004, 10:54 AM

I have just shown this thread to my wood class at school. Thank you for all those who have shared their experiences. I hope that they learn from these rather than by lopping off bits of themselves.

**barnsey** · 3rd November 2004, 11:32 AM

I have a friend who works as an engineer with the airlines - safety is a first priority.

Mowing the lawn on a ride on he managed to remove all the flesh down to the bone on his right pointer finger trying to remove some rubbish from the mower. Dopey c#$t but at the end of the day he still has all of his digits albeit with much less feeling in one of them

Guess I'm just saying - no matter what your background - be alert.

The world needs lerts

Jamie

**Dewy** · 3rd November 2004, 03:05 PM

I saw someone from Oz on the routerforum in America complaining about routers being stopped in schools in Oz.
http://www.routerforums.com/showthread.php?t=386
This is more likely to cause accidents in the future because the kids will not be taught how to use routers safely.
Far too many see DIY home makeover shows when they get married and start a home and think they can do the same.
Power tools are getting cheaper all the time so they will buy them and risk injury.
The lessons I learned at school has given me great respect for tools even though we only used hand tools in those days (I swear the teachers name was Noah) lmao

**Wood Butcher** · 13th November 2004, 03:53 PM

Between finsihing school and ending in a woodshop I had a few different jobs. In a metal Machining Shop I watched a guy tapping a hole about 5/8inches diameter in a piece of cored brass rod. After he removed the tap with the machine still running he went to flick of a tiny ( about 2mm long) piece of swarf of the end of the thread. Needless to say his finger got sucked right into the thread. Ambos turned up and the only way to get his finger was to unscrew it leaving almost no skin on his finger.
Sanme workshop a guy was using a metal press without a guard, hit the pedal, slipped and had three of his fingers flattend to 1mm thick.
Lastly working as a canvas amker using large industrial sewing machines I ran out of thread in the bottom spool. Replaced spool and tried to slowly jog the machine forward to pick up the thread. Hit the peadl too hard and put 5 stitchs of 2mm thread up my RH pointer finger (Shop foreman ****** himself laughing then show me similar scars on his fingers)
Second lastly cutting pieces of timber at work I only had a few to do so didn't replace guard on sawbench. Still don't know exactly what happened but now have a thumb with about 4mm of flesh missing from the pad right to the bone.
It can all happen so fast!

**Wild Dingo** · 30th October 2005, 07:21 PM

Since taking a nice chunk out of my thumb on the first table saw I bought a few years back I am now more attentive to what Im doing

Ive partially banned anyone from entering the shed... they have to wait until the machine is turned off before coming in... this mainly so I stay focused and dont get distracted by someone coming in unexpectantly

Ive taken the measure that they have to wait till the machine stops then knock on the wall or some thing else to get my attention... they are never to call out even if the machines off... last time the missus did that I near shyte myself droppin the mallet in my hand onto me foot and causeing massive blue features to appear on big toe... no yelling in me shed... ooh other than me Im allowed cause its my shed!... Im considering setting up red lights above the machines when the shed goes up so when Im working they stand outside hit a button a light goes on above all the machines I see it know someones there and wants me finish what Im doing and turn of the machine then focus on them... seems right anyway

Ive also taken the blade guards off both saws since I do a lot of thin strips I find having to take it off and then put it on a pain in the bum... I now take it off and leave it off... One day I hope to have the setup to be able to have one saw dedicated to strip work and the other for all other uses but its not an option just now

I dont go near the machine if Im tired weary distracted or anything other than focused on the job at hand... I also learnt to NOT stand directly in line with the blade... but to one side cause damn those flying peices HURT!! :eek: and yep thats what the blade guard thing is for I knew that!!

Be aware be prepared be focused be stable and put all your attention on what you are doing and stay safe and whole... If Im starting to loose attention or focus I simply stop and go have a coffee do some hand sanding or something equally non machine related... I find the most distracting thing for me is having a radio or cd player going in the shed when Im going to do machine work for some reason I start swayin to Gordon Lightfoot thinkin of sailin somewhere or loudly singin to Jimmy Barnes "Workin class man" or screaming at Bush in time to Black Sabbaths "War pigs" or cryin to Ray Sawyers "one more year of lollypops" or laughin to the Naked Vicar show... so I dont have noise out there keeps the focus and attention on what Im doing... have it going when the machines are off no sweat but off when theyre going

Ol fella saying "put your mind in gear shut yer gob and do the job properly"... it worked for them fellas and it works for me

Stay safe

Cheers!

**savage** · 31st October 2005, 12:04 AM

Shane,

I have to agree with you on all points, and the bit about people entering the shed is a touchy subject with me. I'm fed up with some halfwit coming in and standing there quiet as a mouse and when I turn to grab lubricant or something (metal lathe), they think you've seen them and they say G'Day and frighten the B'gezzuz out of me. Yeah!..it sounds funny and probably looks funny but is the single scareyest thing that continually happens to me. My family are well trained after a sit down talk about just racing into the shed and yelling out "Hey Dad!". We now have a system that works for the family they slam the back sliding screen door and I know someone is about, but got'a sort out my mates. The hardest is getting through to them that it's not funny, it's dangerous. I like the idea with the light, might do that.
The only thing we do different is the radio, I have mine just set as background music so when no machinery is on I can hear it, but turn on the saws or router it is drowned out and no longer a distraction. I am going to make a sign and put it outside the door (next to the "new" light switch) DO NOT ENTER WHEN MACHINERY IS OPERATING PRESS BUTTON AND WAIT
I think it might work, this thread has been a good read.
I've had one bad experience while welding, I lifted up my mask (not the dark lens) to check a weld and the cooling weld spat off a lump of slag the size of a thumb nail, right into the corner of my eye. The only time I had was to close my eyes, it stuck to the eyelid and my mates wife came running as she heard me scream help. I couldn't see for my eyes where watering so bad, I just stood there, welder running an all. I had to tell her to turn it off and she led me inside to pour water onto it, she said to see if I could get it off else it was of to the doctors. Luckily it came off but had a weepy scab that stuck and cracked for a few weeks until it healed. I was wearing the proper eye protection, just didn't use it correctly (I do now).
savage(Eric)

**Gra** · 31st October 2005, 02:00 AM

Originally Posted by capedcrusader

Not really a near miss nor relevant to woodwork but one day while welding I noticed a subtle difference to the usual smell of the toxic arc fumes and lifted up my mask to see one of my layers of protective clothing in an advanced state of combustion.
Just patted it out and kept right on going.

My old man did something similar. Whilst welding up a large stair rail. Sat in the middle of it, connected the earth to the outer edge. got halfway through and needed a new welding rod. Reached over and got another rod without getting up and poked the rod into the handle. This completed the curcit and promptly shorted the current through his nether regions.... ever had an electrode conected to them?????

We almost wet ourselves when we saw what he did, strangely he didnt find it funny...

And the number of times I have had to through water in his pants is not funny, his legs dont work all that wel so he welds sitting cross legged on the ground, then rests the work on his legs, the only problem is missing some of the feeling, and so doesnt notice he has set himself on fire...

At least I have learned what not to do....;-)

**barnsey** · 31st October 2005, 10:55 AM

Don't ya just hate that!! - doing the final cut with the skew and one of the family waltz's in to tell you something that is totally inane - like "I love you" Frightens the begessus out of you and you then feel guilty all afternoon

Yes it's dangerous, but frankly I wouldn't trade it - if I have friends and family who want to come and talk and share some company then the newest creation won't go anywhere whilst I chew the fat.

Priorities are sometimes a conflict - you need to remember what is important

Jamie

Thread: Near misses

Thread Tools

Search Thread

Safety Is A Must

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions