Thread: Gennou - Handle

What I didn't say was that although the handle was comfortable, I wasn't happy with the shape so I remodeled it.

Gennou remade 003.jpgGennou remade 004.jpg

I prefer the curve of this handle. Boys like curves. It's in the genes.

Regards
Paul

Nice job BM.
I made a handle for a Japanese axe recently and I am not at all happy with it. I'm going to have to make another one.

Forgot to mention how the handle was shaped. If there was anything inside my head I'd probably be dangerous. Actually I am anticipating that by brain will be much sought after by medical science - It's unused.

Shaping was initially by 40 grit sanding disc in the angle grinder and then 80 grit followed by normal ROS. Coarse to remove the swirl marks and fine (240 to finish. The scourer takes care of final smoothing). When the handle was re-shaped I only used the 40grit as it was fairly worn by then having been used for other applications in between. Still followed up with the the ROS.

The angle grinder sanding is extremely aggressive. It can put an arris on an edge about as quickly as a router bit, but with a gentle hand (to go with the curves ) a reasonable finish can be achieved very quickly.

I will be posting a thread where I have shaped scales for knife handles the same way.

Regards
Paul

PS. If I was going to to much of this work I would use a 100mm angle grinder as it would be lighter to hold for freehand shaping, but I have standardised my grinders at 150mm or larger. I may have to work on my muscles instead.

Hi, Bushmiller. Nice handle. Love the shape. And love your post in general.

I was taught to shape a gennou handle as a curve so that the rounded side has a downward bow to it (less power) and the flat side has the upward curve (both of these when holding it horizontally, I realize I should clarify). The main advantage is that you know which side is which by the grip... otherwise I don't find it all that useful.

Just sayin'. Not recommending.

Originally Posted by Bushmiller

Forgot to mention how the handle was shaped. If there was anything inside my head I'd probably be dangerous. Actually I am anticipating that by brain will be much sought after by medical science - It's unused.
Regards
Paul

Hi Paul,

First, I'm not quite over the shock of seeing something posted here - got all choked up (maybe too much wine).
As for the quote above - sounds like the first job for your new genno is to whack yourself a few times (or ask the wife to, sounds like she'd enjoy it). Anyway, guaranteed to learn something. Science's loss, perhaps.

Very nice job with the handle btw, beautifully shaped. I notice, however, that your wedge might be going the wrong way? If you look at the hole, it is wider (or longer, depending how you reference it) where the handle exits (you can see the gaps at each end in the pic 005). Usually, genno are designed this way so the inserted end of the handle will flare outward and fill the gaps when wedged (perpendicular to the long axis), and thus make it less likely to loosen and come off. I'm sure for general use, like when the wife whacks you, it will be ok. But for more serious work (like disciplining children?) it may tend to fly off and, you know, cause injury . Not to mention the expletives which might be uttered at such a time (something that rhymes with Fukushima...).

Seriously, tho', for a chap with so many hammers, you likely know what's ok in use, so my observation may be frivolous. And, in my case, I don't think I could swing 750g often enough before running out of steam to have to worry about the handle coming loose.

Anyway, thanks for posting, its a beautiful tool.

Steve

Originally Posted by NCArcher

Nice job BM.
I made a handle for a Japanese axe recently and I am not at all happy with it. I'm going to have to make another one.

Let's have a look at it, before and after perhaps

Regards
Paul

Originally Posted by yojimbo

I was taught to shape a gennou handle as a curve so that the rounded side has a downward bow to it (less power) and the flat side has the upward curve (both of these when holding it horizontally, I realize I should clarify). The main advantage is that you know which side is which by the grip... otherwise I don't find it all that useful.

Just sayin'. Not recommending.

Yojimbo

I think you are right on the money. In fact Derek Cohen's post, from which I took inspiration, depicted exactly that, a curved handle. However my preference, prejudice actually, was for symmetry. To determine which side is curved I unconsciously run my fingers over the faces to tell which has the curve. I guess that, if by my age you cannot tell a curve from a flat, life's experiences have taught you nothing and you should consider giving the whole show away .

In practice, the flat head has become dirtier as it is used more often, but I concede that from twenty paces I don't have a clue which way is up (on the gennou).

Regards
Paul

Originally Posted by Sheets

Hi Paul,

First, I'm not quite over the shock of seeing something posted here - got all choked up (maybe too much wine).

I don't understand the "shock" reference . Nor the "too much" reference .

As for the quote above - sounds like the first job for your new genno is to whack yourself a few times (or ask the wife to, sounds like she'd enjoy it). Anyway, guaranteed to learn something. Science's loss, perhaps.

Ah yes. "Sticks and stones may break my bones, but whips and chains excite me."

I notice, however, that your wedge might be going the wrong way? If you look at the hole, it is wider (or longer, depending how you reference it) where the handle exits (you can see the gaps at each end in the pic 005). Usually, genno are designed this way so the inserted end of the handle will flare outward and fill the gaps when wedged (perpendicular to the long axis), and thus make it less likely to loosen and come off.

Steve.

I had something of a dilemma here in that as I mentioned I originally intended to fit the handle without the use of a wedge. Derek Cohen had referred to the flare in the head and that the characters on the head should face the held end of the handle. I did this and measured the flare with a vernier gauge. The flare was not as much as I expected but was present in both directions. I opted for a wedge in the long axis as my previous experience with western hammers dictates one timber wedge in the long axis and two steel wedges at right angles to the timber wedge in a hammer of this size, which is slightly larger than the biggest claw hammers.

You have correctly spotted there is, how can I put this euphemistically and to place my efforts in the best light possible, "clearance."

Seriously, tho', for a chap with so many hammers, you likely know what's ok in use, so my observation may be frivolous.

Not frivolous at all. Without such comment we lose the traditions and stick everything on with epoxy . Time will tell what sort of a job I have done and as there is no epoxy involved, everything can easily be remade.

Steve

Regards
Paul

Well, I was going to suggest epoxy as an alternative, but the last time I used it, it took me hours to free my hand from the handle.

I don't recall the post by Derek, but he likely covered all the bases about the flared hole (or lack thereof) if he suggested not using any wedge. And as the old saying goes, "there's more than one way..."

Steve

Steve

This was Derek's thread and his very smart gennou:

https://www.woodworkforums.com/f152/h...rticle-126947/

You will need to refer to his website for exact details via the link.

BTW Derek, if you want to come over and play, I will smooth the waters with SWMBO, but I think we will still have to make our own tea and biscuits as she does not have a benevolent nature .

Regards
Paul

Hi Paul

I'll only come over to play if it is cooler in Qld than Perth and you have plenty of icy beer. I was in Sydney 2 days ago when the mercury hit a smidgeon under 46 C. I had just arrived back from Canada, where it was -10 to zero. Not to mention it is the weekend and our aircon will not go on!!!! Tell me all is forgiven!

Now your handle is good for a Western handle, and I have no doubt that it is comfortable and will work (.... so what more does one want with a handle?). What you have made is very similar to many of the handles one gets on a production gennou. This gennou head was handmade and consequently I wanted to do it justice, hence adhering strictly to the traditional.

The reason for the curve is simply to orientate the face. You automatically know which side of the gennou is domed and which is flat. The domed side is used to finish nailing without marring the surrounding surface. For adjusting planes it is also going to do less damage than the edge/corner of a flat hammer face.

Locking the end of the handle in the mortice is easy enough. Why not give it a go?

Also, I think that you would have a lot more fun shaping the handle with a spokeshave than a grinder



Regards from a sweltering Perth

Derek

Thanks Derek for your comments.

I understand the change in climate from Canada. The first time I came to Oz in Dec 1978 I left Amsterdam where there was snow on the runway and stepped off the plane at Kingsford Smith to 38 deg. The climatic equivalent of being thrown in at the deep end.

Although we have had our share of hot weather here ironically it may not have been as hot as NSW and other places. Different story if you went NW from here about 1000km. Thargomindah I think hit 49 deg or thereabouts, but we only got to the high thirties .

Not the biggest beer drinker myself, but normally have some beer in the fridge for my son, friends and relatives .

I anticipated that my attempt at a handle would bring out the purist in you . However let's take this one step at a time. I'm not good with change at the best of times and also if you had seen my spokeshaves you probably would not have made that suggestion. It probably only took me twenty minutes to obtain the basic shape before using the ROS (I know, I know...another travesty ).

There is another problem with spotted gum in that it has a marked tendency to pick up. The stock I used was planed first and "pick up" is precisely what it did. I was using one of Terry Gordon's planes and I reversed the blade as he suggests to make a scraper. This was actually the first time I have done this. It worked extremely well, although harder going. However this would not have been an option with a spokeshave.

BTW an earlier reference to the angle grinder size should have read 125mm (not 150mm which was the ROS).

I still want one of those Tenryuu models. Let's see, Birthday, Father's day......... .

Regards
Paul

Bushmiller --

Originally Posted by Bushmiller

I concede that from twenty paces I don't have a clue which way is up (on the gennou).

And I confess that after all these years it's still not innate in me, and so I also pass a thumb over the faces.

...Just don't tell Sheets, okay?

Originally Posted by yojimbo

Bushmiller --



And I confess that after all these years it's still not innate in me, and so I also pass a thumb over the faces.

...Just don't tell Sheets, okay?

Too late.

I'd still have to look, 'cause I wouldn't remember which way the handle curve goes with which face. Look twice, hit once I always say.

Derek,

Where in Canada (if you're at liberty to say)? I'm on the east coast (Nova Scotia) and we had similar temps (-10 to 0, which isn't unusual for this coast), but so did a lot of other places, which isn't usual for January. Of course it goes without saying these days that, the world over, temps are "above normal". Much as I look forward to the spring/summer, I don't envy you Aussies with your heat wave. Icy beer is certainly a relief, but after a few of those, one can't really attempt anything with too much precision (at least I couldn't, but then precision isn't a word I'd use to describe my work anyway).

In the words of my late Uncle (an Australian), "A man has to believe in something,... and I believe I'll have another drink".

Steve