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  1. #16
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Back on the sunny Gold Coast from Japan
    Age
    67
    Posts
    334

    Default

    Hi Helmut

    Keep smiling. It will work.

    Process of elimination:

    Is the blade and chip-breaker contacting correctly? Is there any rattle of the chip-breaker when you lay it on the blade and tap the front corners? If so, the chip-breaker needs to be properly adjusted.

    More than likely though, if the kanna just stops cutting, the dai probably hasn't been properly conditioned. Check with a straightedge lengthwise across the entire width of the sole to make sure that you have properly formed the concave recesses, and that there are only two touch points ahead of the cutting edge (towards the dai-jiri). If you have a third touch point on the dai-gashira, make sure that it is exactly coplaner with the other two touch points.

    At this stage, if I were you, I'd have reasonable concave recesses. The half millimetre or so for a smoothing plane is OK when you've been using the kanna for a while and your eyes are attuned to it, so I'd give them a bit extra and scrape out at least a millimetre. It's not something you really need to be anal with, and cigarette papers aren't necessary. Also, make sure you have complete clearance immediately behind the blade. If any area whatsoever on the sole is higher than the area immediately in front of the blade, it won't cut.

    If all of that has been done, and you've checked and double-checked that the concave recesses are set properly, the final thing to check is the tsutsumi. I couldn't see clearly, but I think your kanna has the tsutsumi. When you're extending the blade, you may be pushing the tsutsumi down, and this is raising the cutting edge off the surface to be planed. With your blade extended for normal cutting, carefully lay your straightedge lengthwise across the width of the sole. If you have contact with the tsutsumi, you need to retract your blade, and scrape that out of the way.

    If you do and check all those things, your kanna should cut well.

    As far as technique goes, don't force the cut, and keep practicing. You have to give your muscles a chance to learn new movements and coordination. And that means practice. There's no other way.

    Good luck.

    Des
    See some of my work and general shoji/kumiko information at kskdesign.com.au

    My Instagram page
    My YouTube channel

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  3. #17
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Earth
    Posts
    3,567

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    Hi Des - The tsutsumi seems to have been at fault.

    When I turned the plane over I could see that the sole around the tsutsumi was burnished. This was confirmed by the straight edge.

    I used an old plane blade to scrape out material. When I first scraped the sole I did so without the blade in the throat.

    When I placed the straight edge across the width of the sole I saw that there was a bulge in the area behind the tsutsumi. Marked in the photo. I tried to scrape the bulge out. I think it needs more.

    mouth.jpg

    I also increased the concavity on the dai sole to about +/- 0.75mm

    The kanna performance has increased in leaps and bounds.

    I finally able to plane some radiata.

    radiata.jpg

    However consistency is still a problem.

    This is the western red ceder. A full width shaving. It measured 0.1mm. The planed surface however was perfect. This was a major reason I wanted a kanna, because western planes leave Ceders feeling fury.

    westernred.jpg westernred2.jpg

    This was elm again full width but again way to thick.

    elm.jpg

    Here is what the sole looks like now.

    dai sole.jpg

    I am having problems setting the blade projection.

    I am also sometimes get a strange effect with the blade only cutting on the edges not in the middle. Poor sharpening?

    I am going to pack the bed more to make the adjustment more positive.

    I also feel that the backing iron is not mating perfect. It does not rock when tapped. However a little light shine through between the blade and backing iron.

    The blade edge has held up better, but it is breaking down faster then it should will resharpen.

  4. #18
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Back on the sunny Gold Coast from Japan
    Age
    67
    Posts
    334

    Default

    Hi Helmut

    A few points.
    When initially conditioning the sole, and also for regular maintenance, you should insert the blade and chip-breaker with tension, but obviously not projecting out of the mouth. This is so that when you condition the dai, you are conditioning it as it will be when in use.

    I've added a few lines to your last photo.

    dai sole.jpg

    The red lines are where you should check with your straightedge. Any concave recessed area that comes even close to the same plane as the three touch points should be scraped (or sanded). And the three touch points should actually touch at each red line. If they don't all touch at any line, you will need to go back and sand the sole again until they do.

    Next, you need to check your straightedge along the green line. That should be perfectly flat and touch the straightedge the entire width. If it doesn't, again you need to go back and sand the sole until it is perfectly flat. It possibly isn't flat the entire width and that's why you're having problems with the blade projection, and also possibly with the uneven shavings. That is the line where, as you look down the sole from the dai-jiri, you gauge the extent to which the blade is projecting and how square it is, and how fine or coarse the cut will be.

    It may sound a bit fiddly, but once you get it set up properly, maintaining the dai takes only a few minutes each time it feels off or doesn't cut well.

    On the blade/chip-breaker mating, if you can see any light between the two, you need to keep working on the chip-breaker. Same as with Western planes, if the blade and chip-breaker don't mate perfectly, the plane won't cut very well.

    Try those things, and it should show some improvement.

    Des
    See some of my work and general shoji/kumiko information at kskdesign.com.au

    My Instagram page
    My YouTube channel

  5. #19
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    466

    Default

    Hey Helmut...after the pain of working it all out ...The Kanna is a wonderful tool. Des really knows his stuff
    Cheers

  6. #20
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Earth
    Posts
    3,567

    Default

    It has been a while since I updated by progress. I have put my time to good use.

    I sharpened the blade 4 times since my last update. In the process turning the 25 degree bevel to a 30 degree bevel. I am now freehand sharpening the blade, having established a good bevel with the honing guide. My only comment is that the steel does not turn a big burr in comparison to A2. Even on a coarsest stone the burr is delicate. On the fourth sharpening I honed in a good camber to the blade, as I was leaving train tracks, I think I over did it so next sharpening I will reduce the camber. This is what the blade looks like after some extensive use. I would rate the steel on par with A2 in terms of edge durability.

    IMG_3777.JPG

    I stuffed up with the backing blade. I tried to get it to sit flat with the ura on the blade but it needs lots of work. So I tried using the kanna without the backing iron. It worked much better and I was able to get far better performance without the backing iron. I will get around to mating the two however for the moment I am getting tear out free performance on all my standard timbers. If I can use a kanna without a backing iron, should I bother with the backing iron?

    I am glad to report that I can now take fine shavings, fine enough to see through.

    IMG_3770.JPG IMG_3771.jpg IMG_3774.jpg IMG_3769.jpg

    Today I dimensioned four panels Elm. They came up very nicely. Elm is a difficult wood to plane as it is coarse and the grain spirals, however the kanna had no problem. I also planed the American White Ash and that came up very nice.

    IMG_3764.jpg IMG_3768.jpg

    The best results came from Western Red Ceder. The surface is mirror like.

    I am having one problem. The ears on the blade were to wide, so I ground them down, as you can see in the following photo the ears are well within the mouth however on the corner marked with an arrow shavings still become jammed. What could be causing this? In the area marked in the photo below would paring a little of a cheek maybe create space for the shaving to eject?


    IMG_3781.jpg mouth.jpg

    Random thoughts:

    In terms of planing end grain. The kanna is king. I have tried planing a variety of woods with the Kanna, a LN Block plane and a LN No. 6. The kanna leaves a mirror finish, were the western planes leave the surface furry at best or torn out.

    The kanna is a great plane for fine shavings however I really struggled when trying to hog material off. Maybe its my technique but a western plane feels easier when doing ruff work. As I can grip the toe and knob, the kanna tends to slip in my hands.

    I am getting better at setting the blades projection. It took me almost 10 minutes to get the projection right first time but after a few practice attempts I can set a blade for a fine cut in less then a minute. I find the David Charlesworth trick of using a piece of scrap to test projection really helps.

    I have an old shoulder injury and I find that pushing a plane aggravates my shoulder however pulling with a kanna I am able to work all day without pain.

    I have found that subtle adjustment in hand treasure when holding the kanna allows me to adjust the depth of cut. If I hold the kanna gently whisper shavings are made but if I bear down on it I can increase the depth of cut.

    Also regarding my earlier question about were to apply hand pressure on the dai. I have found the the hand the cups the back of the blade is the key, the hand holding on to the main part is always a light touch and is used more for steering the kanna.

    Finally I am very happy with how my ura has come out. Its a little asymmetrical at the top of the legs, however its nice and fine for the most part.

    ura.jpg
    Attached Images Attached Images

  7. #21
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Adelaide Hills, South Australia
    Posts
    4,311

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by thumbsucker View Post

    The kanna is a great plane for fine shavings however I really struggled when trying to hog material off. Maybe its my technique but a western plane feels easier when doing ruff work.
    I prefer a scrub plane for hogging off lots of wood. Mine is a very old German model (the one on the far left in drawer below) that came from the German settlers in the nearby Barossa Valley.

    It is similar to the modern E.C. Emmerich scrub plane, here. The Emmerich design was based on the common plane design used by most carpenters to make their own planes back in the 1800s. I find I can apply more force (using my body weight) for hogging with the push stroke on this type of western plane. 'Someone' was generous enough to organise a group buy for members of the hand tool forum which allowed me to acquire a customised HSS blade for my scrub plane, which I really appreciated. Thanks, Thumbsucker.

    Neil

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