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  1. #1
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    Default Getting Brand New Chisels Ready for Use

    Hi all,

    Today I bought some brand new bevel edged chisels, and have consulted Leonard Lee's guide to sharpening. It's appears go me that the I should now:

    1) Remove the lacquer from the blade.

    2) Check the angle of the bevel. If it's already 25 degrees, it's OK. If anything else, grind a 25 degree bevel.

    3) Hone the 25 degree bevel with a 1000# waterstone.

    4) Create a 30 degree micro bevel with a 6000# waterstone.

    (I haven't mentioned lapping the face of the chisel, but will do that as per Lee's advice in the book).

    Anyhow, can anyone tell me why it's necessary to remove the lacquer? It seems to me that grinding the bevel will remove the lacquer on the bevel, and that any other laquer is not important.

    Also, my plane blades came wrapped in plastic and oiled. Does that mean they have no laquer to remove?

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  3. #2
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    Two points. Lacquer or oil are there to protect the steel in transit. You don't want them clogging your sharpening stones. Second point is; why bother honing the 25 degree bevel when you are going to remove the edge formed when you make the 30 degree secondary bevel?
    Cheers,
    Jim

  4. #3
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    Buy a loupe and see what 20x or 30x or whatever magnification tells you about the state of the edge after any treatment.

    The proof of the pudding can be seen without eating in the first instance, and you stay slimmer.

    Do the backs to the same grit that you do the bevels.
    Cheers, Ern

  5. #4
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    Jimbur,

    Regarding the honing of the primary bevel, from reading Leonard Lee's guide, my understanding of page 61-64 in particular was that having ground the primary bevel, you hone it with a stone of around 1000# grit, before adding a micro bevel using a 4000# or 6000#.

    Ern,

    Nice idea about the loupe, that'd be quite useful and good fun I reckon.

  6. #5
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    To the topic of lacquer thinner, does anyone know if nail lacquer remover works for removing lacquer from steel? Got some at home, the first three ingredients are acetone, water and glycerin if that helps.

  7. #6
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    Default

    Nail polish remover with water and glycerin in it will slowly remove dried lacquer and you have just put water and glycerine goo on your tools. I don't believe that's a good idea.
    Just plain acetone on a tissue will take of the lacquer and any acetone residue will evaporate and you're done.

    Sharpening/honing. While microbevels may be trendy, I can't find any incremental benefit.
    If the edge is 25 degrees, so be it. If the edge is 30 degrees, so be it. 30 on top of 25 tells me that I'm still pushing the wood open at 30 degrees. How could the 25 assist or improve that, a bevel not in contact with the wood?

    Best trick is to paint the bevel edge with black felt marker. I was surprised not to see this in LL's book. When you work on the stone(s), you can flip the tool over and see exactly where the metal is coming off. Develop a clean edge on a 1k water stone. Refine that on a 4k water stone. If a mirror finish floats your boat, go next to a leather strop and chrome green honing compound.

    For me, the leather strop is the difference between woodworking sharp and carving sharp. At the same time, my knot-busting chisels are sharpened at 40 degrees (to take the load). I show no mercy. They are very bash-worthy with a 30oz (800+g) lead core carver's mallet.

  8. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robson Valley View Post
    Sharpening/honing. While microbevels may be trendy, I can't find any incremental benefit.
    If the edge is 25 degrees, so be it. If the edge is 30 degrees, so be it. 30 on top of 25 tells me that I'm still pushing the wood open at 30 degrees. How could the 25 assist or improve that, a bevel not in contact with the wood?
    First time I've disagreed with you Robson. The secondary bevel has been standard in woodworking for a very long time. The only thing trendy about it is the modern tendency to call it a microbevel. The idea was to cut out time off the job by only having to remove small amounts of metal on the oilstone. When the secondary bevel became too long it was time to grind.
    For general woodworking purposes 30 degrees was seen as a good average for most woods. The individual would use different angles for different purposes as you do.
    There are two dangers as I see it:
    Firstly the books state an angle as if it's set in stone and been handed down from the great craftsman in the sky, and:
    The ability of guides to set angles to the nearest minute or two has created a belief that this is the way it has to be done.
    I know I'm exaggerating a bit but it's like car tyres - pretty good on most surfaces. However, racing drivers use tyres designed to suit the particular surface on the track.
    Rant over
    Cheers,
    Jim

  9. #8
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    Jim

    I think you have nailed it. ( Apologies to Cliff and his hammers ). Many of the experts sharpen by hand and eye alone. I'm sure they would be a degree or two off the standards at times. 25 deg and 30 deg are targets; A bit like speed limits .

    Regards
    Paul
    Bushmiller;

    "Power tends to corrupt. Absolute power corrupts, absolutely!"

  10. #9
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    Well I always go back to Lee's bible, and the advice is to get the bevel angle as low as is consistent with edge retention.

    Hard woods need less acute angles, soft woods more acute. Morticing and other hacking, go shorter still on the bevel.

    A 2ndary bevel angle can be played with acc. to your application with min. work on a bench whetstone and jig.

    If you want to easily touch up an edge with an abrasive (say freehand on a bench stone, or with a diamond paddle or slipstone), then hollow grind the bevel to start with. That will give you two micro-bevels (ie. small bevels on the same plane, at the toe and the heel).
    Last edited by rsser; 17th December 2012 at 10:50 PM. Reason: Additions
    Cheers, Ern

  11. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimbur View Post
    First time I've disagreed with you Robson. The secondary bevel has been standard in woodworking for a very long time. The only thing trendy about it is the modern tendency to call it a microbevel. .....
    Hi Jim

    I tend to differentiate between secondary bevels and micro bevels. This may be just me, however, as I know others disagree (it wouldn't be the first time .. or the 100th! ). Nevertheless I will continue doing so until the world comes to their senses and agrees that I am right!!!!!

    ... a micro bevel is a tiny bevel (usually created with a few strokes). It has nothing to do with angles.

    ... a secondary bevel is a bevel that is honed at a higher angle than the primary bevel. It is all about angles, not size.

    When you hone a primary bevel directly on a hollow ground, you create a micro bevel that is coplanar with the primary bevel.

    When you hone a tiny secondary bevel on a flat or a hollow ground primary bevel, you create a micro secondary bevel.

    And a last possibility is to grind/hone a convex bevel, ala the style Paul Peller promotes. This is effectively a secondary microbevel.

    It that clear!

    Regards from Perth

    Derek
    Visit www.inthewoodshop.com for tutorials on constructing handtools, handtool reviews, and my trials and tribulations with furniture builds.

  12. #11
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    Thanks for the explanations. I float along with my wood carving gouges at 20 degrees (wood carving detail knives at 12).
    Knot busting chisels at 40. Using black felt marker on the bevels to observe the sharpening actions. Angle cards and my elbows tight against my sides.
    Hindsight tells me that I'm looking for consistency.

    One thing I'd like to add: we all agree that knots are very tough pieces of wood. It occurs to me that since a knot was a branch once upon a time, that branch was exposed to the environment. Not only is it now very hard but there's environmental dust, even sand particles, stuck in it. Not wonderful to bang into.

  13. #12
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    I'm not going there Derek. At this ratesharpening will have too big a vocabulary for me. I'm getting too old to learn a new language. Still, we all know sharp when it cuts us.
    Cheers,
    Jim

  14. #13
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    Measure the bevel angles to see what you got from the factory.
    Clean any packing and shipping crud off the tool. I use a clean piece of flannel cloth
    with light-weight motor oil (just so ever lightly stained with oil) to give the
    steel a wipe-down.
    Then, what improvement do you think goes from there? I'd get stuck into it
    and see how they perform! Never willing to mess with success.

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