Thread: elctrical connection between tablesaw and dust collector

Not much available apart from very expensive automatic switches
You could put a 3 pin wall socket on the saw that gets its power feed via the on\off switch. Plug the dusty into it and leave it turned on.
When you turn the saw on the dusty will also power up.

I have my power feeder hooked up like this so it comes on with the saw.

I know it's more convenient to have them hooked up together but I don't because of the initial power drain on start-up. It's bad enough with the saw, the shed lights dim, the computer re-boots, the bloody digital clocks re-set themselves, the street lights go out, the disco down the road shuts down, mice at the Yallourn Power Station start peddling faster etc.

But seriously, I think you'll find it's better and safer to have them on separate circuits and turn them on and off independantly.

echnidna:
If you're going to connect a 3 pin wall socket to the saw switch, isn't it just as easy to connect the dusty directly to the same switch?
Will it be obvious how to do this once I take the screws off the plugs, switches (I'm a sparky ignoramus: do I go by the colours of the wires, or do I have to trace wires back to individual pins in the 3 pin plugs? Or do I do like nike and 'just do it'?

Gumby:
I'll try switching the TS and DC on at the same time tonight, and see if I can bring down the Adelaide grid...or maybe get the Melbourne mice pedalling faster; I think Adelaide buys some electrickery from Melb, as we don't have enough of our own (

BTW Gumby: thanks for the tip in the other thread about zc inserts. Got well on the way to making a couple last night, will hopefully finish tonight

ZenWood

Hey. here is some thing to consider. On power up (no mater 115/240 or HP) an A/C motor drawn 10 time the amps that it draws at operating speed with no load. This 10 times draw is only at start up, and it that amount of amps quickly drops as the moter comes to speed. With 2 motors starting at the same time the amp draw is 20 times more ( no rocket science there ), and duble the time it will take two motor to get to speed and the time your breaker will get a max draw. This is not good on a breaker, and when a breaker fails it is not prety.

There is still a ray of hope here in all this gloom. It you can use, and feel that your wiring and breakers can handle both running at the same time and on the same circiut, just make a short extion cord with in line switch that you can mount next to your saws switch. Turn on the DC wait a few Sec turn on the saw and go.

Terry

Why dont you change to the power lead on the DC to a longer one. (buy cheap extenstion cord $17.00 at big B) cut it in half then wire a self contained switch in to it (like a lamp) and mount the switch next to the table saw switch so you turn on both sepratley but from the same spot.

I am currently looking in to using remote control light switches to switch the DC on.
If I can find a set up with a few controllers I can leave one at each tool requiring DC.

I am a sparky so I should be okay.

Probably not as simple as I have made it sound here but I will let you know how it goes.

The only problem is that I am at work for 2 weks at a time and only home for 1 so things can take a little while. At least I have an excuse

Jack.

Originally Posted by zenwood

Will it be obvious how to do this once I take the screws off the plugs, switches (I'm a sparky ignoramus: do I go by the colours of the wires, or do I have to trace wires back to individual pins in the 3 pin plugs? Or do I do like nike and 'just do it'?

If you go down the diy line beware of colours , A lot of japaneese wiring to tools in japan has a red earth wire.
dont you have a more knowageable neighbour/ mate who for a beer would show you what to do , I mean it aint rocket science but it can still kill you.


Russell


Earth is the insane asylum for the universe.

I tried switching the TS and the DC on at the same time, and it didn't bring down the Adelaide grid. In fact the lights didn't even dim. I conclude the the idea is feasible.

Originally Posted by Ashore

If you go down the diy line beware of colours , A lot of japaneese wiring to tools in japan has a red earth wire.

I took off the switch covers for the TS and DC and peeked inside. There were similar coloured wires in both: yellow with a green stripe for earth, and a blue one and a brown one. These went from the mains inputs to the switch, attached with spade (?) lugs. Then a variety of coloured wires, went from the other switch poles off to the motors. There wasn't much room behind there, and the wires would probably have to be connected outside the switch box. Can I do something like the drawing? How do you tell which is neutral and which is live?

A volt metter or load meter will tell you what is live, but remember to check on the live ( or in ) side of the switch, or have a friend with the Exp to check then for you if your not fimiler with the operation of one.

Why not leave both machines switched on and use the power point to switch them on and off.

Zen
I would be more likely to put a "j box " and use BP (screw connectors) rather than solder in that it will be easier to disconnect for repairs etc
When you buy a j box they usually come with 3 or 4 BP connectors . use the one with the two screws for the earth with both screws holding the earth wire but again I would suggest you enlist the help of a lecco


Russell



Earth is the insane asylum for the universe.

As to checking which one is live a $14 to $20 dick smith digital multi meter is enough and a must in any handymans tool box.

Looking at a power point the top left socket "Brown wire into plug" should be active, blue wire neutral and green is earth
To check power always set your meter to ~max . The ~ indicates alternating power.

Again however the disclaimer Get a Proper lecco to do it, my advice is for general information only


Russell



Earth is the insane asylum for the universe.

Originally Posted by speedy

Why not leave both machines switched on and use the power point to switch them on and off.

Because the switch is wired so that when power is lost the circuit is disconnected (safety). Switching off the power point opens the switch and the machines will not start again until power is available AND the switch is energised.

Jack.

Zenwood
There are a number of things you should understand about your proposal. Firstly your table saw and dust collector should be just considered as appliances which come with a three pin plug which means they are each capable of being connected to a standard 10A rated general purpose outlet (GPO), or in common language a power point. You wouldn't wire up your washing machine and clothes dryer in the manner proposed and neither should you and IT WOULD BE ILLEGAL.
You could of course connect your table saw and dust collector through an ancilliary device for the purpose that you desire, that is for a single switching operation to start both devices. To do so you should seek out someone with the skill and appropriate knowledge, but your existing shed circuitry and electricity distribution should be considered also.
I don't know the ratings of your table saw and dust collector but let's assume they are both 2HP.
1HP=746Watts, therefore 2HP=1492Watts. W=V x A, therefore dividing 1492 by 240V gives 6.2A full load current(FLC). However, starting current for an induction motor is generall considered to be 7 x FLC which =43.5A. That means for a number of cycles the current drawn by say a 2HP table saw is 43.5A through a 10A rated GPO. Because this current is so high, even for a short time, you should never start a 2HP motor by switching at the power point. Of course it can be done, but the question is, how long before significant arching takes place and the power point becomes burnt out. On the other hand, and I don't know the rating or duty cycle of the switch on the table saw, this switch has been or should have been selected to withstand these high starting currents. That is it's primary function, to switch an inductive load being a 2HP motor.
Whilst the GPO will carry 43.5A for a few cycles that is OK because the heating effect of carrying the current for such a short time is within the GPO's capability but switching a motor causes significant heating and arching. Also of course a GPO should happily carry the FLC of 6.2A for as long as you want.
If you were now to combine loads, that is the table saw and dust collector, you have 87A starting current and 12.4A FLC. I wouldn't like to be the one flicking the switch on the GPO. Even if the switching took place through another device, the GPO is overloaded at 12.4A, given that it's rating is 10A. Yes, the GPO would carry 12.4A but the question is for how long before it burns out.
My advice is that if you have 2HP machines, connect them to two different GPO's, these could be on the same circuit or better still off different circuits. If the machines are 1HP and 2HP do the same thing if you can. If the machines are both 1HP then you could get away with connecting them to the same GPO.
With regard to wire colours, the current Australian standard for 3 core flex is active(brown), neutral(blue) and earth(green/yellow). Earlier it was active(red), neatral(black) and earth(green).
Always remember safety first and protect you and your family.
I hope all of this helps.

Regards from Adelaide
Trevor