Thread: Makita grinder just crapped itself... Warranty technical question

Originally Posted by jack620

My reason for avoiding Ozito isn’t shame, it’s because they are sh*te.

Just pondering my collection of power tools. Two Metabo angle grinders, Metabo rotary hammer, Metabo ROS, Metabo cordless drill, Metabo 240V drill, Makita planer, Makita router, Festool router, Festool ROS, Protool cordless drill. Paslode cordless framing nailer. Most of those are about 30 years old and some have been absolutely flogged. All still going strong. I’ve never called in the warranty on any of them. So I don’t agree there’s no point in paying for quality.

I've had three makitas fail in the last year and half. YMMV I guess... Maybe that'll be the end of it - hopefully. Because the time to deal with it's a pain in the and a waste of valuable time and energy.

Interestingly, the ones that have failed get very little use by comparison to the rest of the gear thats used 5 or 6 days a week. And other than the trimmer, when I had all corded makita, I never had a failure in 45 years. I'm a late comer to cordless but with the time to string leads and pay every six months for test and tag they're not worth it anymore.

Originally Posted by jack620

When I worked at Bunnings during COVID they would happily provide a new tool if it was Ozito or or XU1. "Proper" tools usually had to go back to the manufacturer for repair. This was the manufacturer's policy, not Bunnings.

Spin Doctors summation of statutory warranties and consumer law was accurate.

Originally Posted by GraemeCook

Spin Doctors summation of statutory warranties and consumer law was accurate.

Was it? His main complaint was that Bunnings wouldn't replace his dead Makita grinder, but rather they wanted to have it repaired:

"I phone Bunnings and they said they send Makita off to be fixed... Well great. That means it'll be gone for 3 months. Now here's the technical part of it. I was on the ACCC website and the wording seems to indicate it's my choice as to whether I request repair or replace for a major fault - which a completely dead tool is a major fault... So, am I reading the law correctly and IT IS MY CHOICE? Or is it Bunnings choice?"

This is from the ACCC website (my bolding):

Other types of remedies
If a good does not meet a statutory condition or
statutory warranty after a consumer has owned
it for some time or used it a lot, it is still a breach
of contract. However, the consumer may not be
entitled to rely upon the right under the Act to
cancel or rescind the contract and claim a full
refund.
In these cases, the consumer may still be entitled
to another form of remedy from the seller for the
breach of contract, such as:
• the replacement of the goods, or the supply of
equivalent goods
• repair of the goods, or paying for the cost of
repair.
It is up to the consumer and seller to negotiate
a solution that is acceptable to each party. If the
consumer and seller cannot negotiate a remedy, a
court or tribunal may decide what is reasonable in
the circumstances in accordance with the law.
As a guide, if a seller breaches a contract with
a consumer because a good does not meet a
statutory condition or warranty, the consumer will
be entitled to a remedy which puts them in the
same situation as if there had been no breach of
contract.
Having a good repaired is one of the most
common ways this result can be achieved.

So, it's neither his choice, nor Bunnings. It is to be negotiated. And having it repaired is a common outcome.

Originally Posted by The Spin Doctor

I've had three makitas fail in the last year and half. YMMV I guess...

My mileage certainly does vary! None in 30 years vs three in 18 months. My Makita stuff is all Made in Japan. Yours probably China? Perhaps cordless are less reliable than 240V? Or maybe you're asking too much from them?

Originally Posted by jack620

My mileage certainly does vary! None in 30 years vs three in 18 months. My Makita stuff is all Made in Japan. Yours probably China? Perhaps cordless are less reliable than 240V? Or maybe you're asking too much from them?

I've always had a feeling the corded have simpler electronics and more robust than cordless. Definitely not because I'm pushing them too far.

I would have over a dozen Makita battery tools and they cop a hiding. I have only broken two impact drivers as a result of dropping from heights, they still work but no longer have reverse function so the impact damages something
Prior to moving to battery I had a lot of corded gear and have found it to be equally as reliable but it mostly sits in the shed these days as the battery gear is superior

Originally Posted by Beardy

Prior to moving to battery I had a lot of corded gear and have found it to be equally as reliable but it mostly sits in the shed these days as the battery gear is superior

Beardy

Like you I have accumulated quite a few cordless tools, some of which were inherited from my son when he went overseas. I go to the cordless tools first, most of which are the 18V variety, but I still have the corded tools, which I resort too if I want real grunt (angle grinders for example) or speed (drills for example). The only area the cordless tool is superior is the impact driver, primarily because I don't have a corded equivalent. Actually, I do have a corded Lesto screwdriver (it was for slotted screws), which I converted to a hex head roofing screw driver, but particularly up on a roof, the cordless tool is much better.

The big advantage of cordless tools is their convenience and movability, not to mention not falling over the cord or requiring a power source. My tools are Milwaukee, Panasonic and AEG (inherited).

Regards
Paul

Originally Posted by jack620

My reason for avoiding Ozito isn’t shame, it’s because they are sh*te.

I’ve got an Ozito 2 speed hammer drill for 8 years that has been flogged to death in concrete and still going strong. I also have a 6 year old Ozito Reciprocating saw that has had heavy use including shaping old sleepers for garden edging and once again, is still going strong.
Maybe I’ve been lucky.

Originally Posted by Lappa

Maybe I’ve been lucky.

Maybe. Remember the old GMC brand of power tools? GMC = Genuine Makita Copy.

Well GMC tools were manufactured by Techtronics Industries (TTI) of Hong Kong but with their factories across the border in Shenzen, China. GMC tools either lasted ten minutes or over ten years, but it did not matter as they had an incredible "no questions asked warranty replacement policy". You got a lemon, they replaced it, sometimes repeatedly until you got a good tool. And those good tools were bullet proof!

Ozita tools are made by TTI.

I worked in the Bunnings tool shop for six months. I’ve never owned an Ozito tool, but I’ve handled plenty. My issue with Ozito isn’t so much their longevity, it’s that they look and feel like junk. The switches are terrible. The guards are flimsy. The case, if provided, is awful. Locking knobs are cheap plastic moulded onto a metal thread. Plastic knobs aren’t necessarily a bad thing. My Festool router has them. But there’s plastic, and then there’s Ozito plastic.

I’m clearly in the minority though, because we sold heaps of them.

The majority of Ozito tools are pretty basic with crap tolerances and somewhat shabby components; you definitely get what you pay for. But sometimes they accidentally get it right!

1: SDS drill. I'm on my second after 10 years; I pretty much use it a lightweight jack hammer. The first one only got replaced because it crapped the chuck; the rest of the drill was fine
2: 9" angle grinder. Builders love them as they just keep on going and going.

You are absolutely correct with your appraisal of their build quality. A few years ago I needed a 9" grinder; my choices (at Bunnings) were either a $209 DeWalt or a $69 Ozito. Knowing at the time my very light use of the tool would almost guarantee the Ozito would outlast me I still went for the DeWalt... because it felt better in my hands but more importantly the guard was more substantial and could be adjusted without having to reach for a screwdriver.

Originally Posted by SpinDoctor

The warranty process is DELIBERATELY designed to undermine the customer.

It is even more basic than that; the purpose of a warranty is to restrict a customers common law rights. The history is interesting.

Back in medieval England there was a very extensive network of trade guilds. The guilds specified the minimum standards of work of their members and the members guaranteed (or warrantied) the standards of their work to their customers. Then, over the centuries, those guarantees got incorporated into the Common Law.

Then, with the growth of factory production in the 1800's, those factories produced much cheaper than the craftsmen, but not necessarily to Guild standards. Disputes inevitably arose. This cost the factory owners money, whether they won or lost. Their lawyers derived a solution. They issued written guarantees with their products that severely restricted the customers rights. It must break within 6 months, we decide if it was fair wear & tear, etc, and write the guarantee certificate so that it reads like we are actually giving the customer a special benefit. Most of them are so stupid they won't realise, and if they do then they are powerless. We have $$$'s.

This system applied for almost 150 years; then came the rise of consumerism.

Australian Consumer Law and statutory guarantees go part way towards reinstating customer protections to what they were 200 years ago.

Originally Posted by jack620

I worked in the Bunnings tool shop for six months. I’ve never owned an Ozito tool, but I’ve handled plenty. My issue with Ozito isn’t so much their longevity, it’s that they look and feel like junk. The switches are terrible. The guards are flimsy. The case, if provided, is awful. Locking knobs are cheap plastic moulded onto a metal thread. Plastic knobs aren’t necessarily a bad thing. My Festool router has them. But there’s plastic, and then there’s Ozito plastic.

I’m clearly in the minority though, because we sold heaps of them.

Hence the reason no one will even borrow them, let alone steal them on site. They're such %^&* it's almost comical LOL. Your festool however, you'd need to keep a real close eye on it - all the time.

I wouldn't even waste the time trying to take them back, just fling it in the skip bin and get out the spare and pick of a couple more if and when I drive by bunnings... Another benefit is they're nothing but an instant tax deduction. Problem with the expensive gear is they supposed to be depreciated because they're most often over $300. Makes for a hassle at tax time - at least for me having a big deductions sheet going year after year.

I have a real cheap, brand that mitre 10 sells, cordless drop saw. They listed it for 300 and I asked if there was some leeway on that... The guy had to phone the manager and I got it for the demo price of $150. Other than the battery doesn't last super long (so I ordered a second for $60), it works great. I have no concerns leaving that onsite for days. I'm more concerned for the platform it sits on. I only take the battery so I have no liability if someone tries to use it. It's a third of the weight of my Makita (which is really nice when you're 60 and needing to haul that beast in and out of the truck every day), cost a quarter and no one will touch it. And! with a new blade will cut fairly accurate mitres!!

The company I contract to has given me a new Toyota van to use and offered to kit it out with drawers and Festool. I said under no circumstances do I want Festool. Told them, I'd spend half my day watching them. I couldn't even leave the van doors open with such gear. I also asked if they had an older van in the fleet I could have. The manager didn't quite understand till I said I don't want to be the first to scratch or dent it LOL (And don't want to contend with the jealousy the other guys'll have).

Originally Posted by GraemeCook

Australian Consumer Law and statutory guarantees go part way towards reinstating customer protections to what they were 200 years ago.

My experience with most companies, small or large, is they rely on the consumer being ignorant of their legal rights and they train their staff that way. I.e. There is no way the returns desk staff at bunnings or any company are trained on the ACL, they're trained on what the company wants them to know and do, and it often contravenes the law. YMMV

I may get my way because I do my homework, but the other 200 behind me get ripped off. It's amazing how you can get employees and supervisors of companies to back peddle when you do your homework, but it seems most consumers are too lazy and companies know that.