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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by ian View Post
    Another possibility ...

    just thinking -- the container is made of steel, a flexible nail should bend and become a "clinched" after it passes through the batten and hits the wall of the container
    I pondered that one as well. Skew brads wouldn't take much encouragement to bend as they hit the steel. Concern is that the battens are only glued to the steel and a succession of little hits from the brads could gradually wedge the battens off the steel. Might not, but it'd be a big mess if it happened.

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  3. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by nutwood View Post
    I pondered that one as well. Skew brads wouldn't take much encouragement to bend as they hit the steel. Concern is that the battens are only glued to the steel and a succession of little hits from the brads could gradually wedge the battens off the steel. Might not, but it'd be a big mess if it happened.
    Would of 35 x 70's been an option? yes you would of lost a few mils in floor space but would of given a wider fixing option and also would of allowed a greater depth of screw?

  4. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Last Dog View Post
    Would of 35 x 70's been an option? yes you would of lost a few mils in floor space but would of given a wider fixing option and also would of allowed a greater depth of screw?
    Totally agree! Sometimes we don't get everything we want.
    Nothing like a challenge!

  5. #19
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    Would of loved to be down with you and giving you a hand. But going back to the original question with the nail gun..... no ideas.. Good luck on this and all the best, there's enough experience on the site to hopefully sort the options out.

  6. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Last Dog View Post
    Would of loved to be down with you and giving you a hand. But going back to the original question with the nail gun..... no ideas.. Good luck on this and all the best, there's enough experience on the site to hopefully sort the options out.
    Thanks for that. Reckon I'm going to be sick of a metallic echo by the time I'm done!

  7. #21
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    can you beef up the 50 x 25 battens by attaching a second 50 x 25 on top of what has already been glued to the container?
    would give you around 35 mm of holding and still allow air nailing with your existing kit
    regards from Alberta, Canada

    ian

  8. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by ian View Post
    can you beef up the 50 x 25 battens by attaching a second 50 x 25 on top of what has already been glued to the container?
    would give you around 35 mm of holding and still allow air nailing with your existing kit
    It'd also cost the client some 50mm of floor space which is the reason 70 x 35's weren't used initially. To some extent, I see their point. Containers are awfully long and narrow and anything that eats width is a problem.
    I believe the cutting edge in the world of container use is insulating paint, where you simply spray layers on and leave the steel wall as is. I reckon the job I'm working on is going to be pretty efficient; minimum 20mm air gap, 8mm thermal break (silver front and back) and then 20mm hardwood. They've still sacrificed 96mm of floor width, some 4% of a 2.4m container but I reckon it'll work well, as long as I don't stuff up and the walls fall in!
    I don't begrudge spending some $'s on a gun to do the job, as long as it does the job. I'll still have it at the end of the job and I can't think of a quality tool that I've ever purchased that, ten years later, I've regretted buying.

  9. #23
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    if screws are just too labour intensive, can one of your existing guns be used to fire nails on a skew?
    fired through the face of the T&G -- not secret nailed -- at 30° to vertical, I'm calculating there's just enough length for a 2-1/2in nail not to bottom out
    regards from Alberta, Canada

    ian

  10. #24
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    lara
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    Default Hitachi stapler

    Hello

    I'd recommend the Hitachi N3804AB3 stapler. I also have Senco stapler, but I found the Hitachi much better and lighter. It also takes longer (up to 38 mm) staples. Senco jammed on me few times, the Hitachi never. I got mine from Total Tools over year ago for about $150.

    Staples will hold plywood much better.


    http://www.sydneytools.com.au/produc...-crown-stapler


    I get my staples from Trade Tools:
    https://www.tradetools.com/category/nailguns-and-staplers/nails-and-staples/staples


    Attached Files Attached Files

  11. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by ian View Post
    if screws are just too labour intensive, can one of your existing guns be used to fire nails on a skew?
    fired through the face of the T&G -- not secret nailed -- at 30° to vertical, I'm calculating there's just enough length for a 2-1/2in nail not to bottom out
    It would work but I think it's a bit brutal. I've got two Bostich framing guns, one's a coil nailer and the other's a T nailer. Not sure about the T nailer as I always use 3" but I've got 2" coils that I use in the N86 for weather board. They work OK on WRC with the air down low but on HW, you have to turn the pressure up a bit and they tend to split the boards. The big heads are a bit ugly too. OK outside, but inside?

  12. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by gms002a View Post
    Hello

    I'd recommend the Hitachi N3804AB3 stapler. I also have Senco stapler, but I found the Hitachi much better and lighter. It also takes longer (up to 38 mm) staples. Senco jammed on me few times, the Hitachi never. I got mine from Total Tools over year ago for about $150.

    Staples will hold plywood much better.


    http://www.sydneytools.com.au/produc...-crown-stapler


    I get my staples from Trade Tools:
    https://www.tradetools.com/category/nailguns-and-staplers/nails-and-staples/staples



    That's interesting about the Hitachi. I've had a very good run out of Hitachi power tools. Not as sophisticated as some others but I've yet to kill one whereas, until recently, I had a large box full of dead power tools of other brands. I wondered what their pneumatic equipment was like.
    Would your stapler reliably drive a 38mm staple into dry hardwood (species unknown - "Tas Oak")? I've little experience of serious staplers and am worried the staple will crumple up rather than drive fully in.

  13. #27
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    can I suggest you experiment a bit with the guns you have and shorter nails
    I think the "problem" is going to be the 8mm of insulation -- the tip of the nail will essentially be unsupported when, after passing through the insulation, it hits the HW batten. I think this will be more of an issue with staples rather than nails.

    can you fire a few trial nails/staples at you local tool supplier?

    assuming the client intends hanging stuff on the T&G walls you may have no choice other than to tack nail and then come back and screw fix
    regards from Alberta, Canada

    ian

  14. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by nutwood View Post
    That's interesting about the Hitachi. I've had a very good run out of Hitachi power tools. Not as sophisticated as some others but I've yet to kill one whereas, until recently, I had a large box full of dead power tools of other brands. I wondered what their pneumatic equipment was like.
    Would your stapler reliably drive a 38mm staple into dry hardwood (species unknown - "Tas Oak")? I've little experience of serious staplers and am worried the staple will crumple up rather than drive fully in.

    Just tried the 38mm staples on very old 20mm hardwood to hardwood. I shot 30 - none crumpled, but I had to increase pressure to about 120psi. At 90psi ~3-4 mm was exposed.
    But 19mm ply to hardwood was no problem at 90psi, they went all the way down.
    Didn't try with the insulation in the middle though. 38mm may not be enough.


    In last few years I've used thousands of staples and only few did crumple (I'm talking about the 80 series staples).

    Sorry, I mislead you here. I meant 90 series narrow crown (6.4mm 18 gauge) staples, not the 80s.

  15. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by gms002a View Post
    Just tried the 38mm staples on very old 20mm hardwood to hardwood. I shot 30 - none crumpled, but I had to increase pressure to about 120psi. At 90psi ~3-4 mm was exposed.
    But 19mm ply to hardwood was no problem at 90psi, they went all the way down.
    Didn't try with the insulation in the middle though. 38mm may not be enough.


    In last few years I've used thousands of staples and only few did crumple (I'm talking about the 80 series staples).
    Many thanks for trying the experiment. My interest in staples is the thinner gauge and two legs. It's very interesting that none bent. I've got 150 psi from my compressor so I can handle that OK. I'm in the process of trying to set up a test, as per Ian's suggestion. He's made a very good point. If I angle, the fastener will go through the first layer fine but it won't be guided when it hits the second and that insulation gap may cause havoc.
    I've got a little bit caught on this job as I was asked about the feasibility, without anyone mentioning the insulation. Wood to wood, I'd be happy. This carpenter is happy to glue! My fall back plan, if it starts to go pear shape, is a few 304SS CS self tappers. Straight through the timber/insulation/timber and out through the steel. Grind off flush and fix paint. Terrible for the thermal barrier but really good for stopping the wall falling in.

  16. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by nutwood View Post
    Many thanks for trying the experiment. My interest in staples is the thinner gauge and two legs. It's very interesting that none bent. I've got 150 psi from my compressor so I can handle that OK. I'm in the process of trying to set up a test, as per Ian's suggestion. He's made a very good point. If I angle, the fastener will go through the first layer fine but it won't be guided when it hits the second and that insulation gap may cause havoc.
    I've got a little bit caught on this job as I was asked about the feasibility, without anyone mentioning the insulation. Wood to wood, I'd be happy. This carpenter is happy to glue! My fall back plan, if it starts to go pear shape, is a few 304SS CS self tappers. Straight through the timber/insulation/timber and out through the steel. Grind off flush and fix paint. Terrible for the thermal barrier but really good for stopping the wall falling in.

    If I was you, I'd cheat a bit. Imagine that you make some 8mm ply rectangles(same thickness as the insulation), say 50x25mm, cut out some of the insulation and fill the gaps with these rectangles (glue and staple them to the 50x25s using 25mm staples/nails). Build a grid of those rectangles and you will have wood to wood scenario. You may have to remember/mark location of these rectangles so you can staple/nail/screw and GLUE!!! the ply to them. That's all.
    Loss of thermal insulation will be minimal but the whole contraption will be much stronger.

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