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  1. #16
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
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    Nerang Queensland
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    66
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    10,766

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    What JohnG said

    If there is a lot of dirt/crap you could try the TCT chain. Stihl TCT chains have the carbide on top and come off easily but apparently they don’t make it for 404 anyway. I bought mine off EBay and it has full cutting face carbide so I am impressed. Diamond files are readily available these days so sharpening is not an issue, just remember to sharpen when dulling not when blunt. Also be wary of heat as the chain stretches easily
    Neil
    ____________________________________________
    Every day presents an opportunity to learn something new

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  3. #17
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Melbourne
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    1,091

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    This is trying not to be an ad, but trying to throw some more information into the discussion. Most of the time we use a Stihl 3/8th low profile full compliment chains semi-chisel chain with with 10 degree tooth angle. This chain is quite thin so as it's cutting less timber (kerf is about 6mm) requires less chainsaw power than a wider chain. You would not use such a thin cross cutting chain on long bars, but we use this up to 90cm bars when ripping. It produces a fine finish surface. Good for a variety of timber species, soft and hard. When ripping hard, dry or wide slabs, I add bar/chain water cooling to the milling jig... I'd do this with any chain though.

  4. #18
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Perth
    Posts
    27,757

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    Quote Originally Posted by nt900 View Post
    This is trying not to be an ad, but trying to throw some more information into the discussion. Most of the time we use a Stihl 3/8th low profile full compliment chains semi-chisel chain . . . . .
    I use lopro on my 441 (71cc) with a 25" bar and that's about as long a bar and as large a saw as I would be prepared to go in the woods I cut. Several blokes on the arborist site use it with 660's and 36" bars and one bloke cut all the timber for a large barn with it although that was softwood. My 880 would stretch lopro too far even on a short bar. My 660 needs a rebuild but the parts I bought for it are going to turn it into a 100cc saw so it will probably be too much for lopro.

    Another issue is that the lopro 3/8 drive and nose sprockets are not the same as regular 3/8 sprockets and they are not that easy to come by. Using standard 3/8 sprockets with lopro chain will result in the chain jumping the sprocket so the tendency is for operators to over tighten the chain which is not good either. I made my own lopro drive sprocket by turning down a 404 sprocket to the right diameter . The nose sprocket on my 25" bar is worn enough so that the lopro chain just manages to get around it without jumping.

  5. #19
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    1,091

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    Quote Originally Posted by BobL View Post
    I use lopro on my 441 (71cc) with a 25" bar and that's about as long a bar and as large a saw as I would be prepared to go in the woods I cut. Several blokes on the arborist site use it with 660's and 36" bars and one bloke cut all the timber for a large barn with it although that was softwood. My 880 would stretch lopro too far even on a short bar. My 660 needs a rebuild but the parts I bought for it are going to turn it into a 100cc saw so it will probably be too much for lopro.

    Another issue is that the lopro 3/8 drive and nose sprockets are not the same as regular 3/8 sprockets and they are not that easy to come by. Using standard 3/8 sprockets with lopro chain will result in the chain jumping the sprocket so the tendency is for operators to over tighten the chain which is not good either. I made my own lopro drive sprocket by turning down a 404 sprocket to the right diameter . The nose sprocket on my 25" bar is worn enough so that the lopro chain just manages to get around it without jumping.
    Hi BobL. I expect you know this already, but for the benefit of others...

    With Stihl 3/8th low pro chain the drive link is 1.3mm gauge... Stihl name this 'picco'. So you need a 3/8th lowpro 'picco' bar which will have the correct nose sprocket and 1.3mm gauge groove for the drive link.

    I use lopro chain up to the Stihl MS661, 92cc saw, 50cm to 90cm bars. Surprisingly you can get a 3/8th lowpro drive sprocket for this chainsaw. Although I use lowpro chain on a Stihl MS391 62cc with standard 3/8th spur sprocket (can't get a lopro sprocket for this one), but with no major issues. I find some chainsaw stores do not recommend this, and other stores have no problem supporting running a 3/8th lopro chain on a standard 3/8th drive sprocket. *You can't run a standard 3/8th chain on a 3/8th lopro drive sprocket.

    As you suggest, an MS880 might be too much stress on a lowpro chain. Myself, I use standard 3/8th full compliment chain with tooth angle of 10 degrees on an MS880, bars 75cm up to 120cm. The MS880 with this chain cuts fast and leaves areal nice smooth finish on the slab.

  6. #20
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Perth
    Posts
    27,757

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    I tried running lopro on a std 3/8 rim sprocket and as I knew the issue I was careful about chain adjustment and even paused after about a few minutes use to readjusted the chain tension. Despite this, after about 15 minutes of use the chain jumped the sprocket. The first jump must have stretched the link that jumped the sprocket too far because after that the chain would repeated jump the sprocket (including one time when the chain gave me a fair thump between the legs). As that chain was near new I removed the stretched section of the chain and replaced it with a new section and tried again and the same thing happened. Then I made my own correct size rim sprocket from a 404 sprocket and none of the chains since then have jumped that sprocket. It's worth knowing that a spur sprocket does not have the same problem

  7. #21
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
    Location
    Bunbury
    Posts
    14

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    Just tried out the EVO II chain from GB. Used it for cutting some jarrah fire wood. After the first couple of rings had to retension the chain ,but after that no problem. Held its edge pretty well and sharpened back to good point. For the price its well worth it. $116 for a 25ft roll and made up 4 chains for my 066. The local shop wanted $88 for one chain.

  8. #22
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    52

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    Quote Originally Posted by dai sensei View Post
    What JohnG said

    If there is a lot of dirt/crap you could try the TCT chain. Stihl TCT chains have the carbide on top and come off easily but apparently they don’t make it for 404 anyway. I bought mine off EBay and it has full cutting face carbide so I am impressed. Diamond files are readily available these days so sharpening is not an issue, just remember to sharpen when dulling not when blunt. Also be wary of heat as the chain stretches easily
    My saw is a Stihl 038 Super. About a 1980 model. I used to cut the firewood for 4 families and more so the saw was used quite a bit and mostly the wood was half burnt, dirty etc. I also had access to unlimited, old, railway sleepers but I avoided cutting these as they were too hard and I could only get 4 or 5 cuts with the standard chain. Someone, at the time, suggested trying a new type of chain. TCT. I priced one for my 20" bar and at around $300 it was about a third of the price of a new saw! However, everybody chipped in and I bought one. I noticed at first that it did not cut as well as a standard chain but, as someone else has said in this thread, about 80%. The thing was though, I did not have to get that chain sharpened for 2 years and I cut tonnes of sleepers also. It so impressed me that I tried to talk the local RFS into buying one, but they said they couldn't afford it?? I felt it would have been ideal as basically all the wood that the RFS guys were cutting was burnt etc etc and not many knew how to sharpen any chains, especially in the dark.
    In the past few years I have since bought 2 or 3 more TCT chains but each one does not seem as good as the previous one. maybe the tungsten is not as good now, but they are cheaper.

  9. #23
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Location
    eastgippsland vic
    Age
    60
    Posts
    6

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    gday all just joined here on the forum .... if any of you blokes like using carlton .404 you better get what you can
    because BLOUNT I think the parent company is called has dropped it from production .......


    cheers D
    Last edited by deye223; 19th October 2018 at 10:18 PM. Reason: spelling

  10. #24
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Rochester, vic
    Posts
    310

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    Yep, agree with John and Acco, semi chisel is the way to go if your logs are dirty, filing with a slightly reduced angle. I used to use skip tooth full chisel in the forests in Tassie in very clean timber with great results, but touch the bar nose in the dirt when prepping out a mill log and you are done for, very unforgiving. The Tassie 'hardwoods' seem hard until you get into an old yellowbox back home in Victoria, then you really know what hardwood is.

    As mentioned earlier, finding good chain on special is a great option. We go through about 70 chains a year, and find that it is cheaper to get them in bulk on special than make them up. I think we pay $33 per loop for 20' Stihl semi chisel, so we get $800 worth each time and it works out better than buying a roll, particularly if paying the workers to make them up.

    My grandfather, who was an old woodcutter, once told me "You'll bugger five chains before you learn how to really sharper a chain young fella!" He was right. Sharpening a chain to perfection while kneeling in the bush for everyday use is skill that many people are ok at but very few master. I reckon it takes about a year of full time timber cutting until you can quickly produce a chain you could shave with, but it sounds like you are on the right track tickling the chain up regularly.

    Good luck with it all,

    Cheers,

    James

  11. #25
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    251

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    Bought a couple of rolls of Hurricane to see how it went in .325 and 3/8 lopro. Snapped a few chains early on and didnt persist with it. I would stick to Stihl, Carlton etc. As you said, you get what you pay for.

  12. #26
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Location
    eastgippsland vic
    Age
    60
    Posts
    6

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    gday all I bought a 24" 84dl 3/8 skip chain from Hurricane and have been using it on ribbon gum and grey box
    so far it has done well ok . but if I could stop it from stretching would be good .

    I must say that when I got on to the grey box it kind of fell over I could just get 7 cuts an then I would have
    to sharpen but the tree was big enough that 7 rounds were enough for a meter .

    and with carlton or stihl it would be more like 15 cuts so I don't think I will be back for it .
    I will just have to put up with the $750 price tag of the stihl .......

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