Thread: Is it worth it ?? - buying a mill, selling timber & permits.

Welcome JCM

I started with my mill looking to build my own house...now over 7 years later I'm onto my second Lucas and have made a business out of things after learning a lot over the years and putting a fair amount of logs under the mill.

Personally I think, given what projects you have in mind, you'd probably need more timber than the cost of the mill and you have the resource for it so straight out you've saved money, then if after you've practiced on your own timber, got to a good standard of cutting you could still use it to produce a little income for yourself using your trees, or you could sell it after your finished cutting - you'd get a really good percentage of initial purchase price on selling it - therefore more saving.

I cut my own house (take a look on here for "the house that Lucas built") green off the saw, some things you need to understand when you are doing it, but I put gyprock/plasterboard on the walls and had no troubles up to 3 years later when I sold it.

Have a chat with Dudley at Lucas about buying one, if you have any q's about my personal experience over the years with my mill, by all means drop me an email or give me a ring when you have a free hour or two most everyone here would be tired of how much stuff I say about my Lucas.

On the selling timber side of things, you can do it, without too much trouble - biggest thing is, get cutting well before you go 'selling' timber and I mean really well, cut all your stuff first, learn from it before you try and sell some timber, it's the biggest thing that hurts us mobile guys is the jokers who try palming off crappy timber

Originally Posted by jcm89

G'day everyone
I'm thinking of buying a Lucas mill for our dairy operation and had a few questions. The main reason for buying the mill would be to cut enough timber to build a new machinery shed, car port, shed for the dairy yard etc, and possibly value adding with the selling of slabs etc, but I have been tossing up whether it would be worth it or not. We have quite a lot of grey box, mahogany, spotted gum and some forest red gum and i'm not sure what the market is for these timbers or whether they would make good structural timber?
Another thing I was wondering is whether you can safely get away with building the above sheds/structures using green timber because we dont really have the time to wait for it to air dry or the money to have it kiln dried.
Also are there any regulations/permits needed for using/selling farm timber?

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

cheers

Welcome JCM

All those species are good structural timber, although not all commercial species. If you went back about 60 years a large proportion of timber framed dwellings were built using green hardwood so I don't think you would have an issue there providing you build using traditional techniques.

I did see that in some states their bulding regulations required treated timber so just check with your local building inspector that your timber will be acceptable to them. That is if you need building permission for a farm shed, which you may not.

Sound advice from Sigidi. You could look at a new or good secondhand machine.

Regards
Paul

Hi JCM

I also bought my Lucasmill when I was building our house which has a green timber frame. It paid for itself very quickly. Since they pay for them self so quick I think the extra couple of grand to buy the 10" is definitively worth it. Especially being a farm shed your want to build you will be wanting to cut large beams I suppose to get big spans.
After putting the first 100 hours on my mill cutting my own timber and getting good at it, I started cutting for others and earned my money back on it again within a year. I do think that it is hard work and really respect people who do it full time for a living. The milling is the fun part but there is a lot of log and timber handling involved. I really had to make a choice to keep milling for others and invest in additional machinery which is a lot more harder to earn back or only keep doing it as a hobby for personal use, to avoid back injuries.
I suppose you having a farm means you already have extra machinery available.
I would suggest do it!

Great idea doing it my self take a look around there are more mills then lucas out there and more then a few types. and with our dollar atm I d take a look at the Peterson first, then the lucas as far as money goes. For avoiding the flak crap I d buy a lucas It depends how serious you are about getting into it. I ve brought a Baker Blue streak 3638G and edger

Originally Posted by Bernt

The milling is the fun part but there is a lot of log and timber handling involved. I really had to make a choice to keep milling for others and invest in additional machinery which is a lot more harder to earn back or only keep doing it as a hobby for personal use, to avoid back injuries.

Exactly. In the end, once you have got the milling techniques under your belt, it all becomes about how you handle the timber both before and after cutting. Not so hard to do when it is for yourself, but different when it is for others on a repetitive basis.

Regards
Paul

Thanks very much for your ideas everyone.
I had thought about second hand mills but I haven't been able to find many. I have searched the internet and farm/machinery trader magazine but to no avail. Any suggestions on where to find second hand gear?
Also what size machine would I be looking at for what I want to do?
I didn't really want to overcapitalize on a big machine just in case the whole idea was too optimistic so I was thinking the Lucas 6-18 or 7-23 with the slabber attachment ?
Also, when people say that the heartwood is termite resistant does that mean after the timber is dry or all the time?

Theres a lucas for sale on fleabay at the moment. I'd attach the link but don't know how.
In NSW you can harvest the timber on your farm for on farm use without a permit. If you decide you want to sell it you will need to apply for a PVP(private vegetation plan).

You obviously need to read up on timber and terminology. Best research the species you have as all are a little different in the characteristics, susceptibility to borers, durability and strength. As for termites ....... they are like cows in a paddock of oats. If they can get through the electric fence they'll eat the whole lot. Best install a termite barrier or some sort. No need to treat the timber species you mentioned.

regards
Steve

www.timber.net.au - The Australian Database of Timber - Home

Not sure who now, but a clever member shared this site recently. Good for a general description of the most common commercial timbers. You might find it useful.

take care
Gary

Originally Posted by jcm89

Thanks very much for your ideas everyone.
I had thought about second hand mills but I haven't been able to find many. I have searched the internet and farm/machinery trader magazine but to no avail. Any suggestions on where to find second hand gear?
Also what size machine would I be looking at for what I want to do?
I didn't really want to overcapitalize on a big machine just in case the whole idea was too optimistic so I was thinking the Lucas 6-18 or 7-23 with the slabber attachment ?
Also, when people say that the heartwood is termite resistant does that mean after the timber is dry or all the time?

It's hard finding second hand ones as they sell pretty quick - especially when priced fairly.

From what you've mentioned above, I'd personally suggest a 6-18 - the slabbing attachment is worth it's weight in gold (even at current prices ) in what it can do for you, even if you don't use it much at about $1k imagine how few good sized slabs you need to recover it's price??

Bruce, I'd suggest going to Peterson first too, then he'd know how good a deal he'd be getting with a Lucas hahahahaha What do you mean by the flak crap?

Gary, I found the Timber Net site to be rather light on info and species, but most states DPI will have much better lists and more comprehensive information. I've got Qld's DPI site bookmarked as it covers many more species and has much more depth of info

Thanks for that. I had not been to that site for a long while. Is this the one you were referring to?
Timber species - properties and uses | Primary industries & fisheries | Queensland Government

Agreed, it has a lot more detail and species than timbernet.

PS - I am much older than you, I am expected to forget!

I d go for this mill JCM except I ve already brough some thing else. A good mill has a log deck
and can be used on more then Just big old logs
PORTABLE SAWMILL KARA F2000 | eBay
but there is also this if you want to follow others advise.
eBay Australia: Buy new & used fashion, electronics & home d
I d also recomend buying your self some books too Like "wood in Australia" by Keith Bootle and "Forest trees of Australia"from CSIRO
Look at the Markets you open to you. Where I am in QLD every sunday at the local markets there s some one selling slab furniture at the markets at prices that make you wonder how they survive .But we also have a mill that will buy wholesale pehaps you ll have one locally that buys from small millers as well . You here stories of blokes hiring them selves and their mills out for $25 an hour. You ll also cop a little industry prejudiced towards the saw mills you use.In an other post thats been metioned this week. Think to the future as well looking at tassie over the last 2 weeks a ban on native logging. least with a kara type mill you can use it on plantation timbers just like a band mill. I ve gone from learning in here to doing out there and just like dairy farming its not a lifestyle but a way of life I ll not give up for quids.

Originally Posted by Halfdays

Thanks for that. I had not been to that site for a long while. Is this the one you were referring to?
Timber species - properties and uses | Primary industries & fisheries | Queensland Government

Agreed, it has a lot more detail and species than timbernet.

PS - I am much older than you, I am expected to forget!

Gary if "much older" is only 22 years, then that's a bit scary mate, you shouldn't say much older, just mention you increased wisdom

and yeah that's the site I was referring to.

and Bruce I beg to differ - a good mill has a log deck or no log deck, uses a band or a circular saw, can be electric or not, can be portable or fixed - its the operator that makes it good

Originally Posted by jcm89

G'day everyone

Also are there any regulations/permits needed for using/selling farm timber?

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

cheers

On this issue jcm89, In NSW you can harvest timber on your own property for use on your own property, once you want to sell it things change. You need a Property Vegetation Plan, a 15 year approval to harvest your timber and there are specific requirements on how you do this, to avoid overharvesting your forest.

http://www.environment.nsw.gov.au/re...NFPVP08126.pdf

The Hunter Farm Forestry Network might be a good place to start Hunter Farm Forestry Network as a place to get advice.

If you are simply felling trees on farm that aren't considered native vegetation then I assume you can do what you like.

Ash