Thread: Aus equivalent to Euro oak

It depends on what you mean by characteristics.

Visual characteristics, not much is close, but the closest things are the woods with have "Oak" in their common name. Specifically members of the Grevillia, Allocasuarina, and Cardwellia genera, like Northern/Southern Silky Oak, Hairy Oak, Bull Oak/Buloke, River Oak, etc. These have the strong, pronounced, medullary ray structure which members of Quercus are known for having, and which is commonly embellished in furniture from the late 19th century, namely that of the Arts and Crafts Movement.

As far as material properties like hardness, etc., then that's a hard fit as well. Eucalypts are considerably harder and heavier than Oak. Oak is considered a hard, strong wood by American and Euro standards, but by Aussie standards it's practically a carver's wood. An open grained wood which is similar in hardness and density to Oak... Maybe Tasmanian Blackwood (Acacia melanoxylon)? It looks absolutely nothing like it, but it has some similarities with regards to how it works and feels. New Guinea Rosewood (Pterocarpus indicus [not endemic Australian, but certainly common there.]) maybe?

Why are you asking, and what is the project for which you are choosing an Oak proxy? Is it for its looks or its material properties?

Cheers,
Luke

is it for looks or material properties?

If material properties, then you have a myriad of choices.

If it's for the ring porous look -- i.e. Stickley / Greene and Greene -- your choices are much more limited.

If it's to build a replica of the Mary Rose, well ...

Only "English Oak" timber that I've ever seen and can be certain it is what that say it is is my mothers dining room table which is about 150 years old.

So based on my limited exposure to euro oak (because even a table that big is still a limited sample) I would say that the closest timber appearance wise would be Fishtail Oak.

None of the rainforest oaks, including fishtail, have the durability ratings of the european oak though.

The Tassie Oak/Vic Ash is nowhere close.

If you intend to build a replica of the Mary Rose I want lots of pictures.

Probably better to state what you are trying to make, or what you want to use the wood for, then we can recommend a suitable timber.

That isunless you are trying to repair something made out of European Oak

I can't recollect seeing any Australian timber as ugly as European Oak.

Firstly thanks for the useful info already supplied, and apologies for not being clear enough abut the intended use.

While the Mary Rose replica is a bit off, I'm actually searching for a local equivalent to Oak to build a (somewhat smaller) boat. The timber's appearance is not relevant but its physical characteristics are - the boat will be made with traditional methods including heating planks to then bend them. So similar (or at least decent) durability in a marine environment, similar hardness/ability to bend etc.

As these boats were all made from oak, I wanted to try to use a timber with similar characteristics even if this isn't the most ideal timber to use, just for the sake of similarity.

(And boating experts, feel free to suggest the best boat building timbers for a traditional build (except Huon Pine, I don't have THAT much money).

Thanks all

Originally Posted by Chrism3

I can't recollect seeing any Australian timber as ugly as European Oak.

Touche!

Spotted Gum would give you about the same bending resistance as oak. Colour would be similar and strength about equal. This timber is used extensively by boat builders for framing and cladding.
Australian Teak AKA Crows Ash is ideal for decking, hatch covers etc. Lignum Vitae for winch blocks if you really want to be authentic, but this stuff is as hard as a bull's forehead.

Originally Posted by polemic

Firstly thanks for the useful info already supplied, and apologies for not being clear enough abut the intended use.

While the Mary Rose replica is a bit off, I'm actually searching for a local equivalent to Oak to build a (somewhat smaller) boat. The timber's appearance is not relevant but its physical characteristics are - the boat will be made with traditional methods including heating planks to then bend them. So similar (or at least decent) durability in a marine environment, similar hardness/ability to bend etc.

As these boats were all made from oak, I wanted to try to use a timber with similar characteristics even if this isn't the most ideal timber to use, just for the sake of similarity.

(And boating experts, feel free to suggest the best boat building timbers for a traditional build (except Huon Pine, I don't have THAT much money).

Thank you for that additional information.

From the wood database

English Oak, European Oak -- scientific name: Quercus robur
Average dried weight -- 675 kg/m³
Janka Hardness gravity -- 4980 N
Modulus of Rupture -- 97.1 MPa
Elastic Modulus -- 10.6 GPa
Crushing strength -- 46.3 MPa
Shrinkage -- Radial 4.7%, Tangential 8.4%, Volumetric 13.0%

now to find an Australian timber with similar properties

Perhaps you should post on the Boat Forum as well. Got to be a good bet.

I have put the Spotted gum specs alongside in red

Originally Posted by ian

From the wood database

English Oak, European Oak -- scientific name: Quercus robur
Average dried weight -- 675 kg/m³ 970
Janka Hardness gravity -- 4980 N 11,000
Modulus of Rupture -- 97.1 MPa 150
Elastic Modulus -- 10.6 GPa 23
Crushing strength -- 46.3 MPa 75
Shrinkage -- Radial 4.7%, Tangential 8.4%, Volumetric 13.0% 3.7/5

So MUCH denser, harder, stronger (crush and bend), elastic, and less shrinkage. Why go anywhere else? The downside is it will be harder to work compered to oak.

I'm not boar builder but wasn't quite a bit of the Endeavour Replica made out of jarrah?

And weren't wooden ships used in ice bound waters also clad with Spotted gum.

BUT

the choice of English oak for polymic's original almost certainly reflects the sparsity of decent durable English hardwoods.
Beech and elm, the other common English hardwoods are both listed as non-durable.

For a boat, the choice of a wood that is significantly harder, stronger and with a higher elastic modulus is possibly not a wise choice as presumably polymic doesn't want to have to adjust his section sizes to mimic the elasticity of the original boat he is modelling.

Originally Posted by ian

For a boat, the choice of a wood that is significantly harder, stronger and with a higher elastic modulus is possibly not a wise choice as presumably polymic doesn't want to have to adjust his section sizes to mimic the elasticity of the original boat he is modelling.

That shows how little I know about boat building.

But Jarrah or Spotted Gum would make an interesting comparison (to Oak) should Polymic be intending to fire canon balls at his boat.