Thread: Timber species cross reference

Hi CQ,
Cant really help in your request but just reading the list of timbers I have a mast and a boom from a sail boat, which I think is Sitka Spruce not much timber but it might be enuff for part of your project if it can help.
I cut it in half to get it home...is 2 pieces about120x50x5m long and the boom is approx 50x50x5m long, Lotsa paint on it and some brass fittings,
Peter.

Peter

Many thanks for your offer. I see you are just up the road in Rocky, not too far from good old Gladstone where I'm based. At the moment I'd rather wait to see if I can work out some equivalents to those damn yankee species, will be very helpful going forward. I've been looking at tables of properties for various timbers and reading up but it's still pretty difficult to get a grasp of all of the concepts involved.

Hey CQChipper, If you go to the Wooden Boat Forum on this site there are some knowlegeable people there that could steer you in the right direction with local suitable boat timbers.

OK no worries CQ yep wooden boat forum
I used to live in Gladstone a while back, prefer it to rocky but oh well
Peter.

Thanks Pete and Cayman for your input. Sometimes you feel a bit isolated when you can't get good advice and assistance locally. I'll go to the Wooden Boat Forum and ask around.

One last thing, I hope I didn't offend our US woodies with my quip about "yankee" species. You see, one of my good friends here in Gladstone is a citizen of the US of A and real top bloke. As a term of endearment, I often call him the yank and he doesn't mind at all. He did point out however, that not all people of the US might take kindly to this type of reference. So my apologies to any US woodies who may feel offended. I have the greatest repect and admiration for just about everyone I have ever met from the US.

A brief update on my findings so far. There would appear to be no Aussie or commonly imported species to replace American Oak as it has a unique set of properties. However, there are ways around this. By a strange twist, Tassie Oak has many of the attributes similar to Querkus sp. Strength is reasonably close, it bends reasonably well (though not as easily as Oak), structure and grain are similar.
Tassie Oak is actually a number of medium density, medium strength and hardness Eucalypt species which are pretty good to work and potentially great for structural elements on small boats. I am currently doing the chines and keel with it and looks good.

Sitka Spruce is somewhat similar to really high grade Hoop in terms of usage. A lot of boat builders seem to use Hoop for much of their projects, even structural elements, though this could be because of it's easy availability and the great quality timber in long lengths.

Fir I have presumed is Douglas Fir or what we call Oregon and is readily available from good timber suppliers.

A replacement for Honduran Mahogany still eludes me though I have decided to use good, clear Hoop to replace it. Hoop is a bit softer and not as strong so I will beef up any sections which are load bearing and see how it goes.

Now I can get down to the really enjoyable part of working on the boat and watching it take shape. Someone said in one of the other threads the key to getting it finished is to do something everyday. Good advice!

Originally Posted by CQ Chipper

A brief update on my findings so far. There would appear to be no Aussie or commonly imported species to replace American Oak

I would not expect any "equivalence" mapping. Instead, look for Australian woods that are suitable.

Tuart, for example, has been used in boat building. It's harder and heavier than Jarrah.

As for an Australian design, Trailer Boar Fisherman published plans and instructions for building a dory when Peter Webster was editor, Peter is the first editor, and I think articles were published during the 80s.

If nothing else, it should have some relevant advice regarding timbers.

Thanks for the heads up. Timber is funny stuff and can have a diverse and amazing set of properties for any given species. The species I mentioned above were related to me by a great bloke at a local Building Supplies Company. He was extremely helpful and even gave me a great price on the 7mm Marine Ply for my little project boat.
Don't often get service like he provided in Gladstone businesses and I will be going back to him time and again. He showed me some of his stock of clear Hoop and now I can see why boaties build with it, beautiful, straight, long timber! Easy to work and reasonably strong for its weight.
I did have a bit of dramas trying to bend some of the Tassy Oak though. Might have to look into gaining some skills in steam bending when I finish this boat.

Next project is already on the drawing board. I'm going to look at building a slightly larger outboard powered dingy of around 12 to 13 feet. Will have to talk to the Treasury Dept to see what the Minister will allow. Aint it always the way?

American White Oak is imported into OZ and is plentiful in supply.

Originally Posted by Offcuts

American White Oak is imported into OZ and is plentiful in supply.

Hey Offcuts, thanks for the info. If there are elements of the plan which should really be made of White Oak it's good to know it's available. I'll ask the man at the Building Supplies shop, Busteeds here in Gladstone, if he has ever carried it. In one of my previous posts I stated how it felt like you are a lone voice in the wilderness some times but this bloke and his company have been really helpful. Can't say enough good about them and being local, they can really help.

Also, can't say enough about the value of this forum and the great people who have helped out with advice and shared their knowledge. I'm a metal worker by trade and learn something new everytime I log on. Working wood is very different to working metal and so much more enjoyable!

Species like White Oak are hardly ever stocked by Building yards / hardware stores or even Timber Merchants.

since their range of options for claddings, for example, is HUGE, they tend to carry only what they get asked a lot of times for.
sometimes these counter jumpers have no idea or don't want to expend energies for a $200 sale - ROI.
Most won't even try to source for you but instead prefer to and easier to SELL you something they stock - Their strike rate is high in this area based on the feedback I get on this forum about myths and crap that WE are told by the supposed experts in the Timber yard.

FYI> American White Oak is used primarily in Windows & Doors and Flooring applications and in order to source the species requirers of these species need to locate the importer / wholsaler to find out their distribution chain & possible stockists.
These importers & wholesalers are keen to keep the species moving and they should provide you with a few options for sourcing your needs.

Hope this helps.

You're right about most Timber Yards not wanting to carry obscure species like "real" Oak. I took my original question on finding "replacement" species for those in the plan I'm working off to one of the local building yards. They made some phone calls and came up with some suggestions based on what they keep and what they can get.

They did say they would get Oak in for me, but it would be expensive. I decided I could get by using Tassie Oak since it supposedly bends fairly easily. The sheers and chines on my little boat have been done in Tassie Oak and I'm pretty happy with the results. The owner of the building yard has had some experience with amateurs building boats in their back yards and was pretty helpful. Mind you, I did buy a few sheets of marine ply. And I guess this is the big cruncher isn't it? They're in business to sell timber and I'm the one buying it. In this case not a lot, but this guy knows he has made a long standing customer by going out of his way to help. There is another yard here in my suburb but I'd rather go the extra mile and deal with people who are more willing to go out of their way to help. It's just good business sense, isn't it?

But as you said Offcuts, not all the people you find in hardware stores or even timber yards are willing to spend a little time and effort on the little guy. So my advice for what it's worth, when you find a good supplier give them all your business even though you may be able to save a few cents a metre from the chain store.