Thread: 12-20 Tap

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Originally Posted by IanW

I've got a whole packet of nails of just the right diameter

Hi Ian, what size and type of nails do you recommend for making the rear handle bolt?
Thanks,
V

Originally Posted by dubrosa22

Hi Ian, what size and type of nails do you recommend for making the rear handle bolt?
Thanks,
V

Ordinary mild steel nails, 5.6mm, which is very slightly oversize (7/32" = 5.55625 mm) but my die cuts a thread easily on the 5.6mm nails, and they fit the hole in the knobs & totes, which seem to be drilled generously oversize. You'll need about 110mm for the tote stud, so 6" nails are the go....
Cheers,

Thanks Ian.
I will try some 6" * 7/32" nails. I have a 12-20 tap & die set (thanks to a kind Facebook group member in the US posting at real cost) but have been too lazy to work out the best blank for handle bolts.

V

There's likely to be some minor variation in the nails depending on batch & manufacturer, but I expect most will be ok. If you measure old studs from the early 1900s on, you'll find the shanks are slightly less than 7/32" which indicates the threads were rolled on, not cut. There is quite a few thou difference in the major diameters of the threads on those I've measured, which may help to explain why some have failed while other studs have done their duty faithfully for generations of users. Note also that rolled threads are mechanically stronger than cut threads (which may seem counter-intuitive, but the process of deforming the metal to form the thread alters the grain structure & increases the tensile strength of the steel), so I think it is a good idea to have your blanks full-size so that the die-cut threads are as full as they can be.

I used to wonder at the diameters marked on nail cartons - all sorts of odd fractions of a mm!? But when I did a few conversions, the penny finally dropped, they are simply old imperial sizes & gauges re-badged to their metric equivalent. So 5.6mm is simply an old 12 gauge nail "modernised" (5.55mm rounded-up). The pack I'm using is marked 5.6 but the shanks measure very close to 5.5mm, which I assume is within manufacturer's tolerances.....

Cheers,
Ian

Hi Rick just saw this. After I shaped the handle with a rasp, I worked through from 60 to 800 grit sandpapers, sanding sealer followed, then a light denib with 600 grit paper and three coats of danish oil.

Hi Ian and Swifty,

Thanks for your replies and my apologies for not getting back to you sooner, Ian the stud arrived last Thursday and got hold of it yesterday, its perfect fits like a bought one many thanks.

Swifty thanks for the info on the finish I will try it on a Tassie Blackwood handle I have just made for a no5 it looks to give the smooth soft looking finish I like on tool handles.

Thanks again. Rick

Originally Posted by IanW

OK - if the locals said mahogany, then mahogany it is.


Almost as an afterthought, he decided to check my lump of wood. Would you believe it, a blasted looper caterpillar had decided that a gap in the splintered end was a good place to hole up for the daylight hours. I had a hard time convincing the young fella that it wasn't a wood-munching critter that was about to devastate our entire woodland! Eventually, I persuaded him that squashing it on the spot would be all that was required to protect our agriculture & environment. Dunno what his training was, but it obviously didn't include much entomology....

Cheers,

You were lucky.

I have a mate who used to be in border quarantine, his speciality live fish imports, but they all had a go at anything in front of them.

He tells me that the usual process is "If in any doubt, turn it into a dog."

Which translates as take it down to the furnace and when you throw it in it goes WOOF.

Originally Posted by Rick47

..... the stud arrived last Thursday and got hold of it yesterday, its perfect fits like a bought one .....

Goodo, glad to help. As I said, I was a bit worried you'd over-estimated the length, but obviously the rulers we used agree.

That's the longest tote stud I've come across so far; others I've measured or replaced were close to 100mm, so I had assumed Stanley had settled on 4 inches as a nice even figure. Now I know there's wider variation than I thought...

Cheers

I've got some taps and dies now so send me a message if you want a set. Already sent out a couple of sets today.

Cheers!

Hi Ian
I agree not using a different thread count, but I encountered a similar problem with thread in the base of no 5 Stanley where tote goes was flogged out so I got a new piece of rod about 1/4 inch and used a 1/4 20tpi Witworth Split die on one end of rod then tightened up the split in die and used on the other end resulting in a 7/32 20 tpi on one end and ¼" 20 tpi thread on the other end. It then screwed into the base of plane and other end took the brass nut to hold handle/tote. While this is not conventional I did not want to butcher the plane, just to do my best to keep it as original as possible, it also saves throwing out an otherwise good base.

Hi Greybeer, I think what you did was perfectly sensible ('cos it's what I would have done under the same circumstances ). There aren't that many options for effecting a repair in the average backyard shed. I've seen one instance where the hole was filled with braze & re-tapped to the "correct" thread, but for folks with no welding/brazing gear (or experience) that's not one of the options available. I've done the same "cure" for the studs that hold the muffler on my line-trimmer. The original M6 studs self-stripped, presumably from the vibration. I could not justify the cost of a "Helicoil" kit to repair it (more than the darned machine is worth!), but I happen to have M7 taps & a die, & M7 is the same pitch as M6 so I made up a new stud with M7 on one end & M6 on the other. It worked well until it stripped too (bl**dy two-strokes motors!!), so I just tolerate the noise until I can afford a decent new battery model.

What I do object to is forcing over-size studs into holes when there is no cause to do so.

Judging by the fair sample of planes that've been through my hands, it's pretty common to find tote studs that are quite wobbly when screwed into the sole even when there is no visible damage to internal or external threads. It's almost as if the manufacturers deliberately made the threads a bit sloppy to allow for slight variations in the angle of the hole through the totes. I've come to the conclusion that the best thing to do is just screw the stud in firmly (with a gentle twitch-up using pliers or multi-grips to make sure it is firm), & trust it. It almost always holds just fine. If the stud pulls out of the sole when the top nut is tightened up, then of course you have a problem that needs to be dealt with. If I ever do meet one so badly stripped even the 1/4" thread can't hold, I'll have to figure out how best to proceed, but I'll jump off that bridge when/if I get there....

Cheers,