Thread: HNT Gordon or other brand Side-Rebate Planes?

Hi Dom

I've not used Terry's side rebate planes, but have no doubt that they will be excellent. I have several of the HNT Gordon planes, and they are consistent and do as they are intended. I do have his dado plane, the 1/2" version, and think it brilliant. Review here.

With regard side rebate/rabbet planes, I most frequently turn to the LN ones - you do need both hands as the low cutting angle will tear up opposing grain. The Veritas is probably the better design and more comfortable of the two, however I like the ability to grab the hand I want, so more often use the LN.

The idea that Terry had for the dovetail conversion is brilliant, and I modified a Stanley #79 to work this way. I would say that this probably works better than his simply because the #79 has a long fence and is more comfortable to hold. However, if starting out, and you get Terry's, you kill two birds with one stone. So a good choice.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Derek,

Thanks for your reply and advice. Very helpful as always.

Looks like I'll be getting both the side-rebate and dado planes then! Although maybe just the rebate planes for now (with prize-money from a bike race this weekend) and the dado plane when I save a few more pennies.

Cheers,

Dom

Dom

I have Terry's Side rebate planes (not all of them ). I bought them to refine sliding dovetails, but have never got around to those types of projects. I have used them on occasion for various other similar purposes and have been glad I had them as they worked well. As Derek said, you will need the pair.

Regards
Paul

I've demo'd the LNs, the Veritas, and the HNTGs.

Terry's are the best, in my opinion. The higher angle makes them more versatile (for oddly placed finishing cuts like on the flat sections of mouldings), the fence they come with is huge and stable, and they handle like a full-sized plane. Nothing else any of the other, major players is offering even comes close, really, in my eyes.

If you're gonna get them, you may as well get this sick Buloke pair:

https://www.hntgordon.com.au/special...te-planes.html

I mean it's $30 more. You have to.

I love Terry's Buloke planes because it kind of looks like Beech on meth... A Buloke moving fillister is on my bucket list.

On that note, why not buy the Wood River side rebate and save the extra cash for an HNT Gordon moving fillister plane? That's not a 0-2 times a year plane like a side rebate. That can be an all the time plane for a serious hand tool user.

Just sayin...

Cheers,
Luke

P.S. Combine shipping and get the Tiger Myrtle snipe bills so that I can stop drooling over them. They've been on the site over a year. If you really wanna drop some coin on a pair of planes you'll rarely use, that's the one. I speak from experience (although I did use mine recently)...

https://www.hntgordon.com.au/special...ll-planes.html

Originally Posted by Luke Maddux

I've demo'd the LNs, the Veritas, and the HNTGs.

Terry's are the best, in my opinion. The higher angle makes them more versatile (for oddly placed finishing cuts like on the flat sections of mouldings), the fence they come with is huge and stable, and they handle like a full-sized plane. Nothing else any of the other, major players is offering even comes close, really, in my eyes.

If you're gonna get them, you may as well get this sick Buloke pair:

https://www.hntgordon.com.au/special...te-planes.html

I mean it's $30 more. You have to.

I love Terry's Buloke planes because it kind of looks like Beech on meth... A Buloke moving fillister is on my bucket list.

On that note, why not buy the Wood River side rebate and save the extra cash for an HNT Gordon moving fillister plane? That's not a 0-2 times a year plane like a side rebate. That can be an all the time plane for a serious hand tool user.

Just sayin...

Cheers,
Luke

P.S. Combine shipping and get the Tiger Myrtle snipe bills so that I can stop drooling over them. They've been on the site over a year. If you really wanna drop some coin on a pair of planes you'll rarely use, that's the one. I speak from experience (although I did use mine recently)...

https://www.hntgordon.com.au/special...ll-planes.html

Thanks Luke,

I'm not sure how much of your post is genuine and how much is tongue-in-cheek (the joys of the written vs spoken word) haha. Whatever the intent, you touch on some important first-world problems . The bull-oak planes look nice but I'm not sure if I prefer them over the standard Gidgee... and then they won't match my future set of HNT moulding planes, snipe-bill planes etc... or maybe matching doesn't matter and a variety of exotic woods would be cool. What a can of worms .

You're right. The moving fillister is also on my dream/drool-list as well. But ebony? Or ringed gidgee? Or bull-oak? I think that one would require an in-person visit and look prior to purchase .

I guess it would be silly not to combine shipping...

You're looking at multiple planes from Terry and worrying about shipping ??

I've got both LN's and as Derek advised, you do need both the left and right handed versions.
They are invaluable for those times when you want to take a smidgen off the side of a groove or rebate.

They are great tools and work very well. I went for Ebony and I'm always thrilled with the tools Terry produces.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Dom,

No, everything I said was true... I guess some of it carried a goofy tone, but the facts were legit.

Perhaps part of why it seemed like a joke was because I deleted the substantive part of it. I did this because it's basically the same thing I have said on a couple of your posts, and I didn't want to seem like a broken record.

Make no mistake, this is going to be a rarely used combination of planes. Dado planes and side rebate planes cut joinery for dividers and shelves, so unless you have tons of cabinet work coming up, this is around a grand you're going to drop and probably use a couple of times a year, tops, as a hobbyist. Also, you've chosen the single most expensive way to do it by hand. You can get the same results from a pair of old Stanleys and an old, English-made, wooden-bodied dado plane. I'm a huge advocate for the use of older, already-existing tools. BUT I also know you like new, high end tools. So, ultimately, the functionality, or rather our collective opinion on their functionality (which is very high), is of little consequence. It's like the Lie Nielsen and Bad Axe saws you recently got. If you want them and can afford them, then how they work compared to other makers is kind of semantics.

I would be remiss not to call myself out here. I dropped over 2k on HNT Gordon moulding planes before leaving Australia. I justified it for a couple of reasons. First, I was flush for cash (which may be the only justification necessary). Second, I'd been talking to Terry about it for over a year and I wanted to get them before I had to pay international shipping. Third, because they're awesome, and finally, because I really wanted to add the use of those planes to my skill set. I could've done it for a fraction of the price, but I decided to go big because I wanted to go big. The old, beech-bodied planes would do the same job.

So that was the lead in to the rest of the post. Since all you got was the "Go big or go home" part, I can see why that seemed tongue in cheek.

Cheers,
Luke

Originally Posted by Luke Maddux

Dom,

No, everything I said was true... I guess some of it carried a goofy tone, but the facts were legit.

Perhaps part of why it seemed like a joke was because I deleted the substantive part of it. I did this because it's basically the same thing I have said on a couple of your posts, and I didn't want to seem like a broken record.

Make no mistake, this is going to be a rarely used combination of planes. Dado planes and side rebate planes cut joinery for dividers and shelves, so unless you have tons of cabinet work coming up, this is around a grand you're going to drop and probably use a couple of times a year, tops, as a hobbyist. Also, you've chosen the single most expensive way to do it by hand. You can get the same results from a pair of old Stanleys and an old, English-made, wooden-bodied dado plane. I'm a huge advocate for the use of older, already-existing tools. BUT I also know you like new, high end tools. So, ultimately, the functionality, or rather our collective opinion on their functionality (which is very high), is of little consequence. It's like the Lie Nielsen and Bad Axe saws you recently got. If you want them and can afford them, then how they work compared to other makers is kind of semantics.

I would be remiss not to call myself out here. I dropped over 2k on HNT Gordon moulding planes before leaving Australia. I justified it for a couple of reasons. First, I was flush for cash (which may be the only justification necessary). Second, I'd been talking to Terry about it for over a year and I wanted to get them before I had to pay international shipping. Third, because they're awesome, and finally, because I really wanted to add the use of those planes to my skill set. I could've done it for a fraction of the price, but I decided to go big because I wanted to go big. The old, beech-bodied planes would do the same job.

So that was the lead in to the rest of the post. Since all you got was the "Go big or go home" part, I can see why that seemed tongue in cheek.

Cheers,
Luke

Your point about only using them a couple of times a year is probably true if I'm being honest with myself, and when thinking cost vs use it doesn't make for a very strong justification. I'm rationally better off putting the cash towards a router-table, chisel-mortiser, drum-sander, oscillating belt-sander, or any number of more productive tools I don't have access to, or perhaps more to the point putting the money in the bank or towards some sort of productive investment . But the heart wants what the heart wants and I find it really hard to be rational, particularly with hand-tools as I can't seem to place a value on the enjoyment of using a well built, well tuned, tool as an experience in and of itself regardless of the end-product of its use.

I realise that my buying expensive tools may lead people to believe I'm very well off, but the truth is that whilst my fiancee and I are in a good financial situation at the moment, being in our early thirties with two decent incomes, no children and living in a cheap suburb, we are hardly rich. I just tend to fixate on something at the expense of everything else. Woodworking has become my obsession so nearly every spare dollar (as well as spare time) is funneled towards it. I don't eat out , don't buy coffee out, don't drink, don't buy clothes until they are falling apart, don't pay for any services that I can do, or learn to do, myself, drive an old car and don't spend money on any other hobby / interest for the last few years. I also don't have any investments or savings. Sorry, I just wanted to say that because I don't want people to think I'm some wealthy fat-cat throwing money around (not that there is anything wrong with being wealthy) and rubbing peoples noses in it. I just get really excited about woodworking and nice tools and you guys on the forum are the only people I know with the same interest. Sorry to get a bit off-topic there!

On the topic of moulding planes; have you used them much? Did you always incorporate mouldings and those types of details into your work or do you like furniture with mouldings, or was it an attraction to a new process / skill that you hadn't incorporated before? I ask because I'm also interested in cutting my own moulding details using hollows and rounds, but I'm not sure if I'm more attracted to the process of doing so with hand tools, or the actual end-product that is produced. Again, for me these could be a once or twice a year tool, or I may use them a lot. I don't yet know. Have you found yourself using these a lot?

At the moment, I am really in a period where I am obsessed with trying to learn as many wood-working processes as I can in my quest to become a competent and "complete" woodworker, hence I am jumping from one process/skill to the next (and getting the tools necessary along the way) with the aim of reaching an overall level of competence and capability where I feel I can tackle any future project.

Cheers,

Dom

But the heart wants what the heart wants

Ain't dat de troof?

I just get really excited about woodworking and nice tools and you guys on the forum are the only people I know with the same interest.

I think that sums up the essence of an interest/obsession and no excuses needed.

Regards
Paul

Dom, I can understand your love for nice tools, I think most of us go through at least a stage of lusting after every lovely wood and brass creation from the likes of Terry, or extreme provokers of tool-lust like Sauer & Steiner! Practicality/reality should eventually assert itself, but at what level it ends up depends on your personal views & disposable income. In the meantime, if you're enjoying the ride, and not bankrupting the family, why not indulge as you see fit? If you want to present a pretense of rationality, you can always claim that high-end tools will probably maintain their value better than a garden variety old Stanley...

But as Luke has said, getting too carried away too soon will almost certainly cause you to end up with a lot of tools you'll rarely use, it really is better to buy what you need as your skills and the complexity of the jobs you tackle increase. Although I was frustrated in my early years by not being able to indulge in all the lovely hand tools I thought I had to have, I found ways to meet the challenges with what I did have - there are different ways of skinning the cat, as they say. Some of my early work looks a bit naive now, but more due to my lack of skill and design savvy than inadequate tools, I think. By acquiring my tool chest much more gradually than I would have liked, I have ended up with way fewer than I would have if I'd been able to fully indulge back in 1970. But I have manged to end up with what I consider a very good collection of tools, most of which see regular use. (And some have good 'back stories' of how they came into my possession, which is something money can't buy. ) It's a bit of an eclectic mix, & quite a few have been customised to suit me, but all are as fettled & fit for purpose as I know how to make them, which to me is the ultimate satisfaction.

Cheers,

Originally Posted by DomAU

On the topic of moulding planes; have you used them much? Did you always incorporate mouldings and those types of details into your work or do you like furniture with mouldings, or was it an attraction to a new process / skill that you hadn't incorporated before? I ask because I'm also interested in cutting my own moulding details using hollows and rounds, but I'm not sure if I'm more attracted to the process of doing so with hand tools, or the actual end-product that is produced. Again, for me these could be a once or twice a year tool, or I may use them a lot. I don't yet know. Have you found yourself using these a lot?

A lot? No. Definitely not. I've only actually used them on three projects, really. One was a moulding around the edge of a coat rack, the other was a small bead on the frame of a frame and panel door, and the third was the coffee table build which I just posted last night. These are tools which are more often used on casework, and I haven't done much of that since getting them.

That said, I purchased these last July, and they immediately came out of the HNTG packaging and into my own packaging for an international shipment. They then took seven months to get here, and it wasn't until this February that I actually had them available to me at a time when I had a workshop. And then I had to build a cabinet to keep them in... blah blah. Since having them set up, stored properly, and tuned to my liking, I've been using them when the job calls for it and they're really great. My next project or three is proper cabinet work which I expect will have several mouldings, so I expect to really put them to use in some QLD Maple and Red Cedar.

I went with new planes for more reasons than I initially stated. I think - nay, I know - that Gidgee will outlast any wood that any other modern planemaker is using to make wooden soled planes. Matt Bickford uses Cherry. The wear resistance of Gidgee compared to Cherry is not even in the same sport. Also, the other option, aside from other high end new moulding planes which often times cost more than Terry's, is a vintage set. This would be a lot cheaper, but would require a lot of fettling. I've restored an old moulding plane before and it's quite a job to get the sole to match the iron. And then, after you have it matching, is it still even the right radius? So I just decided I was willing to pay the difference in price to have something that's factory tuned and ready to go. I also didn't buy a full "half set" (that's a good oxymoron...) all at once. I think I got the set of ten he offers plus snipe bills and side rounds, and have since acquired two more pairs second hand. I'm still missing the 5/8" and the 1 1/2" pairs.

I'm right there with you on the "acquire as many skills as possible" page, and mouldings is my next big endeavor (followed by carving... yikes). I don't mean to talk like an old, grizzled woodworker with 7.5 fingers and an epic beard. It wasn't that long ago that I was making posts just like this one about tools I wanted. A LOT of those posts. I'll still make them occasionally. In the three and a half years since I first picked up a hand plane, however, I've really changed my approach to acquiring tools. I use this anecdote a lot, but I actually started out with a collection of premium (LN and Veritas) bench planes and, ultimately, got rid of all of them for Stanleys. It just became more meaningful to me to acquire an old tool and get it rocking and rolling again than to buy a new one.

And I still love to do it! Just the other day I replaced the tote, knob, blade, and chip breaker on my jointer plane, and in Gidgee nonetheless.

IMG_0925.JPGIMG_0927.JPGIMG_0928.JPG

I also made back a bunch of money I could spend on... more... tools...

Anyway, end of the day, buy awesome tools if you can afford it. You'll never regret it.

Sidenote: One thing to keep in mind is that, in my opinion, the best way to develop your skills is to build some furniture. It's like playing golf. You can hit all the balls you want at the driving range, but when you're on the links you have to put everything together before you actually hit the ball. Thinking like that and developing the confidence to execute is how you make big strides (or shank a lot of balls...).

Cheers,
Luke

Luke

That last post was written from heart. Also very refreshing to see how much Aussie was ingrained ( ) in you during your stay. I'm not sure you should have left. When will you be back?

It is also good that you acquire your tools to be used. I think you had a good mentor from Pullenvale.

Regards
Paul

Originally Posted by Bushmiller

..... It is also good that you acquire your tools to be used. I think you had a good mentor from Pullenvale....

Paul, I would not take any credit for any of Luke's views - he was well & truly on the path to his current philosophy by the time we met up. The fact we were pretty much on the same page cemented the friendship quickly, and the couple of projects we worked on together were a lot of fun for me. He often asked for my opinion on something, but I think he'd already figured it out beforehand & just wanted a scond opinion. In fact the exchange of ideas was far from one-sided. I have a pretty sweet little wood & brass router plane for which he 'owns' the patent on the adjuster : Box 2a.jpg

We spent so much time chatting & digressing, that most jobs we did together took twice as long as estimated. I had no problem with that, I have no agendas these days (well, some, maybe, this kitchen/house renovation business has to be finite!) ....

Cheers,