Thread: H&R moulding plane irons.

Curious why you shaped the irons before making the plane bodies.
All previous advice I've read on this subject is to make the plane body then shape the iron to fit.

Ian; then you best follow their advice.

Stewie;

BUT
even if you are following our own path, I, and I'm sure others, are interested in how you allowed for the future bedding angle when shaping the irons.
If you have found an effective way it would be good to share it.

Ian; on a positive note, when was the last time you posted photo's of your own work.

Stewie;

Stewie - why the attitude? A question was asked, hoping for an answer so everyone reading would benefit and you take offence.
I thought the idea of a forum was to help others and pass on knowledge, including answering questions in a civil manner.

I have never made any moulding planes, but there is a possibility of it in the future so I am watching this thread with interest. Off the top of my head, which isn't really off the top of my head, more along the lines of adapting experience of making spindle moulder knives to a hand plane, I would definitely make the knives first before the body. As I see it, I would only need to elongate the profiles slightly to compensate for the cutting angle/rake/whatever. Being lazy I would draw the profile in the computer and then stretch/skew/point to point plot the elongation on the plane of the cutting angle. Once I have a knife which WILL produce the profile I am after at a specific cutting angle, I simply need to make a chunk of wood which supports said knife with a sole which at least "mostly" matches the profile without any low points that would interfere with the function.

Am I about right, or way off track?

Kuffy; imo your right on track with your thought process.

regards Stewie;

Kuffy; you can expect at least a 4 week delay before I can make a start on the main stocks of these moulding planes. I still need to set up a new 18inch bandsaw. https://www.timbecon.com.au/sawing/b...s/18in-bandsaw, and I am also waiting to receive a pair of Snipe Bills and Skew Floats from Phil Edwards in the UK. Order submitted: 5/9/ 2017. Snipes Bill Floats

Stewie;

Stewie, I presume the Dillenia you have is from somewhere north of the mainland? It looks like some I had from the Solomons a while back? There is a species of Dillenia in Nth. Qld. that goes by the common name of "Red Beech", but the couple of examples I've seen are a lot redder than your stash, and it's not a 'commercial' species, so very hard to get hold of.

I made a few saw handles from the pieces I had. It was easy wood to work with & seems to be stable, but I would've thought it a bit on the soft side for a plane body?

And I see no problem with making blades first - did just that today for a small rebate I'm building. It's necessary to have the blade when you are building from scratch, I reckon. You need it to set out the wedge angle & position, & determine the size of your escapement hole, for starters. The radius of an angled blade will be slightly different from the diameter of the curve of the plane sole, and you could allow for that in the making, but the difference is so slight, it's probably easier to put the nominal radius on it & finesse it during final fit & fettling........

Cheers,

And I see no problem with making blades first - did just that today for a small rebate I'm building. It's necessary to have the blade when you are building from scratch, I reckon.

Ian, the traditional way is to begin with a body and shape the sole, since the sole is designed around a specific curvature. It is easier to shape a short width of steel, the blade, to match a long sole.

Old Street Planes write: "The soles are profiled with concave and convex 60° arcs meaning that the sole width equals the radius of the profile".

Lie-Nielsen sell blades for H&R planes. They all have straight edges (bevels). It is expected that one shape the sole first, then grind the blade to match, and finally heat treat the blade.

This style of plane differs from making a rebate (or other straight-bladed) plane, since matching flat-to-flat is straightforward (apology for the pun).

Stewie's method is atypical. He is making more work for himself. The blades look very good, and no doubt he will pull it off, however this is not a method for others to follow.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Appreciate the feedback IanW. It will be interesting to compare the properties of Dillennia against European Beech. These H&Rs will all be bedded at 55 degrees to make them more compatible to our local hardwoods.

regards Stewie;

Originally Posted by derekcohen

Ian, the traditional way is to begin with a body and shape the sole, since the sole is designed around a specific curvature. It is easier to shape a short width of steel, the blade, to match a long sole.

Old Street Planes write: "The soles are profiled with concave and convex 60° arcs meaning that the sole width equals the radius of the profile".

Lie-Nielsen sell blades for H&R planes. They all have straight edges (bevels). It is expected that one shape the sole first, then grind the blade to match, and finally heat treat the blade.

This style of plane differs from making a rebate (or other straight-bladed) plane, since matching flat-to-flat is straightforward (apology for the pun).

Stewie's method is atypical. He is making more work for himself. The blades look very good, and no doubt he will pull it off, however this is not a method for others to follow.

Regards from Perth

Derek

At every opportunity you never cease to amaze me Mr. Cohen. Nothing further to add.

regards;

Stewie, you may believe I am having a go at you, but I am not. This is an area of my interest as well. I agree with your rational for making a a higher cutting angle. I would go even higher, aiming for 60 degrees. Now, this is the issue of the last few posts - as the bed angle increases, so the curvature on the bevel must change to match it. How are you determining the bevel shape? In advance? I would have found it easier to shape the bevel after the body is completed.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Originally Posted by Kuffy

I have never made any moulding planes, but there is a possibility of it in the future so I am watching this thread with interest. Off the top of my head, which isn't really off the top of my head, more along the lines of adapting experience of making spindle moulder knives to a hand plane, I would definitely make the knives first before the body. As I see it, I would only need to elongate the profiles slightly to compensate for the cutting angle/rake/whatever. Being lazy I would draw the profile in the computer and then stretch/skew/point to point plot the elongation on the plane of the cutting angle. Once I have a knife which WILL produce the profile I am after at a specific cutting angle, I simply need to make a chunk of wood which supports said knife with a sole which at least "mostly" matches the profile without any low points that would interfere with the function.

Am I about right, or way off track?

Hi Kuffy
just thinking about this approach ...
a spindle molder knife, or router bit, is rotating and cuts the desired profile in one pass by chipping away at the surface of the wood.
A molding plane cuts by taking long shavings from the surface working down to the desired profile in a number of passes.