Thread: New but not Knew...

Ian

That's very nice. To what extent does the extra depth of frame reduce the available tension to the blade? I imagine that the deeper you go, the more flex becomes apparent.

Yet another use for those Oak handles. I think they are almost becoming your trade mark.

Regards
Paul

Originally Posted by Bushmiller

......To what extent does the extra depth of frame reduce the available tension to the blade? I imagine that the deeper you go, the more flex becomes apparent. ......

Paul, been using the saw quite a bit today, so I can give you a quick 'review'. The bit of rod I used is just adequate to produce the desired blade tension, but if I'd gone for any more depth, it wouldn't have coped (so to speak..). Indeed, the longer the 'arms' the stiffer they need to be to provide the necessary blade tension.

My biggest problem was my blade clamps. I thought I was being clever by using brass pads to clamp the blade to the frame. My (apparently incorrect) thinking was that the blade would bite into the brass & I'd get a really good grip. Doesn't seem to work as well as I hoped, but by dint of twisting the knurled screws as hard as my fingers will tolerate, I can just clamp them tight enough to get them to hold. But it's not an ideal situation, I will need to re-visit it sometime. I've finished the job I needed it for, now, so it may be a long time before I get the round tuit.

After making some very long cuts through 5mm steel, I can assure you size does matter. Those extra grams become very apparent after about 5 minutes of steady sawing. It's odd, but at first the heavier saw feels better, it sits firmly against the work on the pull stroke, but after a thousand or so 'lifts', the little saw seems like the better option. So I can see why people who use these things all day every day would find Mr. Marshall's creation a godsend - having a saw that is lighter but even stiffer would certainly be a plus (not to mention his superior blade-retaining system!)...

Cheers,

Ian

Could the blade clamping issue just be down to leverage? The wing nuts on the small saw would enable you to exert more pressure than the round knurled nuts on the large saw. Perhaps you could experiment with a bolt with a piece of rod welded to the top to form a "T". If that creates better clamping pressure you could go to work on a pretty version.

Just as an aside and on enlarging the pix to see the way the nuts clamp (that reminds me of the story a friend told me of an attractive girl at their workplace when he was a pattern maker's apprentice. They nicknamed her "spanner" because of her ability, when she passed by, to tighten their...... ) I see that another plane body could be on the horizon .

Regards
Paul

Originally Posted by Bushmiller

.......Could the blade clamping issue just be down to leverage? The wing nuts on the small saw would enable you to exert more pressure than the round knurled nuts on the large saw.....

Exackery. In fact, the wing nuts on the small saw aren't really wide enough for my ageing fingers to twitch up really tightly, either, so I've gotten in the habit of dropping each between partly-open vise jaws & giving them a little extra tweak, to make sure they hold in use. I thought the extra bite of the brass pads would compensate for the slightly (only very slightly) smaller diameter of my 16mm knurled jobbies. Ah well, as I used to tell my grad students, if experiments always worked the way we expected, there'd be no point in doing them, would there?

Originally Posted by Bushmiller

.......I see that another plane body could be on the horizon .......

It's possible.

To continue the reproductive metaphor you started in another thread, this is an unplanned child. I finished those I've been plotting for years (many years, for a couple of them!), plus two more that just happened to happen along the way. I found myself with a couple of bits of gauge-plate left over. I'd originally intended to use some of the 5mm thick stuff for the sole of a shooting plane I want to make around that monster blade I got from you, as a skewed, BU, chunky beast. However, the 5mm piece was only 230mm long & I want to make the shooting plane at least 300mm, so what to do? After some fiddling with side templates, I decided to make a smaller version of the panel plane I put together a couple of months ago. I am really happy with that plane, it has the sweetest action of any infill I've ever used. I have this theory that it has much to do with the proportion of toe-section to heel-section. We'll see, maybe my experiment will be successful this time??

Cheers,

Ian, I admire and envy both your skills and your fortitude!

Have you considered a shorter depth of cut - say 3" - and create a 45 degree slope for the blade to be held? This way you get greater stiffness and an infinite distance to saw to a depth of 2". What do you think?

Regards from Perth

Derek

Derek, I've tried putting blades in 'sideways' to give me longer cuts. I find having the saw off-balance in that way makes it near impossible for me to saw as accurately as I like to do when cutting out the (metal) dovetails, & my blade breakage rate goes up about 400%! Sawing to within a fraction of a mm of the line minimises filing, which is a right pain, particularly given the quality of files one can purchase these days!

This was really just an exercise in getting a job done, and it worked, though it certainly brought home to me what they are banging on about with stiffness & lightness being all-importaant qualities of these metal-cutting saws. It takes at least 100 times as many strokes to travel the same distance in metal cf. an equivalent thickness of wood, so while a heavy-ish wooden-framed bowsaw doesn't register when woodworking, the weight of my new saw most certainly did wwhen making some longish cuts! However, I plan to retire from this kind of metal work very soon now, & chances are this saw will not see the light of day more than once a decade for the rest of the time it spends with me. Just this once, I'm far more focused on the product than the tools required to produce it.....
Cheers,

I've read your retirements before, and don't believe it for one minute

I will bow to your superior knowledge about sawing metal.

Regards from Perth

Derek

After seeing how much you use it, this seems like it would be a good saw to have.

How did you heat the metal? Just with a torch?

Cheers,
Luke

Originally Posted by Luke Maddux

After seeing how much you use it, this seems like it would be a good saw to have.

'Tis, Luke, but if you are serious abut getting into metal work, I reckon it might be worth considering a Marshall saw very seriously. Mind you, I have never even held one, but they seem to possess all the features I would love to have in a jewellers' saw - lightness, stiffness, very positive blade-holding, quick & easy tensioning - what is there not to like about them?! My home-made thingy got the job done, but if I wanted to emulate Mr. Spiers and make a couple of planes a week, I would be looking at an alternative 'real quick'!

Originally Posted by Luke Maddux

....How did you heat the metal? Just with a torch?...

Yep, I got the 9mm rod plenty hot enough in the right spot with a MAPP torch. Which reminds me, I'm coming to the end of my last bottle of MAPP gas, and it's no longer available, so I'm going to have to look for an alternative for when I need a 'hot' torch. Ordinary propane torches don't have anywhere near the oomph of this thing (you can use two at a pinch, but the flame temperature is still not as high).
(Edit: Just did a proper search & it seems the MAPP cylinders are still readily available, just not where I got mine!)

I am grateful for those years on the farm as a kid, mucking about with metal & learning a bit about it, but I really do want to put that side of me away for the foreseeable future. I've now got more & much nicer tools for working wood than I ever expected to have, & I just want to get on & get good use out of them while I still can! The good news is, a few orders have been coming in from my offspring, lately, and with a new grandchild on the way, there's scope for lots of little beds, tables, chairs, etc. The prospect of making lots more sawdust & less swarf beckons.....

Cheers,

Originally Posted by IanW

...The prospect of making lots more sawdust & less swarf beckons.....

Amen, buddy.