Thread: Some pieces from history

I'll throw this in there too:

Andre J. Roubo: Translation of - Lost Art Press blog

Originally Posted by pmcgee

Finally I can offer a link to (part of) Roubo's L'Art du Menuisier (1769-74)
http://toolemera.com/bkpdf/roubonypl.pdf (not 5 volumes worth)
It is *all* illustration - and makes you wonder what skills have been maintained, improved or diminished over the last 250 years.

Cheers,
Paul.

I found this book fascinating! Thanks for the post!

You might be interested in The Book of Illustrious Mechanics of Europe and America by Foucaud

It's also a history lesson that anything as prosaic as a turners book would be published in France in the year seventeen-hundred and ninety-two.

Originally Posted by mic-d

It's also a history lesson that anything as prosaic as a turners book would be published in France in the year seventeen-hundred and ninety-two.

The cutting edge of the revolution.
Cheers,
Jim

Cool links Paul,

Re the first link, it's not Old French, just old typography.

I gave it a skim and picked a few points of interest:
He attributes the double iron to the Germans (some time in the past).
He actually talks about two blades back to back, not a cap iron,
And he lists the toughest test for smoothing as planing green oak.
The bed angle is 'ordinary' 45 degrees.

PS empty your mail box

Originally Posted by Berlin

Cool links Paul,

Re the first link, it's not Old French, just old typography.

I gave it a skim and picked a few points of interest:
He attributes the double iron to the Germans (some time in the past).
He actually talks about two blades back to back, not a cap iron,
And he lists the toughest test for smoothing as planing green oak.
The bed angle is 'ordinary' 45 degrees.

That's interesting when the French for cabinetmaker is an Ébéniste which I assume means that if you can work in ebony you really have skill.
I've seen them working green oak on Grand Designs and it seems to cut like butter - perhaps that the difficulty
Cheers,
Jim

:u
From memory you're not too far off with the etimology of Ébéniste. I'll check, but I think it was to do with the fact that ebony was too valuable to use in all but the finest furniture, therefore if you used ebony you made fine furiture. Now-a-days an ébéniste is often a 'french polisher'/restorer as much as cabinetmaker, at least in my experience.

Cheers

Originally Posted by Berlin

Cool links Paul,

Re the first link, it's not Old French, just old typography.

I gave it a skim and picked a few points of interest:
He attributes the double iron to the Germans (some time in the past).
He actually talks about two blades back to back, not a cap iron,
And he lists the toughest test for smoothing as planing green oak.
The bed angle is 'ordinary' 45 degrees.

Well ... it's French ... and ... it's old ...


I forgot to say re this section:

It planes wonderfully, but care must be exercised with figured stock, where it must be scraped (which is what “raboter a petit fer” means IMHO) or planed with a double iron plane, otherwise when we think we are almost done planing severe tearout occurs.

The discussion progressed and decided that "raboter a petit fer" (to plane with a small iron) meant to take a thin shaving.

Cheers,
Paul
(I did - I did - I did clear my mailbox - honest I did)

Originally Posted by jimbur

The cutting edge of the revolution.
Cheers,
Jim

Didn't that come later, courtesy of Monsieur Guillotin?


Tsk ... the things kids get up to: (love the release mechanism)

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lo5BBHtn4tM"]The Guillotine - YouTube[/ame]

Scraper = 'racloir' which he doesn't mention in this passage.

Originally Posted by pmcgee

Didn't that come later, courtesy of Monsieur Guillotin?


Tsk ... the things kids get up to: (love the release mechanism)

The Guillotine - YouTube

First use was supposedly in 1792, the year of the turning book. Perhaps they turned them to death before then.
Cheers,
Jim

Berlin, thanks for the information. By the way green oak wouldn't have been a mistake for greenheart (lignum vitae) would it? That would make more sense.
Cheers,
Jim

Originally Posted by jimbur

That's interesting when the French for cabinetmaker is an Ébéniste which I assume means that if you can work in ebony you really have skill.
I've seen them working green oak on Grand Designs and it seems to cut like butter - perhaps that the difficulty
Cheers,
Jim

You are correct in relation to the derivation of Ébéniste.

The only thing I'd add is that it doesn't mean cabinetmaker in the more generic or broad sense we might use the word today. It refers to a maker of fine case furniture whilst "menuisier" (as in "L'art du Menuisier" - Andre Roubo's treatise), refers more closely to a carpenter or joiner.

I've been doing some reading up on this and my summary would be that the highly regulated guild structure of French artisans/craftsmen divided furniture-making tasks into a variety of camps, the two I have mentioned plus an array of finishing and upholstery tasks. It doesn't make a lot of sense from today's perspective but it would have made perfect sense to an 18th century Parisian journeyman.

Incidently, the word Ébéniste links back to the craftsmen in the low countries (parts of what is now Belgium and the Netherlands). This was the import hub of Europe at the time and their colonies were where the ebony came from. It was an expensive material and the workers who were entrusted with it were thus expected to demonstrate high skill in their usage.

Cheers

Horaldic