Thread: Plane Design

Hi Brett,
Thankyou for the feed back. I might have to revisit the long low plane once i have the design for this one finished up.

The newer design with as many undercut is begging to be lost wax cast which mean making the negative mould what it does effect is what I make the pattern out of.

Anyway I'm still tweaking the design, here it is as it stands atm. Mk9 Revision C.

Yeah, they're two very different beasts, and both with "wow" factor (absolutely vital), except the first design has it in spades - it's a knockout. To go back to the "boat" analogy, the latest one reminds me of a Tug (and although that may be amusing, it's not derogatory), but the original reminds me of one of those gorgeous timber speedboat jobbies, mainly seen on the Mediterranean. My partner thinks the Tug is very Art Deco.

Watch out Josh. FF's in entrepreneurial mode . The rest of you hold onto your wallets and stand firm in the face of outrageous temptation.

Whatever is decided, I have to say that it is not looking good for Ray's piece of stripey ebony .

I do agree, with FF on the styling. It's the difference between a Riva speedboat from San Trope or a Thames Tug. No contest on the aesthetics side of things. Having said that a lot of Norris infils look more like a Thames Tug and woodworkers seem to hold them in awe.

Regards
Paul

Oooh mean!

If it's a tug, it's a tug for the starship Enterprise

Well I'm sticking with the tug atm and getting it far enough to pop out a wax model. which I think it is just about there. I really need to check the ergonomics now.


Added the adjustable mouth.

Personally I think there's something lost between ...


and



Or are you just coitusing with us?
(... we're sorry about the whole tug boat thing)

((... "Five passengers set sail that day for a three hour tour. A three hour tour."))

Paul

FWIW ... from a wooden coffin plane with adjustable metal toe ...

adjustable coffin smoother.jpg

Just filling in details and seeing how it changes the feel, The only lines I have changed is the front handle (oh and the lever cap screw and adding the mechanism for the mouth plate). The things i like about the front in the first picture is the little curve on the side for the bump at the base of the thumb and the other is the sweep back hook for your thumb proper. The thing i did not like was the indent in the middle. The second picture is more intended as a fingers over the front grip.

And was still having trouble getting the front to look right so I split the handle from the main model so that I can play with the different ideas and change between them. I might even to that with the full scale mock-up, and I still don't know if the front should have a inlay. I just had an idea that might work at the front (TDB).

I melted down a bunch of wax for a blank last night, so look out for a wax version of The Minnow (hey... its a working title) soon.

That looks to be a much simpler idea for the mouth plate, losing the front screw and assembly would definitely clean up the look and you could adjust it with just some hand pressure.

Originally Posted by pmcgee

Personally I think there's something lost between ...


and



Or are you just coitusing with us?
(... we're sorry about the whole tug boat thing)

((... "Five passengers set sail that day for a three hour tour. A three hour tour."))

Paul

FWIW ... from a wooden coffin plane with adjustable metal toe ...

adjustable coffin smoother.jpg

I think it will look pretty damn good however it ends up. The best part about your 'minnow' is the sheer solidarity of the thing. I've come to realise how important that is. The coffin smoother I made is much heavier than the Norris on which it is (somewhat loosely) based, and has a more massive chatter block. Despite my screwing up the lever cap fitment, and having slightly uneven pressure on the cap iron, it still worked well first off. I had to sand the end of the lever cap slightly askew to ensure even pressure - you can't see it, but I know it's there & it bugs me!

A couple of comments based on my own (limited) plane-making experience:

Make sure you allow plenty of room for shavings to exit. I made the throat of mine a bit tight and shavings don't exit well. This is largely a product of the very high blade angle (~60 deg), so there wasn't a lot I could do, but I should have sloped the bun side away at a lower angle. The high blade angle can also exacerbate the problem because on some woods in particular, it produces very crinkled shavings which quickly choke the narrow part of the throat.

As someone already pointed out, it's a lot easier to adjust that blade if it sticks out over the lever cap a little. I've come to really like the tappity-tap method of blade adjustment, and would not even consider an adjustment mechanism on any plane I made in the future. Which brings me to the last point - when you get around to fitting your lever cap, please walk us carefully through the process! That was the part I had the most trouble with on my plane, & got it a bit off, as stated. Your little monster has even fewer planes or parallel faces to work off, so it seems like a near-impossible task to me, & I would love to know the 'right' way to go about such things (or any way that has a bit more certainty of a successful outcome)......

Cheers,

Respect for being original and going for it. Maybe the rear is not enough to grip the tool though. How about a pine mockup to see how it all feels.
Great start.

I now have a faithful well mostly faithful piece of wax in the shape of the design.
Now to put on the critics hat and see what I think.

But for your viewing pleasure here it is as a 3D pdf! (only just found out that I can do that)

well in short ergonomics of the design is a flop. There are too many elements that don't work or fall short my desire.


The front handle is a complete failure: it provides no positive feel or feedback and on top of that it is almost impossible to pick it up by the front handle by itself. If this was made out of bronze it would be even harder.


The rear handle feels ok, but there is a void between the palm and the handle that makes it feel less comfortable than it could be, it is also too low or too far forward or a bit of both; the tips my fingers always seem to get in the way.one grip that works well is an over hand grip (as if you were using a block plane but the top is just a little to high for that to be comfortable for long periods of time.


Thing that I like from this are.
1. The smooth sweeping tappered shape of the sole.
2. The crisp line of the side arc.
3. The infill pattern of the rear handle.
4. the little notch at the back (although i think a little less dramatic would be better)
5. The thick walls bulge out at the mouth.
6. The cut out at the top just above the lever cap pins.



Time to get out the modelling clay.

Seen this one before? (Sauer & Steiner: New plane number 3)

(also has some design 'journey' on the page)

Originally Posted by IanW

Which brings me to the last point - when you get around to fitting your lever cap, please walk us carefully through the process! That was the part I had the most trouble with on my plane, & got it a bit off, as stated. Your little monster has even fewer planes or parallel faces to work off, so it seems like a near-impossible task to me, & I would love to know the 'right' way to go about such things (or any way that has a bit more certainty of a successful outcome)......

Cheers,

You're in fine company I think Ian ... look down to the words "lever cap" here: Sauer & Steiner: That badger plane

Oh that K13 is very nice... Kudos Konrad. I think i will have to use an element from your front handle, I just tried it with the clay, and it feels good..