Thread: T shaped rebate plane

Sure, don’t mind friends calling me Henry.

Funny name never really lends itself to be abbreviated or a nickname except my bro called me H or chook.

I think it’s become a little more popular lately.
H.

Hi,

Just found a T Shaped Rebate Plane in
my Rd Melhuish & sons catalogue which also
did a Compassed shaped one.

Martin.IMG_20210701_104551.jpgIMG_20210701_104635.jpg

Originally Posted by IanW

... You've all got me curious about the darned things now, they were obviously meant for some particular trade & purpose, which are both lost to the mists of time (or maybe not, someone, somewhere must know!). I was thinking, every state had its railway workshops and a complement of carriage-makers, and lots of specialty tools, many user-made, came out of such places. Are there any blokes surviving who worked on the old wooden carriages? They might have a good idea of what T-rebates were used for.

Cheers,
Ian

I am also hooked on that question.

The reference to carriage makers and coach makers could also refer to the gentlemen who made horse drawn vehicles.

Originally Posted by GraemeCook

The reference to carriage makers and coach makers could also refer to the gentlemen who made horse drawn vehicles.

I have always assumed those were the carriage/coach makers meant by the name. In comparison to many horse-drawn carriages and coaches, railroad coaches/carriages are positively rectilinear.

Hi,

Was the name of a Rebate Plane changed to a
Rabbet plane at some time as they have quoted a Side
Rebate plane in 1899 to a Side Rabbet plane in 1940s


Martin.

Originally Posted by old workshop

Hi,

Was the name of a Rebate Plane changed to a
Rabbet plane at some time as they have quoted a Side
Rebate plane in 1899 to a Side Rabbet plane in 1940s

Rebate is British spelling. Rabbet is American spelling. Not sure what you find in the various ex-colonies. I'm not sure which "they" you're referring to, but the name change may be a matter of a change in their market, or something similar.

Hi,

Here is a picture or a rabbet plane for curves.

Martin.IMG_20210701_183433.jpg

Hi Martin. Great catalogues. Thanks for the pictures!

Originally Posted by Bill Houghton

I have always assumed those were the carriage/coach makers meant by the name. In comparison to many horse-drawn carriages and coaches, railroad coaches/carriages are positively rectilinear.

Yes, me too, Bill. Coach-making preceded the steam locomotive by a few years, didn't it?

It just occurred to me at some stage that many of the techniques and tools (& the name of the trade) of the horse-drawn carriage-makers were carried over into the steam age & even into the first few generations of the motor car, so I was thinking there would be some residual knowledge/understanding of the tools of yesteryear amongst such folk. However, wooden carriages were being ousted by the all-metal versions by the middle of last century & carriage-making as a formal trade was dying out long before the current century rolled around. There can be very few, if any, of the genuine old practitioners left, as Henry has intimated.

Something else to keep in mind when trying to figure out why certain tools are like they are is that particular trades and particular localities developed their own ideas and sometimes a tool is made like it is more because of tradition than any demonstrable functional advantages over the more 'normal' form. Not sayin' that's the case with T-rabbets or T-rebates, but it's always worth bearing in mind......

Cheers,
Ian

PS: WRT spelling, "rabbet" is a corruption of "rebate", which is a very old word:
rebate (v.) late 14c., rebaten, "to reduce, diminish;" early 15c., "to deduct, subtract," from Old French rebatre, rabatre, rabattre "beat down, drive back," also "deduct," from re-, "back," or perhaps "repeatedly" (see re-) + abattre "beat down" (see abate). Original senses now are obsolete.

So the word/words as we use them in woodworking is itself a corruption of the original meaning & use. I've read conflicting claims as to which side of the Atlantic first used "rabbet". The word is pronounced as "rabbet" in many parts of Britain, just as "surfeit" is pronounced "soffit", so the American spelling is likely derived from British precedent.

As Oscar Wilde said, "Two countries divided by a common language"....

Originally Posted by IanW

Yes, me too, Bill. Coach-making preceded the steam locomotive by a few years, didn't it?
...

Hence, chariot planes?

I have found many photos and contemporary catalog entries about "T-shaped rebate planes", but I have not found a single reference about:

• who actually used them,
• what specific tasks were assigned to them, and
• how were they used.

The alternate name of coach makers plane gives a broad clue, but does not explain what the coach makers did with them or how they did it.

When I saw Mountain Ash's first post I immediately assumed that the plane was used to cut T-slots before routers were invented. Conjecturally the technique may have been:

• make trench where needed,
• use T-shaped rebate plane to widen base of trench on both sides to form t-slot.

But none of the photos that I have seen depict planes that were sharpenned and capable of cutting on the sides of the blade. All cut on the sole, only. They cannot pare into the sides of a trench.
My presumption was obviously wrong.

The key questions remain: What were they used for and how were they used?

Ive seen plenty of these T Rebates over the years at tool sales and the like . And have wondered myself what the advantage could be in using them . Ive also wondered how well the blade seats and if it got out of shape a little how it could flap around with those extended bits.

I went on a search for a good book I have after reading this thread. It gave a bit of information on the T Rabbet Plane . Interesting fact is that there is also an L Rabbet !

The Wooden Plane By John M . Whelan

The Wooden Plane By John M Whelan - Google Search




I probably shouldn't put pictures directly copied from the book should I ? So I've changed it . Not sure who I'm doing the wrong thing by . The Forum or the Author ?


Basically it says . Coachmakers had to trim the side and bottom of rebates in final fitting .They had limited space in which to work. One of his tools was the T Rebate in which the sole was extended beyond the stock. This offered a clearer view of the work and provided a bit more finger room . It also permitted paring either side of a groove by placing the tool sideways . Less frequently found is the L Rebate with a sole extended on one side only . There's a drawing of a L Rebate , a T Rebate and a compass T Rebate.

I have enjoyed this discussion and after reading the last post I went off and found a similar description of this plane in Graeme Blackburn's book "Traditional Woodworking Handtools". It confirms this T plane as a Coach and Carriage Makers rebate plane, and said that they often had convex curved soles as well as flat soles.
(There is also a later iron version of these T planes, which is quite short and made to be used one-handed)
Interesting, the book also describes the wooden predecessor of the Stanley 10 and 10&1/2 planes - the latter are often referred to as "Carriage Maker planes"

Hi Ian. Following on from the "horseless carriage" developments, I remember being quite suprised that a 1934 Packard that had been passed on from my grandfather to my dad (but unfortunately not to me ) had a wooden chassis wrapped in a metal skin. It was a beautiful car, straight 8 coupe with dickie seat, running boards and wire spoke wheels. Eventually sold to a mate of dads who finished the restoration.

Hi Rob and Paul. 2 books to add to the birthday list!!

Hi Graeme. Our next door neighbour used to restore jinkers, drays, wagons, buggies, etc. I wish I had paid more attention to his workshop