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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
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    East Ballina
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    Default 3 phase power machines

    It is not relevant to me at this stage, as all my machines are single phase, but for the sake of learning: what do all you woodies with bigger table saws that are three phase do? I assume normal residential power is not good enough? I assume you need a phase converter?

    Cheers guys

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  3. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Katoomba NSW
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    4,770

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    You can have 3 phase connected to your house. For smaller motors a single phase to 3 phase vsd works well.
    Those were the droids I was looking for.
    https://autoblastgates.com.au

  4. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Perth
    Posts
    27,757

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    It depends where you live but here in Perth there were quite a few houses built in the 70's and 80's with three phase power as standard. I think this was the time they thought folks were going to over time use lots of energy hungry devices.

    As far as converters are concerned, do a search for VFD or "variable frequency drive" and you will get more than you bargained for.
    VFDs used to be very expensive but are now relatively inexpensive enabling 3 phase machinery to be used in home workshop situations.

    There are a number of caveats but these will probably come out if you ask more questions.

  5. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    San Antonio, Texas, USA
    Posts
    3,070

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by hellofellow View Post
    It is not relevant to me at this stage, as all my machines are single phase, but for the sake of learning: what do all you woodies with bigger table saws that are three phase do? I assume normal residential power is not good enough? I assume you need a phase converter?

    Cheers guys

    If you're still interested in this subject I posted my conversion of a single phase bandsaw to three phase here:

    https://www.woodworkforums.com/f27/re...cuttin-181012/

    Very easy to do and pretty economical given the relatively low prices on three phase motors.

  6. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Perth
    Posts
    324

    Default

    A lot of older houses had 3 phase as standard, mine included .

    Many times it was installed to run instantaneous electric hot water systems. The remains of our system is still in the wall from the 1950's.

  7. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    San Antonio, Texas, USA
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    3,070

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    Quote Originally Posted by dalejw View Post
    A lot of older houses had 3 phase as standard, mine included .

    Many times it was installed to run instantaneous electric hot water systems. The remains of our system is still in the wall from the 1950's.
    Interesting. Here we only have two phases of 120v nominal. At the transformer apparently the voltage is 480 but the house feeders are stepped down. Most business properties have or are very close to three phase. Consequently three phase equipment is often extremely cheap here. I have my eye on a couple of three horse motors for sale locally for $50 each.

  8. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Qld Australia
    Posts
    175

    Default

    I had our house supply converted to 3 phase as I went out and bought two 3 phase welders, followed by a metal lathe, then made a wood lathe and a table saw all running on 3 phase. Should have done it when we had our house built but didn't. Haven't looked back since we upgraded, a bit expensive at the time but well worth it in the end. 3 phase is more efficient and the big gear can often be cheaper than the single phase stuff. Otherwise, as others have said single phase to 3 phase VFD's for the smaller motors.

    Cheers

    Ed.

  9. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Perth
    Posts
    324

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    Not just efficient, quiet as well.

    Love the hum of a 3phase motor compared to the scream of a single phase under load.

  10. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Perth
    Posts
    324

    Default

    Hey Ed, how much was the conversion?

  11. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    moonbi nsw Aus
    Age
    69
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    2,065

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    Its all BobL's fault!!!
    When I joined the Forum in 2009 Bob had a "how to" going on Alaskan Chainsaw mill. Well I got hooked. I started to produce 300mm wide boards so I figured I needed a 00mm Jointer as well as a 300mm Thicknesser. I had at the time a 260mm 240Volt under and over planer that was hopeless at doing its job so I then started to look around at old school machines that were hefty enough to have little vibration and be able to plane hardwoods. That then took me the 3Phase Converter route. I did a lot of "study" and may overloaded my pea brain but with the help of a couple of blokes from here I have a Converter that supplies me with the power I need from a 240Volt rural grid.
    I am as happy as a pig in poo with the set up. It must be contagious because a mate has just finished his own Converter. As far as cost goes ......The planers and a panel saw cost around $1800 and the Covnverter was about $800. Boy, I hope the wife doesn't read this she may do something that involves pain. By spending spread over a couple of years, you don't really notice the expense.
    Just do it!

    Kind regards Rod

  12. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Perth
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    Quote Originally Posted by chambezio View Post
    Its all BobL's fault!!!
    . . . . I am as happy as a pig in poo with the set up. . . . .
    Nice to know I have done this, usually I am blamed for sending people down the wrong creek without return propulsion.

    Quote Originally Posted by rob streeper View Post
    .
    .
    Consequently three phase equipment is often extremely cheap here. I have my eye on a couple of three horse motors for sale locally for $50 each.
    This area is about the only one as far as machines are concerned that we can compete with the US market on.

    Thus far the prices I have paid for 3 Phase motors are

    3 free (1/4, 1/2 and 1HP)
    1 @ $20 1HP
    2 @ $30 1HP and 3HP
    2 @ $35 1HP and 5HP
    2 @ $50 a never used 1/6 HP and a 4HP
    1 @ $70 a never used 2HP

  13. #12
    Join Date
    May 1999
    Location
    Tooradin,Victoria,Australia
    Age
    73
    Posts
    11,918

    Default 3 phase power machines Edit Blog Entry

    Moved here by at Eds request.

    Ed..


    , 24th Jan 2014 at 06:56 PM (6 Views)


    Originally Posted by dalejw
    Hey Ed, how much was the conversion?


    I am a bit hazy on the exact price now as it was a couple of years ago now, but I think it ended costing me about $1000-1400, and I didn't keep count of the cost exactly, but to clarify, I did most of the hard basic work myself and included buying all the components, I scrounged around for what I needed on the cheap, circuit breakers, switch/plugs/sockets, box, etc. came via ebay, conduit came from a local place, wire came from a metal recycle place, also the Sparky gave me a fixed quote of $400 (which he lost out on big time) as it took him much longer than he anticipated due to the complicated existing setup.

    If you do most of the work yourself and get a sparky to provide a labour charge of around $60/hour you should be able to get it done for about $1500-$2000, possibly less depending on how involved you want the setup to be and how good you are at getting good prices. If you pay retail expect $2-3K. My upgrade was complicated by the fact that I was running an extra 3 sub-Boards already as I am on acreage and have a couple of powered sheds and a large greenhouse that all had to load balanced at the main house circuit box, but a standard home wouldn't be that difficult or time consuming to load balance, which is where most of the time was spent.

    In the shed itself, I put up all the conduit, mounted the box and switches/sockets and ran the wires, the sparky just connected up all the switches/sockets and wired up the sub-board, that took about 3 hours. The main board about 10 hours and about 3 hours for connection from the house connection pole to the box. Energex didn't charge for the service connection from the street to the house pole and to the main meter, they replaced the main meter with a single poly phase one.

    I now have a 16mm main cable from the house to the shed and 10mm cables from the sub-board to the 3 switch/plugs which gives me about 80amps to play with if I need it, which is a huge amount, (about 33Kw), although I only use about 3-5Kw at the most at any given time which gives me a lot of head room in case I decide to get something really huge.

    It was well worth it!

    Cheers

    Ed.

  14. #13
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Perth
    Posts
    324

    Default

    Wow... That's super cheap. I know my view is tainted by coming from an industrial background AND I don't pay for my electrical work, but having some sort of 3 phase supply is the first thing I'd do setting up a more serious workshop.

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