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  1. #31
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    Dec 2013
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    San Antonio, Texas, USA
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    Didn't realize this thread was still active.

    I just completed this patio cover. 12' X 45' x 8.5' all welded steel frame with 26 ga. R panel roofing. Makes a great welding work area.

    Hmm, can't upload pictures, maybe later

    .patio cover 2.jpg
    Innovations are those useful things that, by dint of chance, manage to survive the stupidity and destructive tendencies inherent in human nature.

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  3. #32
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    Jun 2012
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    melbourne
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    Smile

    Quote Originally Posted by soundman View Post
    I've recently baught a G sized shielding gas...I'm still running out the old E...that is that last rental BOC will see from that machine.

    But I have decided not to put the G on the cart.

    I've strapped the G to the wall and it will stay there.

    I'll run a long hose to it.
    I have to run power to the machine so whay not gas...unlike oxy/acetylene pressure and flow are not critical.

    This makes the actual welder on its trolly much lighter and easy to move around.

    cheers
    You might find this increases your gas consumption. The reason being the hose between the cylinder and welder gets up to 25~50psi when you stop welding. When you start again, that pressure rushes out with a pop and being a longer hose, there's more of it to lose initially. You can buy a venturii thing to put just before the welder that limits the rush of gas when you firt pull the trigger but I haven't tried that. Some people put something inside the hose like rope or whatever, to reduce the volume. Instead I turned down the psi in the tube to just a few PSI (the screw behind the nut on your regulator). This means your flowmeter is not calibrated but its consistent and you can easily decide for youself what it should be through trial and error. As pressure in the cylinder drops, the flow will increase, but hardly a hassle and you only need to adjust it a few times during the whole cylinder charge, just using the usual flow meter knob. When I did this, I reckon I halved my gas consumption and that was just with a 4ft hose. I suppose if you do a lot of long welds there will be less effect. If you have to do welding to whatever standard, then I don't think you would be allowed to do this but for diy stuff, it definitely saves money

  4. #33
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    Sep 2008
    Location
    Perth
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    I never thought about that. Yep, I get the massive rushes of gas and yep, I wonder how much I'm wasting each time. I don't quite understand your tip so I'll have to look at my reg and see if I can figure it out. I like the idea of reducing volume though. Probably next to impossible with my single CK superflex cables.

  5. #34
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    melbourne
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    Regarding the regulator, there's a description on Wikipedia of how a gas regulator works. In the second diagram on that page you cans see the screw "factory set pressure" This is the pressure the hose will rise to, in-between welds.
    Reduce that pressure and there's les gas in the hose to cause the rush of gas when you start the next weld.

    I just turned the flow meter all the way up, and adjusted the factory set pressure down until I got about 15~20 lpm through the welder. Then leave the factory set pressure alone and adjust the flow meter down to about 3lpm. try a weld and reduce it until you see porosity in the weld, or obvious problems. The add a factor of safety by doubling or 3x's that figure or whatever you are happy with. Now when you pull the trigger there is no pop, just the hiss you get during a long weld.

    Over time, as the pressure in the cylinder drops, the flow will increase, so you need to readjust the flow meter again. No big deal. Definitely saves on a ton of gas.

  6. #35
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    Sep 2010
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    Lebrina
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    You must be using a bobbin type flow meter? http://images.machineryhouse.com.au/...1/700/Main.jpg
    Rather than mucking around with regulator pressures and stuffing up the calibration, why not separate the regulator and the flow meter, mount the flow meter on the welder and connect the two with your hose of whatever length. This way all calibrations remain accurate and life is simpler.

  7. #36
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    Jun 2012
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    melbourne
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    Quote Originally Posted by Karl Robbers View Post
    You must be using a bobbin type flow meter? http://images.machineryhouse.com.au/...1/700/Main.jpg
    Rather than mucking around with regulator pressures and stuffing up the calibration, why not separate the regulator and the flow meter, mount the flow meter on the welder and connect the two with your hose of whatever length. This way all calibrations remain accurate and life is simpler.
    Yes, that's the type of regulator I am using. I figured out how to paste a link now http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pressur...-regulator.svg
    What you suggest is a solution that people use too. You'll still get a bit of surge because there is a foot of hose in the welder but that would cut down the volume by about 4/5. There is a million ways to skin cat.
    For me, calibration is not important at all cos I am a cheapskate and don't have to be professional! I just wanted a cheap and easy solution. I came across that method because I had bought second hand MIg welder many years ago from an old welder, and that's all I used, didn't know any difference. It came with an old regulator that worked great and didn't have the pop and rush of gas when I started it. When I got the TIg welder it came with a new regulator and it was using gas probably 3 times faster than my old one. by comparing them, I could see how the old regulator was set up and just adjusted them both the same. Pretty simple really, nothing to buy or install.

    The other thing is, I like to see the flow meter on top of the cylinder so I can easily see when the post flow finishes

    I suppose if you really wanted to calibrate the flow you could maybe put a hose on your torch and see how long it takes to displace water in an upturned jar underwater.

  8. #37
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    The issue of gas flow is indeed an interesting one.
    I am currently going through all the welders at work and repairing/replacing gas lines and sorting our regulators and flow meters - a "G" size cylinder in less than a day when you have only welded for maybe one hour is a tad excessive methinks. Anyway one welder is presenting an interesting set of symptoms. It will weld along quite nicely but then for no obvious reason will produce severe porosity. In working through the issue, I noticed that the flow meter, which is a twin gauge type, not a bobbin model has defective gauges, (why is it that I can have a perfectly serviceable 20+ year old flow meter and work cannot get one to live past a couple of years????), and therefore gas flow had been set by the "screw it flat out" method until I started cutting them back and setting by ear. I swapped a known, serviceable flow meter and set it on 10LPM, quite adequate for dip transfer and Argoshield in an enclosed workshop normally. The problem improved greatly, but was still present and even at 15LPM indicated there still presents a tendency to porosity, at least part of which I blame on Argoshield gas combined with Duragal, Zincseal or Primed product. Next weapon in the arsenal will be to verify gas flow with one of these so we'll see just what is coming out the nozzle, thus eliminating kinks or restrictions.
    http://cuttingandwelding.co.uk/images/191_0003.jpg
    I know the line from the flow meter to the wire feeder is not leaking, but something strange is occurring for sure.
    Overall, it astounds me how some workplaces totally neglect the maintenance of equipment and instead pay $100's of dollars in wasted gas, consumables or reworks over time.

  9. #38
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    Canberra
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    Quote Originally Posted by Karl Robbers View Post
    You must be using a bobbin type flow meter? http://images.machineryhouse.com.au/...1/700/Main.jpg
    Rather than mucking around with regulator pressures and stuffing up the calibration, why not separate the regulator and the flow meter, mount the flow meter on the welder and connect the two with your hose of whatever length. This way all calibrations remain accurate and life is simpler.
    I have on of these on my beer gas cylinder - I assume the flow meter should be correct regardless of how the regulator is futzed with?

  10. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by RustyArc View Post
    I have on of these on my beer gas cylinder - I assume the flow meter should be correct regardless of how the regulator is futzed with?
    I always believed the same as well, but now I have my doubts since I bought one from an Australian ebay seller that was meant to be a 0-25lpm model. Even with the flow meter fully open, it wouldn't reach 25LPM, so I increased the pressure on the regulator until 25LPM was achievable. since then, at the lower end of the range it seems to be delivering more than the reading would suggest. I know it shouldn't in theory, but my ears tell me it is, which is another reason for getting the flow checker mentioned earlier. There is of course the very real possibility that the ebay flow meter is not accurate and 20LPM indicated may in fact be 25LPM. Once I have the flow tester, which should be early this week, I'll let you know how it turns out.

  11. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Karl Robbers View Post
    I'll let you know how it turns out.
    It'd be good to know, as at one point I needed a source of 150psi air for servicing a diaphragm pump, so I adjusted the CO2 regulator to give me that pressure. I turned it back down again afterwards, but I didn't really check what the pressure went back to. I assumed that if the ball bearing was still being blown up to 10lpm it was all fine.

  12. #41
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    melbourne
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    Quote Originally Posted by RustyArc View Post
    It'd be good to know, as at one point I needed a source of 150psi air for servicing a diaphragm pump, so I adjusted the CO2 regulator to give me that pressure. I turned it back down again afterwards, but I didn't really check what the pressure went back to. I assumed that if the ball bearing was still being blown up to 10lpm it was all fine.
    I have been reading an american welding forum for years and I remember this coming up. That forum gets quite technical (and very heated) but I'm sure these cheap flow meters are only calibrated to work for a set input pressure, usually 25 or 50 psi. For what its worth, I think they said they are not that accurate anyway. You can spend a lot of money on a real flow meter. I can't find anything now, so the only thing I can offer as evidence is this sales sheet for miller economy flow meters, which states a 50PSI preset delivery pressure, which ties in with what I remember. http://www.millerwelds.com/pdf/spec_...oductGuide.pdf


    On my other issue of reducing gas consumption for any other cheapskates, using a gas lens makes a big difference as well (for TIG anyway, not sure you get them for MIG?). A gas lens will allow you to run at lower flow rates, or it will give you greater coverage. It's just a thing that creates laminar flow so the gas is not turbulent. I use a no 8 lens for almost everything and in extreme cases, if I am working into a corner etc, I can get away with a stick out of maybe 3/4" with the gas lens. Just make sure you use a good bit of pre flow or click the button away from the work piece to get post flow going before you start. This makes up in some way for the bulky size of the gas lens.

    I just read one of the dissavantages of reducing the pressure pre-flowmeter is it will no longer compensate for blockages, if your hose gets kinked etc. Must admit its never been an issue for me

  13. #42
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    May 2011
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    Murray Bridge SA
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    Repaired a trailer for a friend the other day, it belonged to his FIL originally

    DSCF0096.jpgDSCF0097.jpgDSCF0098.jpgDSCF0099.jpg

    As you can see it was a bit rusted out. Replaced the floor, 300 mm X 100 mm strip on the 2 sides, and 100 wide strip across the front. Also had to box the front cross member, rusty, replaced and boxed the rear cross member, as it was rusted and broken.

    DSCF0106.jpgDSCF0104.jpg

    Whilst it was here, fitted extra tie rails to the front as well as protecting the mudguards. The rear end received treatment as well, with gussets to support the new lights, that were originally on the guards.
    We had to replace the axle, as the original was from something like a Ford Zephyr, I found a wheel bearing with Ford on it, tried to get new bearings for it $390 for the 2 sets. Hence the new axle, also replaced the coupling, which was the old 2" screw type, he couldn't work out why it was rattly on his 50 mm ball.
    Kryn

  14. #43
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    Just an update on the whole flow meter subject. My flow tester turned up and while I haven't had a chance to try it on my ebay flow meter, I did give it a run on the welder at work that was playing up. 15LPM on a well cared for flow meter actually resulted in around 5 LPM at the nozzle. No wonder it was giving porosity as the slightest air movement would be sufficient to upset the gas coverage. It took a setting of around 20 LPM to achieve 10 LPM at the nozzle. I know there are no gas leaks as this machine will hold gas pressure in the line for days and I have checked from the gas solenoid to the gun with soapy water. It just shows how much restriction can be in the lines and gas solenoid I guess.
    I will check on my own welders to see what the actual nozzle flow rates are when I have a chance, which could be some time as we currently have around 1800 hours of work on our books at the moment with only 3 men to do it.

  15. #44
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    May 2012
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
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    GANTRY CRANE.jpg
    Made this gantry crane about 4 weeks ago. I had to change out the slew ring on my little excavator (again). Did the same job 7 years ago but that time I used a Chinese engine crane rated at 2 tonne, but I think the powder coating is on the outside only and it's been rusting on the inside so I wasn't going to trust it this time. The gantry crane made it a lot easier and less stressful on the nerves LOL.

    The little bit on top is so I can take it off and push the crane under the shed roof truss if needed. Things would have been a lot simpler with a big shed with a high roof and a much taller door. I have to disassemble the crane just to get it in/out of the workshop.

    Keith.

  16. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by beefy View Post
    I had to change out the slew ring on my little excavator (again).
    I hired one of those Cat 1.8 tonne machines a year or so ago and the slew started slipping about a day into the job - I wonder if it's specific to that machine? That said, I'm guessing my machine had been "driven like a rental" including the odd (or many) slew turn.

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