Thread: GIS sail tweaking

Originally Posted by woodeneye

PS. I already had the Laser vang, so spent no money. It's a stupidly expensive Laser part at $400, so easy enough to rig up your own system from cheaper blocks. The main problem is that the distance is very short for a cascade. 8:1 is plenty, so a 4:1 with a single block doubler as MIK suggested here is fine.

That's a serious vang there Bruce! I'm curious to see how that set-up goes and how it compares with your previous set-up with a downhaul to the front of the boom and a vang behind.

ian

Originally Posted by Boatmik

Hi Bruce,

I am thinking with the vang effect ... it might be important not to overdo the vanging. Typically the vang lands on the boom a bit over 2ft back from the mast/gooseneck on this size of boat. But here the relevant measurement may be from the sail tack. So you are kindof adding a foot. Might be important to see if the leach is being closed prematurely up high.

I think it is very much likely with a straight leach rather than a roached sail. But very excited to hear how it works!

MIK

I sort of fiddled with a few different positions for the vanghaul's attachment to the boom as I wanted a good balance between vang and downhaul to start with. If it needs to go forward a bit, then we'll need to ditch the Laser system and rig up something else as it runs out of adjustment very quickly. Ordinarily I'd just remove one of the doublers, but it's an all spliced system with no knots and hence very fiddly to put together.

Before I head out, I think I'll rig up the adjuster for the boom restrainer.

While the vang does look like overkill, it is running out of adjustment at what I believe to be the maximum for the rig anyway, so it's not like it's creating huge forces on it. No more than my previous vang system anyway.

That was LESS likely.

The Less went missing.

Originally Posted by IanHowick

I have tape and a friction buckle which seems to work well and adjust quickly and easily with one hand. I may use these a little more on my boat, I'm thinking of running my downhaul into one of these so I can adjust the downhaul while sitting on the rail. Has anyone seen these used with tape on boats? They're cheap and easy to adjust with one hand, they save needing to depend on screws to hold a jamb cleat in place.

My wife is a hardcore backpacker, so we use lots of these friction buckles. I like them. They are strong, secure, and easy to loosen. And they don't rust. I think they could easily find more uses on boats. Thanks for the idea. I will certainly use them when I put my hiking straps in. And probably find some other uses too.

Originally Posted by paulie

I will certainly use them when I put my hiking straps in. And probably find some other uses too.

Ditto. I installed the wide/flat pad eyes on my bulkheads with this in mind.

I have the new boom, (I'm changing it's name to "The Slab"), all rigged up and ready to go. I'm dying to take it out for a test drive! I relashed the yard, following Bruce's rec on restricting throat movement, and snuck an inline clamcleat that I had sitting around on the peak outhaul.

It will be nice to finally crank on the downhaul, without bending my boom to the breaking point! Photos and action report to follow.

Even if I can't get out before this weekend, when we head to family in NY, all is not lost. My cousin races sunfish, and my uncle was a commercial yacht deliverer and Caribbean sail charter captain. I plan to pick their brains and steal their race rigging secrets. )

I was struck by what seems to be a big difference in the twist control on similar courses between the two top pictures of Clint and Callsign222's rigs and then mine below them:







I see a lot less twist in my rig on a reach compared to the boats above. The main difference would be how stiff my yard is, and how much draft I have in the bottom of the (loose footed) sail. (Maybe I'm in lighter wind and saiing a bit further off the wind?)

In the picture above I think I only had a 3:1 downhaul, no vang, and a tightly stretched spectra traveller with unrestricted travel which goes across just in front of the transom knees.

I'd be keen to hear Mik's and Woodeneye's comments on how different the sail shape looks, what's good and bad from the above.


Thanks,

Ian

Ian, judging by the white caps in the background, I think the US boats are in a bit more breeze. Even so, I think you have more of your downhaul on.

I am also wondering if the US boats are using low stretch spectra halyards.

There is another tweak to the rigging that will reduce the play between the yard and the mast so that more of the downhaul force is transmitted to the yard. I have mentioned this before some time ago, but not recently.

At the attachment point of the yard, I don't have a block. Instead, I pass the halyard directly through the two middle turns of the lashing. This holds the yard tighter against the mast. Seeing as the halyard doesn't move through the block, I could not see a reason for it. I'll see if I can find a pic from an old post.

Originally Posted by woodeneye

I am also wondering if the US boats are using low stretch spectra halyards.

yes. New England Ropes - Product Details

lowest stretch you can get without special ordering.

Excellent callsign.

Here is the file pic showing no block attached to the attachment point of the yard. However, this was taken before I realised that my halyard wasn't nearly tight enough. I now have the lashing much tighter than this pic shows. There are 4 turns of the lashing around the yard, and the halyard passes through the middle two turns. This holds the yard really tight. To tension the halyard, I pull it really tight. Then to get it even tighter, while it is still cleated, I grab the halyard and pull it away from the mast, like pulling a bow, and then take up that slack on the cleat. This method gets the halyard really tight.

What this does is take any slop out of the attachment point.

Attachment 218753

Originally Posted by woodeneye

Then to get it even tighter, while it is still cleated, I grab the halyard and pull it away from the mast, like pulling a bow, and then take up that slack on the cleat. This method gets the halyard really tight.

Back in the days of commercial sail, that was called "sweatin' up". You might have two men hauling sideways and 4 to 6 taking up the slack. There is an entire class of shanties optimized for the operation.

Also "bouncing up"

That's why I described it. If I'd said sweating or bouncing, half the population would say "huh?"

Just make sure the b..... thing is tighter than a fish's ar*e.

Originally Posted by woodeneye

That's why I described it. If I'd said sweating or bouncing, half the population would say "huh?"

Just make sure the b..... thing is tighter than a fish's ar*e.

"Sweating" is the term we use in the UK. Also "tighter than a duck's ar*e" but fish works well.

This has been such an interesting discussion as I was frustrated at the time it was taking to put reefs in and out on Sneaky.

I'm thinking of trying out the following...

Tack - one carabiner tied to the boom, it needs to be large enough that one, two for or three tack's can be on at the same time.

Outhaul - As it is now. bowline around the boom with the free end tied to the clew, the other end around a cheek block at the aft end of the boom and then forward to a V-cleat

Reefs one and two - lines permanenltly rigged with thin spectra. Line is ties to itself around the boom then up though the clew and back to another cheek block before going onto a V-cleat on the boom

With this system it should just be just a case of clip on the reefing tack, pull in the clew and go sailing. It is a lot more string though...