Thread: Goat Island Skiff in Berlin, downwind-rigging

Hello Bjarne,

Whether they are improvements or just something I find working well:

1. System to store oars and paddles on the GIS. The 9 feet oars just fit between the stem and the side arms of the midship bulkhead. The paddles fit between the side arms of the second bulkhead and the side arms of the midship bulkhead. This way everything is properly stored and secured and not in the way. I saw Peter Hyndman (the buyer of the 1st set of GIS plans and the builder of the second GIS ever built) using the rope loops system for storing the paddles on his Gruff.





2. I have substituted the block on the yard for a dyneema rope loop. The block kept digging in the sides of the mast and thus damaging it. The dyneema rope loop is holding up great to date, but I check it regularly for wear and tear.



3. I rig the traveller a bit further back and not on the side arms (please note that this is in deviation to MIK's plans as he specifies to rig this on the side arms where screws are specified). With the traveller further back, it is easier to store the sail when not in use and to hoist it. The biggest adventage however is that the aft deck now is now cleared for the first 20 cm's or so and that the crew can sit here when rowing and the helmsman when sailing downwind in big waves to keep the bow from digging in when surfing down waves.

4. The closed cellfoam mats are true bum savers for long sails.

Best wishes,

Joost

Originally Posted by Joost

3. I rig the traveller a bit further back and not on the side arms (please note that this is in deviation to MIK's plans as he specifies to rig this on the side arms where screws are specified). With the traveller further back, it is easier to store the sail when not in use and to hoist it. The biggest adventage however is that the aft deck now is now cleared for the first 20 cm's or so and that the crew can sit here when rowing and the helmsman when sailing downwind in big waves to keep the bow from digging in when surfing down waves.

The oar i already have found out

But can you explain no 3 - im not sure what you mean

Bjarne

Hello Bjarne,

The traveller is tied around the inwale spacers aft of the side arms of bulkhead no. 4. This is approximately 15 - 20 cm's back of the forward edge of the aft deck and sufficiently back to enable one to sit on the aft seat without having to take away the traveller. I don't have any pictures showing this set up but will try to take some next time I go sailing.

Best regards,

Joost

Originally Posted by Joost

Hello Bjarne,

The traveller is tied around the inwale spacers aft of the side arms of bulkhead no. 4. This is approximately 15 - 20 cm's back of the forward edge of the aft deck and sufficiently back to enable one to sit on the aft seat without having to take away the traveller. I don't have any pictures showing this set up but will try to take some next time I go sailing.

Best regards,

Joost

Hey Joost

Yes, picture please

But i think i know what you mean

bjarne

It just occurred to me the elimination of the square lashing of the boom to the mast, allowing a highly tensioned downhaul to do that work, is introducing some incredible stresses to the attachments when on starboard tack (if the boom is to port of the mast).

Here's an example of the concept: your car is stuck in a mud bog and you have some dyneema rope but no tackle to increase the pulling power. There's no way one person can pull the car out with brute strength in a straight-line pull. But let's say there is a stout tree that you can secure the line to. You tie off to the car, then tie off tight to the tree. Instead of a direct pull you go to the middle of the line and pull sideways. You have multiplied your meager 1hp (human-power) to many hp.

That's what happens to your downhaul attachments when the downhaul is tasked with holding the boom close to the mast.

Hello MAM,

Have you read my post on page 2 with regards to the lashing:

Originally Posted by Joost

Hello Bjarne, Bruce,
I don’t use the tether for the following reasons:
1. With the square mast the tether has to be quite loose to allow the boom to move freely
2. The downhaul sufficiently keeps the boom near the mast. I have tried the tether, but as it needs to be quite loose as described under 1, it loses its function completely as the downhaul kicks in before the tether does.
3. The downhaul system I use is plenty strong (harken 16 mm blocks, dyneema lines, etc.) to withstand the forces applied and it allows for easy and fast adjustment depending upon wind force. The karabiners make for easy and fast unclipping of the downhaul.
4. I don’t like the downhaul line to go over the top of the boom as it can interfere with the boom swinging from one side to the other side in light winds. My system allows for easy pivoting.
Hope this helps.
Regards,
Joost

Next to this, the mastpartner has been reinforced (as described a couple of posts later). Please note that most gear can handle static forces (like on the downhaul) pretty well. It is dynamic forces that usually end up breaking things (like a broken boom in a sudden unexpected jibe).

Please also note that this is my personal approach on rigging the downhaul on my GIS. In my experience the square lashing just doesn't work on a balanced lug rig with a square mast. I am aware that it puts a lot of stress on ropes, mast and hull structure, but it has held up fine in quite severe conditions. If using a square lashing, you will still have the same issue you describe, but than above the boom.

On a side note: If I would ever make a new mast, it would probably be a round birds mouth mast using the boom set up I have seen on Paul Gartside's Yaquina Bay One-Design "Swansong" (Design #146): a boom jaw on one side of the mast that keeps the boom near the mast with the downhaul pulling the jaw slightly forward to keep it around the mast.

Kind regards,

Joost

i have read both opinions but i will still give it a try next spring.

Originally Posted by Maximuss

i have read both opinions but i will still give it a try next spring.

Nah, get out and try it in the middle of winter **evil smilie** ... only it's winter here so it'd be summer there so what's stopping you from trying it now?

Richard

Originally Posted by Daddles

Nah, get out and try it in the middle of winter **evil smilie** ... only it's winter here so it'd be summer there so what's stopping you from trying it now?

Richard

hehe - im a chicken when the temperature drops below 20c
And im sure if i capsize, i will experience ice on the water on EXACT that spot

Bjarne

Joost, I have seen Gartside's boom jaw and since my course with him have always drawn these into my booms. Make total sense...the key is to have with certainty the position of such an installment. Paul's lug are pretty, too. More roach than Michael's so you need battens. They are a sort of standing lug meets balance lug. A nice balance of the two rig. (Paul gave me a copy of Swansong's lines. About the prettiest dinghy I've ever seen). I'd love one of those, too. Too many boats, too little time.

Clint

Designer's attitude to the gartside yoke,

It is more work and reduces some of the flexibility of moving the boom forward or aft a bit to make sure the boat balances. the square lashing is simple and cheap so won't plan to change the plans.

However if specific builders find methods that work for themselves and don't work any less well than the standard method I am quite supportive!

MIK