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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    usa
    Posts
    40

    Default Finally Building Eureka (and this time I mean it!)

    I am working again on my Eureka, only the hardest core of you will remember I had the wood and was figuring out how to loft over a year and a half ago! Well, I lofted it, but I didn't have a batan and also had serious amounts of first cut fear. The following is an excerpt of an email I sent to the man himself, but reading the body I was replying to, he suggested asking such things here so I also thought this would be good )

    I actually decided my woodworking skills weren’t up the eureka (because they were non-existant and I botched a book shelf I was also trying even) so I bought a clc kit for the kayak I had been eyeing. My dad is visiting Florida for the winter (3 months!) and so he has helped me with my kayak. We were up to glassing the hull (it is a mill creek 13 btw) and on the sanding knocked the boat off the saw horses L Anyway, there is an indentation on the sheer panel I will live with, but there was a pretty good sized (not enough for me to worry about functionality but enough to worry about the look at the front of my boat when turned over J ) knick in rounded over edge/fillet so I mixed up some “peanut butter”, repaired it and filled a couple of very tiny voids in the outside fillet (since I was doing stuff, would have ignored otherwise) and basically settled in for a lost day. I had already lofted the Eureka and so we went and cut out the first 3 panels. (I used the gunwale from the mill creek kit as my batan )



    My problem is the sheer (side) panel has a couple of areas where the cut was 3mm inside the line or so. At this point in time I am not sure which side it was. We basically had a saw malfunction where the blade had tilted itself (on a saw with a fixed blade O ) Anyway, I figure if it is the top, I can plane the little bit fat, and if it is the bottom, I can adjust my tightness for that part. It seems better for me to actually work on it rather than wait to try to acquire another piece of ply. Am I out of line with my thinking here? We went late in the night last night and I have all 10 parts cut out, so I will probably start stitching later this week. Given I know that panel is off, what should I look for?


    Thanks everyone!


    Danielle

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  3. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Victoria, BC, Canada
    Posts
    76

    Default

    It's no fun when saws break the bound of their set angles. Just yesterday one of the table locks on my bandsaw decided to vibrate itself loose while I was trying to manhandle the 12 foot long mast for my boat through it, resulting in the whole table flexing awkwardly, binding the blade and actually stalling out the motor.

    Your problem sounds pretty easily fixed - I definitely wouldn't order a new sheet just for that. I'm sure most people would back me up when I say that learning to fix mistakes is all part of the learning experience.

    If the bumps are actually outside the line then, like you say, you can just plane them off and all will be well.

    If they are along the sheerline (top edge of the side of the boat) then filling them is probably only a cosmetic issue. In this case I'd continue as per normal and when the time comes to fit the gunwale, let it along a fair curve (the wood will naturally tend to bend along a smooth, fair curve). Your bumps will probably drop slightly below the line, but you could build up the panel either with thickened epoxy or a small strip of plywood, edge glued to the rest of the panel. A straight butt-joint of plywood isn't usually a strong connection, but if you're only adding 3mm to a 6mm thick panel then it'll work just fine.



    If they are along the bottom edge of the side panel then you can probably just ignore them - when you go to stitch the panels together you'll get small gaps, but they'll be covered by the epoxy and tape anyway, and shouldn't cause any problems.

  4. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Adelaide
    Posts
    2,139

    Default

    Top or bottom side of the sheer panel 3mm is not a lot. Run your batten along the edge and check you have a fair curve if not pin the two panels together and after drawing a fresh line that is fair plane the two panel edges to the new line. Don't be too ambitious as has been said the stitching and resultant tape and epoxy will fill small gaps along the lower edge and along the top you can plane the ply down to the gunwhale after positioning it to suit any low spots and it's been glued up.

    Depending on the thickness of your ply you will find getting panel edges to meet exactly is difficult so again don't be concerned about small gaps of even 2 or 3mm they can be filled from the outside after taping the inner edge.

    Remember epoxy and paint cover a multitude of sins.

    Have fun
    Mike
    "Working to a rigidly defined method of doubt and uncertainty"

  5. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    'Delaide, Australia
    Age
    65
    Posts
    8,138

    Default

    Hi Mike .. that was my reply via email.

    Danielle got some of her materials from our old friend PAR .. excellent!

    And welcome back Danielle!

    Michael

  6. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    usa
    Posts
    40

    Default

    My dad and I planed the parts last night (well, dad did the actual planing, I was director/quality control/part holder ) and glued them together last night! I plan on stitching tonight (sending mom and dad to see Jersey Boys - it is mom's birthday), will put pics up when I am 3-d!

  7. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    'Delaide, Australia
    Age
    65
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    8,138

  8. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Eustis, FL, USA
    Posts
    2,270

    Default

    I agree, 3 mm isn't enough to worry about, I'd just knock the whole thing down until you had a fair line. So, the boat will be about an 1/8" lower in the sheer. No one's going pull out a tape measure and start giving you grief over it.

    Look out guys, I've seen pictures and this first time builder is pretty good.

    One thing to remember about jigsaws is the blade will wander a bit. This is normal, especially if apply a fair bit of forward pressure while cutting and also on lower cost units. It'll get noticeably worse in thicker and/or hard materials. Two tips: first don't push the saw, guide it and let the blade do it's job, which is to eat wood in it's path. Second is to use a good quality, sharp blade. Dull blades will wander much more then sharp ones and cheap blades will do the same. Pretty much the same rules that apply when selecting boy friends Danielle. Lastly, while on the subject of jig saws, be aware of the pressure you do apply, as you guide the saw. A right hander will tend to push the saw to the left slightly and the reverse is true of south paws. It's just a natural tendency and hasn't anything to do with political affiliation or karma. Try hard to apply even pressure. I use my thumb from behind the saw to insure I'm pushing on the saw's centerline, when trying to make precise cuts. This is perticularly true on curves, as the bottom of the cut, where the blades exits the wood, will lag behind the top of the blade, which is where you're watching. This is the nature of using a jig saw (a reciprocating saw does the same thing as does a band saw).

  9. #8
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    New Jersey, USA
    Posts
    767

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by PAR View Post
    ...use a good quality, sharp blade. Dull blades will wander much more then sharp ones and cheap blades will do the same. Pretty much the same rules that apply when selecting boy friends Danielle...
    Woodworking is like life!!! Well said!
    Dave
    StorerBoat Builder, Sailor, Enthusiast
    Dave's GIS Chronicles | Dave's Lugs'l Chronicles | Dave's StorerBoat Forum Thread

  10. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    usa
    Posts
    40

    Default

    LOL Par - I am sure you are right! ) My dad has done most of the jigsawing.

    I will figure out how to upload pics again. Last night I stitched (sorry Par - I still put holes in my boat) the bilge panels to the bottom panel. I have a fairly large gap in the middle on the port side (or is it the starboard side) (ok, I find that to be pretty funny since it is a symmetrical boat ) I will see what the reason is when I get the canoe stitched fully up and spread properly. I was a little distressed because I had an inverse rocker on the boat, but finally realized that will go away when the sides are stretched.

    For the near term, I will be going back to my Kayak kit. The epoxy on the bottom has a couple of areas it didn't really fill the weave properly, but we decided we had enough epoxy on there to wait and sand it and see everywhere that needs "repairing". So, I am going to head back to working on the cockpit area, sanding down my learning curve, rolling a fresh coat everywhere on the inside, and progress towards getting the deck going. At some point soon, I will be waiting for drying and will head back to the Eureka!

    I asked Par this, but I will throw it out here as it applies to the Eureka too. What do I do for the areas that are covered by decking? For my Kayak, I will probably ultimately put a hatch in the aft compartment, so do I need to varnish at least that section before I put the deck on?

    Thanks all!

    Danielle

  11. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    usa
    Posts
    40

    Default

    Here are some pics I took.

    The first one is the Eureka with the bilge panels stitched to the bottom panel. Two problems, one is that I couldn't back up any further - wow that is a long boat ) and two the lighting this morning was bad. The rest are of the Kayak kit I am putting together. I really think the boat is going to look really nice! The last pic is a shot of how bad my epoxy work is and that I have some real prep work on the inside to do. There are areas where the weave may not be filled and wow, look at that pool of goo! ( So, the praise from Par may be a little overblown and he may need to retract it after seeing a closeup )

    (oh, and the panels on the floor are the sheer panels for the Eureka )

  12. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Eustis, FL, USA
    Posts
    2,270

    Default

    Okay, how many of you guys got fillets looking like that right out of the box? My first few looked worse.

  13. #12
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    usa
    Posts
    40

    Default

    I did the fillets in 3 nights. The forward compartment which isn't planned to have a hatch, the aft compartment which might have a hatch and the cockpit. The bottom to bilge was my fillet. The top one was my dad's, because we were having issues doing a fillet without much of a an angle.

    Editted to add: the purpose of point this out is that this was my 3rd set of fillets )

  14. #13
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Fenwick, Michigan
    Age
    75
    Posts
    908

    Default

    Those fillets look good to me!

    The kayak is looking great and, I'm sure, the Eureka will, too.
    Building Gardens of Fenwick, a Welsford Parthfinder
    Gardens of Fenwick
    Karen Ann, a Storer GIS
    Goat Island Skiff - Sacramento

  15. #14
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Savannah GA USA
    Posts
    583

    Default

    Nice to make your acquaintance, IMA.

    Regarding jigsaws/saber saws and their blades: (1) start with a good/heavy saw like the Bosch, and (b) buy only bi-metal blades. Even if there is no chance of hitting a nail the bi-metal blades will pay dividends far beyond their additional cost. I don't believe I've ever worn out a bi-metal blade, just bent them or broke them in a jam. One blade will last for years barring such an accident.

    Bi-metal blades last forever because they aren't ruined by the heat that kills the typical wood cutting blade. Look for BIM in the description; also, many BIM blades will be painted white or have a portion of the blade painted white. Just make sure you see bi-metal or bimetal or BIM somewhere on the package.
    The "Cosmos Mariner,"My Goat Island Skiff
    http://s176.photobucket.com/albums/w168/MiddleAgesMan/

    Starting the Simmons Sea Skiff 18
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/37973275@N03/

  16. #15
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    usa
    Posts
    40

    Default

    Thanks I will work on that!

    We glassed the bow and stern of the kayak and I have the Eureka stitched. What is interesting to me is that the two smaller spreader bars are "just right" and not in place. The middle spreader was not held in place either, so I threw a strap over the middle of the boat to keep it in place.

    I will probably loft the bulkheads tonight and who knows, we may be off and running. The boat had a lot of twist, visible without winding yet, but it also moved itself pretty easily. I will do a proper winding after I have the bulkheads cut out.

    I do have a question though. For the gunwales, the stock I was provided is 30mmx15mm - is there anything I can do with that? (the plans call for 25mmx19mm. Obv I can rip the long side. The Oregon feels quite stiff, will it bend enough? That remains to be seen too )

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