Thread: authenticity ... milk paint

Interesting discussion. I still stand by my opinion that milk paint is a nice myth. Two references, wow I found several milk paint recipes that were all whitewash. The stuff just wasn't used to paint furniture. Distemper paint was used on furniture.

I will cover the subject in my next book on C19 furniture finishes, hopefully it will read like a grade twelve paper.

Stephen

Originally Posted by Shepherd

Interesting discussion. I still stand by my opinion that milk paint is a nice myth. Two references, wow I found several milk paint recipes that were all whitewash. The stuff just wasn't used to paint furniture. Distemper paint was used on furniture.

I will cover the subject in my next book on C19 furniture finishes, hopefully it will read like a grade twelve paper.

Stephen

What laboratory testing was done on the old paint that 'confirmed' it was lead paint? It is likely lead was a pigment added to the paint and possible it had an oil glaze topcoat. That would appear in 'laboratory testing' to contain lead and oil wouldn't it. Were mass spectrometry or electrophoresis tests conducted to determine the presence or otherwise of milk protein? It's poor form not to mention what specific types of tests were done, it ends up reading like a tooth paste commercial.

Cheers
Michael

Originally Posted by Shepherd

I will cover the subject in my next book on C19 furniture finishes, hopefully it will read like a grade twelve paper.

Stephen

Ah, so it will be a collection of quotes exclusively from Wikipedia. Good choice.

Originally Posted by Woodwould

Ah, so it will be a collection of quotes exclusively from Wikipedia. Good choice.

I was going to say ouch!

but this little snippet...
"There is an occasional reference to ‘casein’ paint made from cheese and used by artists as a light duty paint, but it is not milk paint. Casein is a phosphoprotein that was developed in 1841, so the history is not that old."

...intrigued me again so I decided to google 'casein 1841'

It turns out the origin of the WORD 'casein' dates to 1841, eg Casein | Define Casein at Dictionary.com (about 1/3 down under word origin and history) . I am so disappointed that this was interpreted to mean the casein protein was developed in 1841. I am even more disappointed that little effort went into checking the facts before making sweeping statements to a wide audience.

Cheers
Michael

Two references, wow I found several milk paint recipes that were all whitewash.

Yes, two without even trying very hard and both in books written in the the 19th century in the US. Both calling it "milk paint". You say you couldn't find any reference to it, so I guess you didn't look very hard.

Your argument appears to hinge on what you define as the fine line between whitewash and paint, which is incredibly pedantic, even by my standards.

Plain and pleasant talk about fruits ... - Google Books Found this while looking for an answer - still looking but at least the source document is dated 1859

^ Beecher, Henry Ward (1859). Plain and pleasant talk about fruits, flowers and farming. Harvard University: Derby & Jackson. p. 187.

Can't find too much else out there except for the same blurb being repeated on every website I check. Paint thousands of years old used by caveman etc

He's at it again! The first two hits for 'venice turpentine' on Google basically covers the lot. "Solid" turpentine? I can't accept that. Turpentine is distilled sap/resin and not a solid.

As for "1 ½ ounce indicates this is in solid not liquid form"... of course it's liquid! What is an ounce if not 1/40th of a quart (or 1/32nd in the US)? Unless the quart of "Rectified spirits of wine" is a US dry quart.

Oh the perils of becoming a Google smart!

Originally Posted by Woodwould

He's at it again! The first two hits for 'venice turpentine' on Google basically covers the lot. "Solid" turpentine? I can't accept that. Turpentine is distilled sap/resin and not a solid.

As for "1 ½ ounce indicates this is in solid not liquid form"... of course it's liquid! What is an ounce if not 1/40th of a quart (or 1/32nd in the US)? Unless the quart of "Rectified spirits of wine" is a US dry quart.

Oh the perils of becoming a Google smart!

Look up turpentine in the OED [Oxford English Dictionary] or the Oxford Universal Dictionary.

Hey keep up the ad hominems.

Stephen

Originally Posted by Shepherd

I will cover the subject in my next book on C19 furniture finishes, hopefully it will read like a grade twelve paper.

You're not setting the bar very high then?

Out of curiosity, was there any use of cheese paint?

Originally Posted by Shepherd

Look up turpentine in the OED [Oxford English Dictionary] or the Oxford Universal Dictionary.

According to the OED (I never heard of that acronym before – thanks) turpentine is an "oleoresin secreted by certain pines and other trees and distilled to make rosin and oil of turpentine". Oleoresins are not solids and the 'turpentine' referred to is obviously the wider acceptance of the word – the volatile spirit.

I just painted a Windsor chair that I made at a course at the Melbourne Guild of Fine Furniture, before Christmas. I painted it with milk paint..It comes from America as a powder.

This is the chair.">

This is the Milk Paint ">

I've worked within the artists paint manufacturing business for 20 odd years and have read just about every ancient recipe book and treatise there is on paints, resins, varnishes, oils etc. And I have never seen any recomendation of using a milk/casein paint on furniture, except for in the last 15 years so called "experts in folk art" who promote DIY painting of hideous flowers on mdf gegaws. Most so called milk paints sold are acrylics that have been adulterated with fillers to get that horrible chalky look. Plaka made by pelican was a casein gouache that was made till a few years ago for designers and sign writers, I spilt some on a chair once and it would continually come off on to my trousers, thus suggesting that it was useless as a furniture finish.

Ps. Talens sell a good Venice turpentine, expensive but the real thing with no dilutive

Ian

Originally Posted by Ian Wells

I've worked within the artists paint manufacturing business for 20 odd years and have read just about every ancient recipe book and treatise there is on paints, resins, varnishes, oils etc. And I have never seen any recomendation of using a milk/casein paint on furniture, except for in the last 15 years so called "experts in folk art" who promote DIY painting of hideous flowers on mdf gegaws. Most so called milk paints sold are acrylics that have been adulterated with fillers to get that horrible chalky look. Plaka made by pelican was a casein gouache that was made till a few years ago for designers and sign writers, I spilt some on a chair once and it would continually come off on to my trousers, thus suggesting that it was useless as a furniture finish.

Brilliant! Have a greenie on me!