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  1. #31
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    3

    Default cutting tsh in naf's

    Hi Jim, I've been reading this forum for a while, I also make N.A.F's for a living. I also don't give away secrets that have taken me years to work out. When I started making these flutes years ago my first few flutes made good firewood. Bill is right in what he says although he has his way of doing it and I have my way of doing it. Burning the TSH is a very inacurate way of doing things, I've tried it. Lots of slow patient work with chisels, files, carving knives and finally fine sand paper will give you a flute that plays with the slightest breath and sounds good. Smooth air flow with no turbulance is paramount to a good sounding flute. There is no quick way of voicing a NAF and getting a good result, I've tried every way I can think of. There's a heap of books and info around that will give you lots of info in this area of flute making, all you have to do is find them.
    Happy flute making
    Shunka28

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  3. #32
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Kyogle NSW
    Posts
    97

    Default

    Hi Shunka28, welcome to the forum and thanks for your contribution. Great to see other NAF makers joining the forum too.

    PHP Code:
    "Burning the TSH is a very inaccurate way of doing things" 
    I believe that's incorrect. It really depends on the skill of the maker and weather he/she has perfected the process as to weather the method is accurate or not. Burning the TSH in can certainly make accurately cut and profiled holes if done correctly and there are some of the world’s best makers that use this method exclusively.

    I certainly don't make TSH's that are inaccurate and pride myself in neat precise holes that bring a whole full bodied sound. These are drilled, burned, and cut, then finished with files to remove any charred wood down to the hardened wood and this also gives me room to square them off precisely because you don't use burning to go all the way when you use this method.

    I like this method for many reasons and I have used a few other different ways to produce TSH's and made hundreds of flutes and drones those ways, those methods are good too and I wouldn't say they are any better or not but burning if you can do it accurately and get comfortable with it, brings an old traditional feel to the instrument as well as sealing the wood and I find it fun as well. I will say that this method definitely takes more skill and accuracy with the poker tool and how hot it is can make a difference too, can take a fair few goes with the poker and there's no hurry. I like a TSH that is formed by hand for voicing purposes mainly and letting a machine do it all just dosen't make sense to me but I won't get into that here.

    For some woods such as really hard woods I wouldn't recommend it but still can be done if incorporated with a sharp detail knife and a fine chisel and of course files.

    I agree there’s no quick way to voice a NAF still it takes me a lot of time, I don't see the point though of things taking longer than they have to though to do them well, and so this process makes very good sense.

    We all have our ways we prefer, but as always there are many ways to skin a cat.

    Fire is a great tool if you can tame it.

    Enjoy the flute making

    Spirit Flutes


  4. #33
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Sydney, Australia
    Posts
    3

    Default

    Hi All. Just wondering if this thread is still going as no one has posted for a while or if there is a new one going (Sorry im new to posting). Im looking into making my own NAF and would appreciate any help given. Im a complete beginner who has just started reading up on the subject. I would love to know the basic tools needed to get started and the best way to go about it.

  5. #34
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Coffs Harbour
    Posts
    2,015

    Default

    Hi Joe1

    Have you found the information that you were looking for?

    I have been making several flutes lately so might be able to help you a bit.

    The information earlier in this thread has all the basic information and good suggestions for links on the web.
    I bought a Kit - a partly made flute - for my first attempt. It meant I was certain to get a good sounding flute.

    Tools can be pretty basic. A router and a core box bit to make the bore.t
    Then a rasp and sandpaper for shaping the outside and a few drills for the soundholes.

    I bought a book called "Flute Shop" by R A Wolf. It has several plans and is easy to follow.
    Scally
    __________________________________________
    The ark was built by an amateur
    the titanic was built by professionals

  6. #35
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Sydney, Australia
    Posts
    3

    Default

    Hi Scally

    Thanks for your reply. I have sourced some info from the Yahoo Native Flute woodworking group. Also the person i bought a flute from kindly bored out a piece of timber for me (Red Cedar) and gave some tips on shaping, making the TSH, Tuning etc. I have now almost finished my first flute. It was done by hand and took a while to get it where it is (lucky the wood is soft and very easy to work with). In all honesty it looks ok but is tuned terribly. Still happy with it though as it does play or rather it makes noise. Given its my first one its taught me what not to do with my next one. Hopefully the next one will turn out better. Any tips you can give on tuning and hole spacing though will be very much appreciated.

    Look forward to hearing from you.

    Joe

  7. #36
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Coffs Harbour
    Posts
    2,015

    Default

    Getting the first one done will have sorted out most of the basics for you.

    My first one was a mess.

    Getting the sound holes right is the trickiest. Then seal the inside of the flute with estapol or epoxy. This really helps with the sound.

    Then trim the end of the flute until you get the fundamental.

    I haven't found a simple formula for the tuning hole location. I used the suggested location for the first hole and drilled a 1/8th in hole. Then you can enlarge it to raise the note.
    If it is too far away you can plug it and start again.
    The rest are easier.

    You can use the first flute to give you a good idea of the location for your next flute.
    Scally
    __________________________________________
    The ark was built by an amateur
    the titanic was built by professionals

  8. #37
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Victoria
    Posts
    4

    Default Hello

    Hi,, Is this thread still alive or died,, is there a site where i can get alook at some of your flutes spiritflutes?

  9. #38
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Sydney, Australia
    Posts
    3

    Default Hello

    Hi Brawler. This thread hasn't been going for a while. You can check out the other threads regarding flute making. The web site you are looking for is as follows.


    http://www.spiritsong-flutes.com/

    Hope that helps.

    Joe

  10. #39
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Victoria
    Posts
    4

    Default

    cheers joe,,that link kept timing out,,I have some very pretty huon pine here and some blackheart sassifrass that will be my next few projects,,cant we get this thread to come back to life again??

  11. #40
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    3

    Default Flute Info.

    Hi Brawler, welcome to the forum. I don't normally get on these forums but I do like to read them occasionally. There's lots of info around about NAF's, for info on voicing go to FluteKey.com, there's some usfull stuff there. For finger hole placement there's a heap of guys offering specs on Ebay but they're only a basic guide, it's basically trial and error.
    I've been working with timber since I was 8 years old and am now in my 50th year of working with the stuff and just getting the hang of it. I've been making flutes for 10 years now and drums for 11 years and I'm still learning. If you want to have a look at some nice flutes try www.wolfdrums.com . I used to split and glue my flutes but now presision bore all of them, I also use accepted woodworking practises with fixing end caps and timber inlay work, I don't just glue them on.
    There's so many little tricks with the NAF's that you have to learn for yourself, no one is going to tell you all the secrets. I don't want to discourage you but it's taken me 10 years of constant research to get my flutes to where they are now. Don't be frightened to experiment with different voicings or with different timbers. There's many Australian species that are accepted acoustic quality timber but I've found there's just as many that are acoustic quality and aren't recognised that make real nice flutes. Hope the info helps, Shunka28

  12. #41
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Victoria
    Posts
    4

    Default

    cheers shunka,,very nice flutes on that site,mine are less fancy but still sound good,I charge less than 100 bucks for a cedar F# with a bit of burned design on it,I figure that all the fancy work and high prices makes them in some cases out of reach for people,,

  13. #42
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    3

    Default

    Hi Brawler, good to hear you like the flutes. As for price, as a professional instrument maker my knowledge, expertise and time cost money. I've found that people like the fancy bits and pieces, that's why I have lay-by so people can afford very high quality flutes. If you think I'm expensive have a look at a couple of the American flute makers sites. There's also a N.A. guy I've been told about who works with sinker cedar logs exclusively and from what I'm told produces some stunning flutes with lots of inlay work. He works on custom order only at up to $8,000us per flute. shunka28

  14. #43
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Dandenong, Vic
    Posts
    2,029

    Default

    Hi, I tried my first which is a dud. The bore wasn't good enough and the wall thickness to thick.
    The second came out great, E Fundamental and tuning was easy enough. 7/8 bore and 3/16 wall. This was made with Std hardwood I had around.
    Third one I did with a half inch bore and made the blow hole come in from the side. (the kid wanted a normal flute?).
    I'm now helping a guy at the shed make one (still going on that one).
    And now someone else wants me to make one but she wants it small enough for little hands. Need to start that one soon.
    With all the people around buying Indian dream catchers and pictures of Indians, I should be selling them??
    I did get some help via email from a guy in the US who makes them and that was great. I sent him a Aussie souvenir gift bag as a thank you.

    What are nice woods to make them from? Soft/hard. What are the preferences?

  15. #44
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Coffs Harbour
    Posts
    2,015

    Default

    Sounds good Fly.

    Post a few pics of your flutes.

    From my reading the timber you use doesn't make much difference to the sound.
    That's good news because it means you can use any timber you like.

    I have used hardwoods and softwoods. Both work fine.
    You can mix timbers and get some nice effects.

    There are some beautiful flutes about, just do a search for ideas.
    Scally
    __________________________________________
    The ark was built by an amateur
    the titanic was built by professionals

  16. #45
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Redbank Plains Qld.
    Age
    64
    Posts
    202

    Default

    Hi all

    A friend in Africa once asked me why don't I make a flute. In jest I asked him if he meant the champagne style. Since then it has started bugging me that I would really like to start making one. I have read all posts here but as yet do not really know where to start. Firstly being on disability pension does not help as one presumebly needs some money to get started. I have a 1/2 inch router but would need to either build or buy a table. I think that would be a good starting point. I have researched a few plans and have found one I like.

    Am I on the right track??

    Many thanks

    Rog
    With kind regards and may the wood chips fly

    Islander

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