Thread: Pin and Pinless question

This is an area I normally wouldn't touch with a bargepole as my only experience with scroll saw is my old Dremel, over 30 years old and hasn't fired in anger for about 15. Thing was always a disapointment due to the ?????? pressed metal pinned blades they used. Because the blades were formed and set in a single operation, the set was always unbalanced so they were happiest cutting when slewed about 15 degrees.

I could always do a better job in the same time with a jewellers saw. These can be safely threaded through a 1.5mm hole without hassles. The Dremel fine blade needed about 4.5mm, and the courser one about 5.5mm. I know that things have changed in the interveining period, but this might serve to show what the differences could be.

Smallest hole for a pinned blade is probably about 8mm (just measured one selected at random). A similarly selected pinless is about 1mm or less. There are contraptions available to adapt one to the other, and I even made some adapters to fit fret saw blades (about an inch longer) to the scroll saw; can't find either set now of course.

I'd recommend maximum flexibility if you can find the adapters, which might be in the scroll saw accessories package. Spiral blades (generally pinless) are somewhat more forgiving for complicated curved cuts.

Joe

I've never measured, but Ken says 0.3 sounds about right.

malb..... blades are still made the same way.... so yes.. you still have to make up for their tendency to go to the side on straight cuts. They are after all scroll saws.... made to cut scrolls not straight lines!
It's really not that bad, get used to it pretty quick..... you can also just file the back a bit to make it even less noticable...... or you could just use spiral blades that let you go in any direction. Only thing they don't come as small as regular ones.

No need for a jeweler saw ... the new scroll saws are capable of holding the thinnest blades.

I have no idea about the smallest hole you need for pin blades... but I'd think all you have to do is measure how long the pin is.... that's the diameter of the hole you can stick it through.

No need to adapt a saw that's set up for pinless for pin blades.... just pull the pins out of the blades!

Juvy

Like malb said, if your saw can't handle un-pinned blades, then do it with a jewellers saw by hand. I do most of my work with an old GMC, and then go looking for the very small frets and do them with the hand saw. If I break a pinned blade these days, I put them aside, and if they are still long enough, I find I can get them to fit the hand saw.

My finest drill bit is very small, and it easily allows a jewellers blade to go through. It is the size of a darning needle.

Originally Posted by keju

. No need to adapt a saw that's set up for pinless for pin blades.... just pull the pins out of the blades! Juvy

This is probably a stupid question but if its possible to remove the pins from the blade as you say. Is it not possible to remove the pin from one end of the blade first to allow the blade to go through a smaller hole and then replace the pin once threaded through the hole so that the hole doesn't have to be large enough to accommdade the pin when threading the blade. Is that possible?

And where would I buy a Jewellers saw? and blades of course.

hmmmm.... never tried putting pins back in.... guess that would be ok if you don't have a lot of holes to cut...... but a bit cumbersome for lots of fretwork

As for blades..... Harris Traders is the way to go.... they sell both pin and pinless blades very reasonable and they send them out quick too....
No website, but here's their e-mail:
[email protected]

They also sell the tiny drill bits!

Juvy

Thanks guys, much appreciated.

I hope John and Juvy are persuaded against pulling and restoring the pins. For anybody else so tempted, the pins seem to be an interference or shrink fit in the blade. Restoration wouldn't be very much fun, especially with the blade on the scroll saw.

Joe

Originally Posted by joe greiner

I hope John and Juvy are persuaded against pulling and restoring the pins. For anybody else so tempted, the pins seem to be an interference or shrink fit in the blade. Restoration wouldn't be very much fun, especially with the blade on the scroll saw.Joe

Thanks Joe' will give that idea the flick then.

Originally Posted by munruben

This is probably a stupid question but if its possible to remove the pins from the blade as you say. Is it not possible to remove the pin from one end of the blade first to allow the blade to go through a smaller hole and then replace the pin once threaded through the hole so that the hole doesn't have to be large enough to accommdade the pin when threading the blade. Is that possible?

Have heard a version of the above, that involves driving the pin out of one end of the blade, & replacing it with a safety pin.


Cheers...................Sean

every time I think I've heard it all there comes another suprise! lol
A saefty pin? wouldn't have thought that's strong enough, but then those little pins are... well little....
I can see that in a pinch...... if the regular saw brakes down at 10 at night and you have a customer's order to finish by morning..... lol
On the other hand..... hmm... might become as quick and easy as the quick release clamp.... no clamping.... just push through the pin....
Don't know.... somehow I have a feeling there's a saefty issue here..... don't think I'd try this one.

One thing tho..... I'm not sure pin blades come as thin as pinless? So you'd still be restricted to patterns with bigger holes, wouldn't you?

Juvy

Originally Posted by keju

One thing tho..... I'm not sure pin blades come as thin as pinless? So you'd still be restricted to patterns with bigger holes, wouldn't you?

Juvy

I think you're right, by and large. For one thing, the part where the pin goes has to be wide enough for structural strength, even though the cutting region can be smaller. Looking at some mystery blades, I measure about 0.070" at the teeth, and 0.093" near the pin. And another pack (Craftsman #9-27065) of spiral pinless indicates a kerf of 0.035". And BTW, the back of that pack identifies a converter kit #9-22257 to clamp pinless into a pin-type saw. In Oosa, Sears and K-Mart are now married, so might be available in Oz. If ya don't ask, ya don't get.

Joe

General feeling here is that scroll saws that use pinless blades are the better machine for scroll work. How come the manufacturers of these machines don't just stick to making machines that take just pinless blades. Why do we need both types of blades, if pinless is so much better or is that too simple?