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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by elanjacobs View Post
    I'd put Carbitool in the same group as any other premium bit.
    Just for a quick comparison, a 19mm roundover bit is $91 for a CMT and $61.60 for a Carbitool. Is there a difference in quality? Maybe. Is the CMT 50% better? I highly doubt it.
    Carbitool still use inserts chopping into the wood at 90 degrees; although their edges are wickedly sharp and polished you still get scalloping. CMT set their carbide inserts at an angle to give shear cuts; similar to helical heads on jointers and thicknessers. The difference is no sanding needed required versus some light sanding, maybe. The difference in perceived value is highly subjective. (This statement was erroneous; just left in for thread continuity)

    The "premium" brand will always offer some form of improvement over the "quality" brand but they tend to follow the laws of diminishing returns; it is up to the user to determine whether that improvement is justified by the price difference.You can use the same sentiments when comparing Snap-on and Sidchrome spanners, a Festool ROS with a Dewalt ROS, Penrite and castrol engine oils, etc etc etc.
    Last edited by Chief Tiff; 19th May 2019 at 07:13 PM. Reason: I made an incorrect assertion in the original post
    Nothing succeeds like a budgie without a beak.

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  3. #17
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    Aug 2008
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    Melbourne
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chief Tiff View Post
    Carbitool still use inserts chopping into the wood at 90 degrees
    No they don't. All their 1/2" bits (and I'm pretty sure most of their 1/4" profile bits) are on a shear angle except for the 50mm long straight and crown moulding bits.

  4. #18
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    Jun 2010
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    I haven't bought any Carbitool products since the mid-2000's but I'm pretty sure all my existing cutters are fitted with straight inserts; certainly the old-style pin guided roundovers and cove cutters are straight because they're flat! My Face Moulding and Mitre Lock cutting bits also have straight inserts; but they're big buggers.

    Having looked at the latest catalogue I'm happy to concede that they've moved on and upwards and I'll amend my previous post.
    Nothing succeeds like a budgie without a beak.

  5. #19
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Western Australia
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    67

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    I bought a set of Ultra router bits from Bunnings when I first got a router and had no regrets. They may not be the best but aren't rubbish either. I have probably used about half the bits in the set but when the set is about the price of 2 bits, it is still good value.

  6. #20
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    May 2010
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    Wellington, NZ
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    550

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    Quote Originally Posted by doug3030 View Post
    You said "quality" and "Aliexpress" in the same sentence?
    If you felt that strongly about it, you could always buy the exact same Arden brand bits from carbatec for 2-3 times the price.

    Aliexpress is nothing more than a shop front for a huge number of different Chinese sellers. Most sell cheap, nasty or knock off crap, but there are a few that sell decent stuff. Of course the good stuff is a lot more expensive than the cheap crap, but it still costs much less than the exact same thing sold through a local retailer after a chain of importers, distributors and wholesalers have all clipped the ticket.

  7. #21
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
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    Perth W.A
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    720

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    I have three routers, my original Elu mof 177e from 1989 ! I also have and still use some router cutters from the same time. I buy most of the cutters I need these days on ebay and most are just cheap Chinese ones but never had any complaints and all seem pretty decent quality.
    You would probably be better off just buying what particular ones you need, rather than buying a set, half of which you might never use.

  8. #22
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    Apr 2001
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    Perth
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    Mark, I cannot resist commenting - I also purchased an Elu 177e in 1989 (from Woodstock, which became Carbatec, in Balcatta).

    Mine is still going strong. I have another in a router table, plus 2 other smaller Elus. Love Elu!

    Regards from Perth

    Derek
    Visit www.inthewoodshop.com for tutorials on constructing handtools, handtool reviews, and my trials and tribulations with furniture builds.

  9. #23
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    May 2010
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    Not far enough away from Melbourne
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    Quote Originally Posted by NZStu View Post
    If you felt that strongly about it, you could always buy the exact same Arden brand bits from carbatec for 2-3 times the price.
    The point is that I am not likely to buy Arden router bits at any price.

    The day Aliexpress starts selling CMT or Carbitool bits, or something comparable, cheaper than I can get them somewhere else I might think about it.
    I got sick of sitting around doing nothing - so I took up meditation.

  10. #24
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    Nov 2010
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    Perth W.A
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    I bought mine in I think 1989 from the now defunct Matthews in Tamworth, U.K for £ 237.50, I broke the collar that locks the spindle a few years back and replaced it but otherwise all original. It pretty much lives upside down in my router table now.
    I have a few Trend router cutters from the same era still going strong.

  11. #25
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    May 2019
    Location
    Queensland, Australia
    Posts
    25

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    Thanks for all the replies guys. I guess there's a lot of logic in buying what you need, when you need it. I'll research a bit more a think. Most of what I'll be doing is edge work, e.g. chamfers, ogees, jointing, etc. I'm not currently anticipating too many projects in the short term that will require plunge cuts.

    I think my biggest point of confusion right now is around straight bits. There's heaps of different sizes. If I'm mainly just wanting to trim edges and jointing, as opposed to making small grooves to plunge cuts, should I be going for a long and wide straight bit for that kind of work? What trade-offs are there to consider?

  12. #26
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    Nov 2010
    Location
    Perth W.A
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    720

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wardrop View Post
    Thanks for all the replies guys. I guess there's a lot of logic in buying what you need, when you need it. I'll research a bit more a think. Most of what I'll be doing is edge work, e.g. chamfers, ogees, jointing, etc. I'm not currently anticipating too many projects in the short term that will require plunge cuts.

    I think my biggest point of confusion right now is around straight bits. There's heaps of different sizes. If I'm mainly just wanting to trim edges and jointing, as opposed to making small grooves to plunge cuts, should I be going for a long and wide straight bit for that kind of work? What trade-offs are there to consider?
    I work from home as a furniture maker, and to be honest mainly use a few trusty favourites, namely; chamfer bit, roundovers, cove cutter, slot cutter and flush trim bits.
    That's about it really. I don't do much plunge cutting or fancy edges as I work in a more contemporary style these days. Just those few cutters would see you right for most stuff.

  13. #27
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    Oct 2014
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    Caroline Springs, VIC
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    1,645

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wardrop View Post
    I think my biggest point of confusion right now is around straight bits. There's heaps of different sizes. If I'm mainly just wanting to trim edges and jointing, as opposed to making small grooves to plunge cuts, should I be going for a long and wide straight bit for that kind of work? What trade-offs are there to consider?
    The length of the bit required is determined by the thickness of your workpiece when edge jointing or flush trimming. I use a 2" straight bit for everything, but it does mean that I often have 30mm above the work piece which is just an added danger for zero benefit. The diameter of the bit when edge jointing or flush trimming is "bigger is better, unless you need to get into a tight spot". 3/4" diameter is better than 1/2" because the cutter exits the material at a lower angle reducing the chance of the material splintering ahead of the cut. Ideally I would flush trim everything with a 6" cutterhead, but my router table can't handle it, that's the realm of a decent spindle moulder which I don't have.

  14. #28
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    Nov 2007
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    Mt Crosby, Brisbane
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    I am obviously wrong because I do different things to everyone else.

    I didn't know if I'd use a router so I bought a $50 ozito in a box with a few bits. This was a LONG time ago, maybe 15 years ?

    I used it a lot so I bought a triton tra001 and later a mof. So now I've got 3 routers. I've had a LOT of work out of the tra in my saw/router table. This is my go to tool and I stuck an incra on it. Dovetails are a no brainer, I can cut withing a thou, everything comes out square.

    I found I had no use for profile bits. I found I needed some straight bits of various kinds, bead and cove, dovetail and some jointing bits.

    I bought a bit from this person on ebay:

    Super Carbide Tools | eBay Stores

    It worked well, so I bought more. They have all worked well. I spent days end jointing pine with a lock miter bit. I could never get the height quite spot on but that was my problem not teh tools. Those cuts in end grain are a mongrel and I thought it's performance was good. That store used to be cheap. I don't know how it compares now as I haven't needed bits for some time. I don't feel any of mine are blunt yet ?

    I would not buy a ryobi, I think they are overpriced for the quality. I do buy cheap when I'm not sure how much work I'll get from the tool, then buy dear. I recently bought a makita oscillating multitool for $50. It's well used but you can feel the quality as soon as you start it up. makita have great parts support. If I were in your shoes I'd buy a second hand makita to start and don't worry about features. Variable speed is overrated and you don't need plunge either. My advice FWIW is start with a medium size makita or hitachi, get the best condition to price you can. Avoid giants and laminate trimmers. 1/2" is a must. Once you've had it a while you can decide what you really want and probably move the tool on for minimal loss. Then buy a new quality router that suits you well.
    I'm just a startled bunny in the headlights of life. L.J. Young.
    We live in a free country. We have freedom of choice. You can choose to agree with me, or you can choose to be wrong.
    Wait! No one told you your government was a sitcom?

  15. #29
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    May 2010
    Location
    Wellington, NZ
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    Quote Originally Posted by doug3030 View Post
    The point is that I am not likely to buy Arden router bits at any price.

    The day Aliexpress starts selling CMT or Carbitool bits, or something comparable, cheaper than I can get them somewhere else I might think about it.
    uy whatever makes you happy. For me (and plenty of others), the Ardens perform extremely well, and there certainly isn't any issue with their quality.

    If you don't like Chinese-made stuff, you really shouldn't read my other thread when I bought a whole router from there
    Last edited by NZStu; 20th May 2019 at 09:03 PM. Reason: Messed up quote

  16. #30
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    May 2019
    Location
    Queensland, Australia
    Posts
    25

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    Back to routers. What about the Makita MT M3600G. Would that likely be a better bet than the Ryobi? It's 12.7mm and 1650w. No speed control, but sounds like that's not an essential feature.

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