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  1. #31
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    Elan, you're a goldmine of information! That is REALLY helpful.... Just a clarification query: the workpiece as sketched is free to pop up and out apart from lateral pressure applied by the wedge assembly. Is your concept that the w/piece is wedged into the jig, and then the entire assembly is lowered onto the router bit? I just thought that the router bit vibration would loosen the wedge's clamping capacity unless you were also applying downward pressure to the w/piece with your fingers....yet it would appear that your primary objective was to keep fingers as far away from the bit as possible.

    Mate, I hope I don't appear ungrateful, because I am super impressed with your desire to help out! As I said before, this is a very together forum site with a lot of very helpful chappies...

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  3. #32
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    Shallow tapers can have incredible clamping force, I don't think they will loosen in this case.

    Besides, the only thing the jig is doing here is giving you more to hold, the work is still being sandwiched between the base of the jig (well, top since it'll be flipped over on the router table) and the bit and table, so there's really nowhere for anything to go.

  4. #33
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    I don't have a core box bit of the dimensions you're proposing to use, but I do have a 1" bowl bit (flat top curved sides). Using a setup with guide (stop) blocks on the fence I found that I could plunge on to the bit in the table and get a very acceptable finish. Depth of the cut was 13.5mm. The guide blocks need to be fairly tight up to the stock. I didn't use any guide on the left side opposite the fence. Good dust extraction below the table and plenty of space around the bit will achieve the best result.

    A bowel bit is probably a bit more fierce than a core box bit and as you won't be plunging to the full diameter of the bit I think you can expect to get a good result with a high level of safety with the setup you propose. A slower speed of say 16,000 rpm would be advisable. Make sure the router stops before you move the stock. As with any router work take care. I wouldn't expect as good a finish on the drill press and I don't believe it would be significantly safer.

  5. #34
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    Elan, thanks VERY much for that quite helpful advice. Just a clarification with the sketch that you provided: it would appear that I would still have to hold the work piece DOWN as I lowered the jig + w/piece onto the router bit. I say that because I was thinking that the wedge clamping arrangement would not be sufficiently strong to prevent the w/piece from being pushed up (and out of the jig) by the router bit, particularly given the resultant vibration caused by the cutter blades. Am I missing something here??

  6. #35
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    Yes you are...the jig is not hollow.

    It's a solid piece of board with the frame stuck to it, insert the work, wedge it in, turn it over and drop on to the router. There is nowhere for anything to go without the work teleporting through a sheet of MDF (if that happens, call your local physicist).

  7. #36
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    Whoops, sorry guys.....this NBN satellite connection has caught me out again: your earlier responses have only just loaded!!! Aldav, appreciate that feedback, and thanks for your experimentation time on my behalf. I'm most likely going to combine your approach with the jig array as posed by Elan. And apologies Elan: not having had the benefit of your 10.03am post, I HAD thought the jig was hollow (!), and the prospect of turning the entire thing over hadn't even dawned on me!! Having now been thoroughly enlightened, I'm looking forward to putting that jig concept together. I just can't get over the great level of assistance you guys are prepared to provide! Thanks again.

  8. #37
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    No worries, good luck

  9. #38
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    Thumbs up Ancestral Approach

    Quote Originally Posted by Pat the Rat View Post
    Thanks Elan....the two larger bits (page 15) may be exactly what I need.
    The core box bit would be the safest and most correct geometrically. However, in the days before power tools there were hand tools, planes called hollows and rounds which were used to produce all the coves and rounds. The internet will lead you to more than you want to know about. There is a recent book on the topic. As time passed, these wooden planes gave way to combination planes like Stanley 45 and 55.

    if I were in need of a lot of what you want, I would pick the core.box, but if I wanted to have fun making high quality moldings, it would be the hand tools.

  10. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by submariner_ss View Post
    The core box bit would be the safest and most correct geometrically. However, in the days before power tools there were hand tools, planes called hollows and rounds which were used to produce all the coves and rounds. The internet will lead you to more than you want to know about. There is a recent book on the topic. As time passed, these wooden planes gave way to combination planes like Stanley 45 and 55.

    if I were in need of a lot of what you want, I would pick the core.box, but if I wanted to have fun making high quality moldings, it would be the hand tools.
    If you read further through the thread, the OP is just plunging with the bit to produce a hole with a round bottom, not a length of moulding. Hollows and rounds ain't gonna do that.

  11. #40
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    Submariner, thanks for the helpful suggestion, but Elan is on the money: I'm looking to do a series of concave hollows, and a router table set-up seems to be the best approach.

    Elan, just in terms of router alternatives, there's a USA mob called Infinity that have written back to be suggesting their Crown Molding Router Bits (https://www.infinitytools.com/crown-...uter-bits-3677). That #56-602 bit which has a 1 3/4 inch cutter diameter (the smallest of the three illustrated) seems to be a possible alternative, although I'm still wary about the safety aspects! Do you think it might be a reasonable alternative, from functional as well as quality viewpoints??

  12. #41
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    The only problem with those crown moulding bits is that they're not the full semicircle, they're only half that (or possibly less). So your diameter is 1 3/4, but if you look across to the radius it's only 1 3/8 and the carbide height is 3/8.

    With those numbers you won't be getting anywhere near your 13-14mm target depth, you'll be limited to probably 8-9mm before you run out of cutter, similarly your diameter won't even come close to 45mm.

    I see no reason to doubt the quality, but if the numbers you gave before are critical then this bit physically can't do what you want.

  13. #42
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    I think I'm with you in terms of the lack of depth that I'll get, although I'm going to have to go back to 1964 geometry lessons to re-visit chord measurements to get to your 8-9mm!!

    However, if the cutter full diameter is 1 3/4 inches, which is approx. 43mm, would I not get a circle of 43mm (which is probably close enough to what I need) if the cutter is worked to its full depth?

  14. #43
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    Oops, brain fart... Yes you will get your diameter, but your depth will be shallower. Just drew it up and the max depth you can get with that is 8mm.

  15. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pat the Rat View Post
    I'm thinking about a project which will involve quite a few concave hollows each about 32 - 35 mm diameter and about 12 - 15 mm deep, using a Triton TRA 001 (circa 2000 model?) in a Triton Router Table. Since I'll be doing quite a few in timbers ranging from Queensland Maple, Silky Oak to Camphor Laurel, and want a pretty good finish, I'm looking for advice as to a quality bit that will last with minimum wear. Can anyone advise me as to a reliable brand, and possibly a source, especially if it's in the Northern Rivers region?

    Additionally, when running the job, I'm thinking of pressing the rectangular work pieces down onto the router bit, registering the far long edge to the fence, and the left edge to a stop which is perpendicular to the fence. I anticipate being able to the lift the workpiece without the bit burning the resultant concave hollow or catching the outer edges of the hollow.... in your expert opinions, does this sound like a watertight and safe procedure??
    The method of producing the process you are intending to carry out with router in the table mode IMHO Is considered dangerous as you are working "blind" where you are unable to see the cutter during the process. Reading through all the posts there has been no mention of using the router in the plunge mode where the cutter is in view during the process at all time also the material can be held secure therefor a much safer method.
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  16. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pat the Rat View Post
    Submariner, thanks for the helpful suggestion, but Elan is on the money: I'm looking to do a series of concave hollows, and a router table set-up seems to be the best approach.

    Elan, just in terms of router alternatives, there's a USA mob called Infinity that have written back to be suggesting their Crown Molding Router Bits (https://www.infinitytools.com/crown-...uter-bits-3677). That #56-602 bit which has a 1 3/4 inch cutter diameter (the smallest of the three illustrated) seems to be a possible alternative, although I'm still wary about the safety aspects! Do you think it might be a reasonable alternative, from functional as well as quality viewpoints??
    I don't know where those Infinity branded router bits are made, but I'll bet it's China. If they were made in the USA I'm sure they'd be playing that up big time. If you read the 'About Us' page on their site it appears pretty plain that they don't manufacture anything and they are re-branders. It doesn't pay to make assumptions when it comes to the origin of tools and tooling.

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