Thread: Yet another Router table build.
24th Mar 2017, 08:00 PM #31
Hi and thanks, the Fence is based on a typical thick MDF face and base, most noticeability used in the old Yankee Workshop Table ->https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-V0fLf3hoQk
I could post some pictures if you like but the fence is about to be modified (again) next week, so if you're not in a hurry I'll leave it until then.
I should explain the reason for the modifications as it's directly related to the dust extraction design.
I mentioned before that the dust extraction in this table is completely configurable with a simple insert plate change, some of this will become obvious when I make one of the four or more plates just for different types of freehand routing, each fitted with their own dust extraction fitting, safety guard, and some with a starter pin or block.
What I have found with testing this new design is that I now need very little through the fence extraction. I need to shorten the fence dust collection box by at least 60% to 80%, what I will end up with is not much more than a tiny sloping enclosure at the back of the fence that touches the top of the fence face opening, and then slopes away from the face towards the base at around 45 deg. To match that modification in the table top (fence extraction port) only requires 5 minutes work to make a new insert plate, and costs a whopping 50 cents - oh, and takes 2 seconds to swap over.
Extraction at and below the bit is now so good that the typical style of fence extraction is almost redundant, and has forced a redesign of that area, this in turn allows me to open up the below table intake for even more airflow than I currently have it set for.
Hope that makes sense without pictures.
Last edited by MandJ; 25th Mar 2017 at 09:09 AM. Reason: Spelling
24th Mar 2017 08:00 PM # ADSGoogle Adsense Advertisement
- Join Date
- Advertising world
24th Mar 2017, 09:46 PM #32Member
- Join Date
- Oct 2014
- South Australia
Yep. I reckon I geddit.
I think what your doing here is a bit of a game changer.
I must have had 1/2 dozen different router tables over the years and have never been happy with the dust extraction,
this has been highlighted/confirmed with what I have learnt over the last 6 months through these forums.
I plan on making the new base plate for the router this weekend and it occurred to me that I don't do great deal of woodworking anymore,
I just seem to spend my time building and improving my tools and machinery.Luckily I enjoy that too.
No great hurry for pics on my part,I look forward to seeing the fence "set up"once you have made the mods.
25th Mar 2017, 09:18 PM #33
The fence as it was when I first built a standard RT, but the fence extraction was from a hole behind a standard router insert plate, which is why the fence DC box it is SO long. It still results in fence and bit air flow fighting against each other due to the design of standard router and table dust extraction.
I decided to cut down the fence when I modified the through the fence DC. I retained part of the now "unused DC box" to keep strength across the extraction hole in the fence base.
Below: Photos of the relatively small sloping panel behind the fence, and also a clearer back view showing the retained fence box used to reinforce the fence base.
Looking at the photo, you can see that the fence opening (shown completely open at the moment) is now really just an extension of behind the bit through table extraction, air is no longer being pulled straight through the front of the fence and across the top of the table and bit, it is now pulled down through the front fence opening and past the back of the bit, it works in unison with below table air flow to maximise extraction at "the cutting tool", not the bottom of the cabinet.
26th Mar 2017, 03:54 PM #34
Fence Micro Adjuster
I wanted to try a micro adjuster with the fence to see if it would be of use, so this is my variation based on a design I saw a few years back.
One thing I absolutely wanted was to be able to quickly fit and / or remove the adjuster without moving the fence.
So I grabbed whatever scraps I could find in the junk bin, had a rough idea in my head of what I wanted and just finished building this. I'm surprised just how easily I can adjust the fence in 0.01mm steps - DRO readout, it's a snap to add and remove, simple to use, and has made me want to build a more refined version of this one.
For anyone not familiar with this sort of thing: The small knob locking the Micro adjuster to the T-track is normally left loose, the adjuster simply follows the fence as the fence moves in the track. To micro adjust the fence, you slacken off the Fence lock down knob that's next to the adjuster, then lock the adjuster to the T-Track (small black knob) and turn the big knob on the adjuster to micro adjust the fence. Once the fence is in the desired position, simply retighten the Fence lock knob and loosen the micro adjust lock knob.
27th Mar 2017, 01:39 PM #35
I've been putting off posting the DRO Fence setup Why? Because I just know Iíll get some flack over what appears to be a rather crude solution to reading the Fence position with a DRO which has sub millimetre precision.
Some of the thought process. The first problem I was faced with was caused by the Fence design itself. I decided early on that I did not want a mitre track along the front of the table, instead, everything would reference the fence itself. I think it makes the fence clamping system relatively simple as there is no longer the need to keep the fence perfectly parallel to the mitre slot in the table. It should allows for ever finer control of fence position by having one end of the fence pivot while the opposite end of the fence is adjusted for final position.
After lots of testing and trying different clamping ideas, I decided the easiest, neatest and most elegant method of locking the fence was to recess a short T-track into either side near the back of the table. While no longer a true pivoting design it still allows me to pivot the fence for fine adjustment. It makes fitting a Micro-adjuster for the fence a really simple task and itís a lot quicker than using clamps or one end fixed at a pivot when moving, locking, or taking the fence on and off.
Now the problem with a DRO sender on a pivoting fence is this: Even with a smaller amount of pivot, you have to read the fence position very close to, and directly behind the centre of the bit, which is ideally the point that the Fence should be pivoting around, and the attachment to the DRO slider has to be able to pivot around this point as the fence pivots.
If you attach the DRO slide directly to the fence and your maximum Fence travel is say 200mm, you end up with around 250mm to 350mm of DRO Scale rod sticking out the back of the fence. Then there is the problem of getting the DRO scale on and off when the fence is removed or installed, and it would be very easily damaged in a typical small workshop and especially if the table is moveable.
On to the seemingly crude idea I came up with: I decided to use a cable attached to the correct place - or near as - in the Fence and mount the DRO Slide vertically on the rear of the cabinet.
I grabbed three V-Grove track rollers used for sliding screen doors from the Green Shed for around $7.00 each, the ones with a small bearing. My main interest was in seeing how much play there would be and if the readings were repeatable with this crude setup.
Right at the start I felt that most of the inaccuracy would likely be with cable stretch, and indeed this hast turned out to be correct. Now keep in mind that Iím still using a bit of crap twine for these tests as I havenít gotten around to replacing it with a more suitable cable, one that will be way more stable, but even this current setup is still extremely accurate.
The photos are of the prototype and still the current setup, this will be the last thing to be refined on this work in progress build.
Photo below shows the connection to a steel rod recessed into the bottom of the fence and spanning the opening for the old "through the table" extraction port. FYI the light coloured timber behind the rod is the back of the new "through table" fence extraction port. Itís obvious that you donít want any flex at the connection point, so the rod was ideal. I drilled a small hole through the rod for an eyelet to be threaded in and permanently fixed. The cable attaches with a simple steel hook and can be removed or installed in a seconds.
The cable is installed so that it just clears the top of the table, the rear roller is obviously just proud of the table to match. Keeping the cable almost touching the table is important to stop any error in position readings with cable angle change as the Fence is moved towards the rear of the table. When I remake this, the two rollers shown will be combined into one plate and as one unit attached to the rear to the table. FYI the rod is about 70mm from the front of the fence.
There is no change in readings when:
A: I push up or down on these brackets.
B: I move, rock, or even rotate the rollers.
C: The cabinet is wheeled around the workshop.
D: The router is in use.
Photo below is a poor close up of the cable to Fence attachment point, and it pivots about the connection point as the fence is pivoted Ė remember this is not a full pivot fence and accuracy is maintained over the range of available fence movement.
Photo below is the part that should make this seem even more crude that some may think it already is. A Spring
There is a spring attached to the cable to maintain cable tension and to make the DRO slider move down as the Fence is moved back. I tried different ways to do this as I thought Iíd need a constant force to counteract cable, roller, and mounting hardware movement, however what worked in the end was a lightweight very tightly wound long spring that almost ďfeelsĒ linear as it stretched over a 200mm range. Again the Router running and vibration, moving the cabinet around, banging the cabinet ETC does not change the readings at all and I mean not even the last digit.
Photo below is just a view from behind the cabinet showing the 3rd roller and the DRO scale mounted below.
Finally, for those wondering about all the screws and unpainted MDF backing panels, this cabinet was firstly built as a test Router table, and now that Iím close to the final layout, and as soon as I fit the draw tracks, I plan on replacing the MDF with ply and also gluing it into place to make the cabinet / table even more rigid that it already is
Late edit: If you look at the 3rd picture which also has a view through the Dust port, it shows the Triton router, sitting just below the collet on the Triton is a light coloured plate that deflects the router fan outlet from blowing straight up and disturbing through table air flow, it forces all the router fan output horizontally instead of allowing some of the high speed fan air to travel vertically. Lastly, the reason for three rollers and not just one, obviously to get around that huge dam dust port.
30th Mar 2017, 03:22 PM #36
Test Freehand Insert
Raining here is SE QLD so can't do much, decided to knock up a test "table insert" for freehand routing.
For anyone not reading the thread, in this design the table insert looks like an insert plate, but is really more like a big insert ring and cover plate with inbuilt dust extraction. The inserts cost 50 cents to make, allow the dust extraction to be completely tailored for best extraction for the routing job and combine fence and bit extraction working in unison through one table opening.
The insert was knocked up pretty quickly and is the basis of the test unit. This table design allows me to combine a safety guard, above table extraction, starter (pin) block and bit clearance ring in one unit and takes about 2 seconds to put in, take out, or swap with any other insert.
Again you could put any size or shape of dust intake hood, any size or shape of bit clearance ring. Because of low cost and simplicity, any number of different layouts could be made. I was going to make the guard adjustable but didn't bother in the test unit, I may not even bother at all and just make a few different types as the need arises.
FYI, tried an idea I had of drilling a 12mm hole close to each corner of the base plate (the aluminium plate set into the table). Drilled through into the dust cabinet, what you end up with is basically a vacuum clamp in each corner of the plate that pulls the "table insert" hard against the base plate, it's held down hard in any case by the through table air flow but it certainly works if needed.
Photo 1: For reference, table with one of the inserts used with the Fence removed. Photo 2: Table with no fence and the test Freehand insert dropped in.
Below: Close up - I know it's rough.
I used and old test insert which has a hole for the Triton micro winder in it - blue sealing foam below it - then fitted the dust hood, guard and starter block. BTW the micro height adjust on the Triton is no longer needed or used.
That bracket and small ply piece visible below table are really quite some distance below, the plate sits below the collet and right on the body of the router, it deflects High Speed Router Fan Exhaust flow from blowing straight up and disrupting dust extraction from the bit.
And no need to take the Fence off at all. I can slide the fence back, swap the inserts over in two seconds and be ready for smaller freehand routing work.
2nd Apr 2017, 12:43 PM #37
A slight update to the fence DRO setup. I found some string used for Jewellery that has only 1mm of stretch over a 700mm length, and that was with some considerable force applied. Turned out that with this string I needed to remove the spring tensioner and revert to a small weight, which is actually a more refined way to go as the force is now truly constant over the length of travel. There is some cord available overseas that is supposedly treated in a way to makes it completely non stretch, but no figures are given for that claim. At the moment, the position of the Fence with respect to the Bit is within 0.2mm on the DRO for measurements out to 50mm, and increases to within 0.4mm out to 150mm of fence movement. Again this is with the prototype setup, but the slight variations are still caused by that slight string stretch. Wriggling the rollers, brackets or Fence connection do not affect the readout, and the weight moving or vibration has no effect. Putting the weight in a small piece of PVC tube with a bottom travel stop would be all it needs to look the part.
Also got a chance to do more table routing without a fence using that test freehand insert, unbelievable dust extraction. The Polycarbonate shield is like glass to look through and as the back of the bit is completely exposed, I should be able to see the chips and dust coming off the router bit, YES! I know I can't see the invisibles. Only problem is that it's virtually impossible to see even the chips being taken away, and there is not one speck of dust on the table, shield, or anywhere else for that matter. Wipe table with a clean white cloth, nothing, and again, this is with dirty filter bags and DC flow is now really being compromised to the point that the vacuum sensor flow rate switch in the RT is starting to trip. The sensor was set for the old table top fence and bit extraction, I'm going to readjust the sensor for less as the extraction from this design is still so dam good. FYI I'm still using the same overall inlet area for both designs, it's just used way more efficiently now.
2nd Apr 2017, 02:09 PM #38GOLD MEMBER
- Join Date
- Jun 2005
I was reading the post about the spring and instantly thought of suggesting a weight but you beat me to it in the last post. What an ingenious idea! Just for laughs and giggles have you seen Pat Warner's site, I think he has OCD on another level compared to us mere mortals when it comes to routers and accessories.........
2nd Apr 2017, 02:39 PM #39SENIOR MEMBER
- Join Date
- Apr 2014
- Little River
2nd Apr 2017, 03:22 PM #40
2nd Apr 2017, 03:28 PM #41
2nd Apr 2017, 04:05 PM #42
2nd Apr 2017, 07:12 PM #43Senior Member
- Join Date
- May 2009
Macguiver is that you?
you have some great ideas in that router top
5th Apr 2017, 08:46 PM #44
Just started on the cabinet draws, lacquer and sanding still to come.
Only have one of the top draws made, made the four router bit draws, two smaller draws to go below these and then the big draws across the bottom will be last.
The end is in sight
6th Apr 2017, 12:03 AM #45Woodworking mechanic
- Join Date
- Jan 2014
- Sydney Upper North Shore
I made an almost identical arrangement for storing my router bits that I bought from Bunnies etc.(including Freud bits) that didn't come in plastic sleeves like the Carbitool ones.
Even though they were stored in the the router table drawers and never got wet ( apart from moisture in the air) the shanks rusted were they contacted the wood - I used ply. They were cleaning and coated after each use. Admittedly, they weren't being used very often. I now have made the same arrangement but used a Perspex plate with the drilled holes.
By Dazm in forum ROUTING FORUMReplies: 9Last Post: 12th Nov 2015, 11:35 AM
By snowyskiesau in forum ROUTING FORUMReplies: 24Last Post: 14th Nov 2013, 08:02 AM
By snowyskiesau in forum ROUTING FORUMReplies: 12Last Post: 27th May 2012, 01:35 PM
By Nihilist37 in forum ROUTING FORUMReplies: 2Last Post: 31st May 2009, 07:30 PM
By Guy in forum HAND TOOLS - POWEREDReplies: 3Last Post: 23rd Jun 2004, 12:31 AM