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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Swan Hill
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    Default What Extractor should I go for

    Am looking at buying a C3-31 and N4400 at the wood show this month
    If not C3 it will be a A3 Planner combo and N4400
    Not knowing anything about dust extraction would like to know what quality options there are
    Room is a factor along with noise (residential area) and needs to be single phase
    Are the hammer dusties a good thing or would you look else ware
    Any suggestions much appreciated
    Regards
    Stewy

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  3. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Perth
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    27,756

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Stewy View Post
    Room is a factor along with noise (residential area) and needs to be single phase
    Can you put it outside your shed or look at least at venting outside the shed.

    Are the hammer dusties a good thing or would you look else ware
    Yes Hammer is supposed to be very good, but given the other toys you are looking at buying I wouldn't try to suck dust from those with anything less than their AF22W

  4. #3
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
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    Swan Hill
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    Default

    Thanks for that Bob
    It could go outside but would involve ducting about extra 7-8 mtrs
    Would be much better out their though thats for sure
    How far from machine can you go without needing bigger etc extractor.
    would only be running one machine at a time due to room etc and am happy to swap hoses etc
    Regards
    Stewy

  5. #4
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Brisbane (Chermside)
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    71
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    2,076

    Default

    Stewy,

    Like you, I found myself looking for a dust extraction solution two or three weeks ago. I had a couple of small 1 HP extractors like the one found here. Carba-Tec® 1hp Economy Extractor : CARBA-TEC Sadly, they are hopeless at capturing the finer dust and can't be recommended.

    Since then I have read hundreds of pages of information (here and elsewhere) and discovered that dust control is not a simple issue. In particular, until I did the reading I was blissfully unaware of the fact that it was the invisible dust that threatened our health. Initially, I was just trying to keep my shop cleaner.

    There are much more experienced people than me here, and I'm sure some of them will reply. In the meantime you might like to visit bill Pentz's site (he is a bit of a dust collection guru). Bill's Cyclone Dust Collection Research - Home Page

    It seemed to me that only two good options existed. Get a 3 HP dust collector (and either put it outside or vent it outside) or get a good quality cyclone. I went for a Clear Vue Cyclone of Bill's design because it combined good air flow with a small footprint and because I can run it off a single phase power circuit by using a VSD. The 3 HP dust collectors have a significantly bigger footprint. The Clear Vue is not cheap, but not excessively exxy either, and it will handle the very fine dust that does the real damage.

    So, I started out trying to keep my workshop cleaner and ended up protecting my lungs. My biggest issue now will be modifying the ports of my machines to get the air volume and velocity right.

    Finally ... beware all the quoted figures on CFM of air moved etc. Most of them are a fantasy, dreamed up by someone high on opium, or perhaps measured with no hose attached and a 60 Hertz power supply that we don't have.

  6. #5
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Swan Hill
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    Default

    Thanks for that John
    some interesting reading there will take me a while to go through it all!
    where did you end up getting the cyclone from online or local?
    I just hope to do it right the first time and if I need to wait until,I can afford to upgrade to the right equipment I will do so
    Regards
    stewy

  7. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
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    Perth
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stewy View Post
    Thanks for that Bob
    It could go outside but would involve ducting about extra 7-8 mtrs
    Don't give up so easily - there are plenty of other options
    1) If I had no alternative I would consider using 225 mm PVC pipe as a DC venting pipe.
    It will cost you $125 per 6 m length but the peace of mind generated would make it well and truly worthwhile.
    BTW 225 mm pipe is too large to use as a standard inlet duct to a 3HP DCs as the air speed will be too low, but it can be used as a venting pipe no problem

    2) A cheaper alternative would be to make a 300 mm square or 200 x 400 mm rectangular Xsection MDF venting duct.

    3) Maybe even cheaper still would be some large (300 mm) diam collapsible AC ducting.
    Because this duct is very large, open ended and under positive pressure it will not collapse like it would on the inlet side and will have a very low resistance even over 7-8 m.
    If you wanted to be really sure you could go to 450 mm diam.

    Would be much better out their though thats for sure
    Absolutely

  8. #7
    Join Date
    May 2010
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    Not far enough away from Melbourne
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    4,200

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BobL View Post
    1) If I had no alternative I would consider using 225 mm PVC pipe as a DC venting pipe.
    It will cost you $125 per 6 m length but the peace of mind generated would make it well and truly worthwhile.
    BTW 225 mm pipe is too large to use as a standard inlet duct to a 3HP DCs as the air speed will be too low, but it can be used as a venting pipe no problem
    Hi Bob, Is there really anything to be gained by making the venting pipe so much bigger than the outlet on the impeller? I can see that maybe 10% bigger might help the flow, but that's just massively bigger than the outlet.

    I am starting to wonder if we are looking at this the same way. Can I get you to clarify what you mean by venting pipe in this situation?

    Doug
    I got sick of sitting around doing nothing - so I took up meditation.

  9. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Perth
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    27,756

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by doug3030 View Post
    Hi Bob, Is there really anything to be gained by making the venting pipe so much bigger than the outlet on the impeller? I can see that maybe 10% bigger might help the flow, but that's just massively bigger than the outlet.

    I am starting to wonder if we are looking at this the same way. Can I get you to clarify what you mean by venting pipe in this situation?

    Doug
    By vent I mean any duct that takes the output from a DC enclosure/cupboard to the outside.
    It is definitely worth making it substantially larger especially if it is going to be 7-8 metres long.
    The reason that I'm suggesting 225 mm is because stormwater pipe comes in 150 and then the next size up is 225 mm.
    My vent is about 200 x 500 mm in cross section because it is a triple S bend in shape.

    The reason I'm suggesting such a large diam in terms of AC ducting is because that stuff is corrugated and would have some serious resistance.
    ALso the large the diameter less air hissing there will be.

  10. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Helensburgh
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    7,696

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Stewy View Post
    where did you end up getting the cyclone from online or local?
    I just hope to do it right the first time and if I need to wait until,I can afford to upgrade to the right equipment I will do so
    Regards
    stewy
    Stewy, I am guilty of selling John the cyclone and yes we do stock them here.
    CHRIS

  11. #10
    Join Date
    May 2012
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    Default

    Stewy,

    I bought my cyclone locally. Chris Parks is the Aust Rep and his site is brandhouse.net.au

    There is a bit over a thousand dollars difference between a 3 HP dust collector and the Clear Vue cyclone (incl the VSD). However the Clear Vue has a small footprint when compared to almost anything else (important in my shop) and is a very effective machine.

    It's a shame you are not a Brisbane boy. In a couple of weeks I'll have two small 1 HP dust collectors that will about be given away, and they might tide you over while you figure things out. They are not a good long term solution, however, because they recycle the fine dust back to your shop.

  12. #11
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Swan Hill
    Posts
    51

    Default

    Thanks for all the replies
    when I mentioned 7-8 meters I ment for the dc to go there and would need to duct the suction that far which would not bother me just if the dc had enough guts to suck that far and still be efficient
    I would certainly rather it outside for both dust and noise
    regards
    stewy

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