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  1. #16
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    Default Decibel readings with dust bag attached

    Well, it wasn't my imagination. The dusty is slightly quieter with the dust bag attached and the shed door closed but BIG difference with the door open.

    1 metre from dusty shed with door open, directly in front of door - 75.5 dB - down from 85.9
    1 metre from dusty shed with door closed - directly in front of door - 74.7dB - down from 76.5
    1/2 metre to side of dusty shed - 71.2 dB - down from 73.6
    Back fence - 59.3 dB - down from 62.5
    Side fence with neighbours - 59.6 dB - down from 60
    Background noise with dusty off at all four locations - 58 to 58.4 dB.

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  3. #17
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    What sort of instrument are you measuring with?

  4. #18
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    Calibrated "Center 322 Data Logger Sound Level Meter" which we use at work.

  5. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lappa View Post
    Calibrated "Center 322 Data Logger Sound Level Meter" which we use at work.
    Nice machine and it's really important that this is mentioned.

    The reason for this is that most folks will be using a cheap mobile and and a free SPL App and making claims about changes in sound pressure levels.
    The best these can hope to achieve is +/- 5%

    I'll assume you have done everything appropriately and these are just nominal spot checks, but even using a high quality measuring instrument, given the measurements were not done at the same time and the background noise varies in time and space, do you really reckon it's capable of discriminating between 59.6 and 60 dB?
    There are a number of other factors often ignored eg standing in the exact same place, holding the meter the same distance away from the operator, wearing the same clothes, using the meter in the same orientation and height above the ground. In short In short unless the conditions are well controlled it's usually very difficult to measure differences of a couple of dB even with a quality instrument.

    Similar thing happens with air flow measurements and improvements to DC systems, with folks claiming a few % change in an air flow as an improvement when its just noise, or some other factors.

  6. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by BobL View Post

    I'll assume you have done everything appropriately and these are just nominal spot checks, but even using a high quality measuring instrument, given the measurements were not done at the same time and the background noise varies in time and space, do you really reckon it's capable of discriminating between 59.6 and 60 dB?
    Obviously Bob, the answer is no. I am only reporting what it recorded. You will notice that I showed the variations in background noise rather than post a single figure

    Quote Originally Posted by BobL View Post
    There are a number of other factors often ignored eg standing in the exact same place, holding the meter the same distance away from the operator, wearing the same clothes, using the meter in the same orientation and height above the ground. In short In short unless the conditions are well controlled it's usually very difficult to measure differences of a couple of dB even with a quality instrument.
    As we do Noise pollution testing on Motor Vehicles, I am well aware of all the factors you have mentioned above and all care was taken to repeat the readings within a controlled test environment and pattern. As appropriate to vehicle testing, the higher of the readings of the samples taken is quoted

  7. #21
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    Geez, this kills the fun.

    Its a dude in a yard with a meter doing some casual testing. Not some NASA experiment.

  8. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by woodPixel View Post
    Geez, this kills the fun.

    Its a dude in a yard with a meter doing some casual testing. Not some NASA experiment.
    Exactly - but i felt Bob's "concerns" needed a response

    Any how - just back from the pipe shop with some hangers,Ys, caps etc. etc. ready to plumb the shed. Bugger - first job is to move a power point that's in the way

  9. #23
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    Ducting underway. Tried to get a 1.5 m straight run out of the impellor but only managed 1.0m then a 45 degree bend and .4m to the wall to the wall.

    IMG_0287.jpg

    I was going to run the pipe along the wall so I cut to suit.

    IMG_0288.jpg

    AS the end of the run is the table saw, it would then have required a 90 degree bend from the wall to the saw. So I took a more direct route to the saw by going diagonally across the shed. This eliminates 1 x 90 degree bend and 2m of pipe. However, as the pipe no longer runs along the wall and the rafter is not in the way, I can afford to raise it further.

    IMG_0289.jpg

    Next tasks are to raise the vertical 200 mm and attach the pipe hangers. Be glad when its over - the sheds a mess - cant find anything, tripping over #@$%

  10. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lappa View Post
    Well, it wasn't my imagination. The dusty is slightly quieter with the dust bag attached and the shed door closed but BIG difference with the door open.

    1 metre from dusty shed with door open, directly in front of door - 75.5 dB - down from 85.9
    1 metre from dusty shed with door closed - directly in front of door - 74.7dB - down from 76.5
    1/2 metre to side of dusty shed - 71.2 dB - down from 73.6
    Back fence - 59.3 dB - down from 62.5
    Side fence with neighbours - 59.6 dB - down from 60
    Background noise with dusty off at all four locations - 58 to 58.4 dB.

    Lappa, thanks for posting the noise readings, BobL has been trying to get an FYI sticky going with various DC units and their noise readings for new users to refer to, unfortunately not many of us post or take these reading, I guess were having too much fun getting the dam thing built and running.

    So for people who may live in a location where noise is a real problem - gee I'd like some acreage one day:

    These readings were taken with dedicated sound level meter around 3 years ago, they are for a DC housing made with treated pine framing and clad with fibre cement sheets. I found that I did not have to line it and there is no muffler, just a big opening in the lower side (must move that to the top of the cabinet and add a short chimney one day)

    3HP DC with 4 filter bags. Note the huge Door is actually one complete side of the enclosure.

    1 metre from DE cabiner with door open = 87dB

    1 metre from DE cabiner with door closed = 62dB

    Neighbours fence 3m from DC cabinet = 58dB.

    Background noise was very low when readings were taken - 42dB

    Lining it would make it better - but like you, what I have reduces noise enough for my location, we can even run it at night - neighbours say they only hear the faint noise of some power tools, but lathe and bandsaw work is very quite at night.

    Loudest noise is from the various intake ports inside the shed, with the 3HP DC, the air rushing into the lathe pickup for example is 84dB 1m from the port, a bell mouth quietens it a little (workshop partly lined).

  11. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lappa View Post
    Be glad when its over - the sheds a mess - cant find anything, tripping over #@$%
    That's what happens. Wait till you finish and you say - "Oh-No - I forgot to put a junction there" and you have to half dismantle it to get it in there.

    Looks nice and tidy though.

  12. #26
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    I was looking at your pix and wondering why you wouldn't run the pipe right along the apex of the roof. It would look pretty tidy, plus you could add junctions like in BobLs mens-shed fitout. If it were run from the outside and popped through right at the top?

    Inlets could sprout every two metres or so. Run pipes or flexi from them. Block them with a cap when unused?

    That way you could move the pipes around as you reorganise your shop (which, perhaps by the look of it, is your next job? )

    edit: this post: Mens Shed Dust Collection and here is the picture:

    20160921_120523.jpg

  13. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by woodPixel View Post
    I was looking at your pix and wondering why you wouldn't run the pipe right along the apex of the roof. It would look pretty tidy, plus you could add junctions like in BobLs mens-shed fitout. If it were run from the outside and popped through right at the top?

    Inlets could sprout every two metres or so. Run pipes or flexi from them. Block them with a cap when unused?
    That way you could move the pipes around as you reorganise your shop (which, perhaps by the look of it, is your next job? )
    With a 2HP system every effort needs to be made to reduce the ducting length.
    If the ducting goes up it then has to come down adding to the length That why I like Lappa's direct route to get to his TS.
    With the Mens Shed setup running a CV Max and very large diameter trunk line we could put a bit more effort into making it look tidy.

  14. #28
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    A good question woodPixel. Here's a layout of my sheds and the orientation of the dusty to help explain my only real choice.

    shed layout.JPG

    I couldn't fit the dusty in between the main shed and the garden shed to provide a central location. To bring the pipe work to the centre, as Bob said, would have entailed a stack more ducting.

    Have you got your Sherwood unit yet? I was looking hard at that unit until this unit came up cheap.

    Cheers

  15. #29
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    If you have dismembered the stand, perhaps swap the motor/bag sides and flip the motor 90° anti-clockwise? As its a 5" pipe joining the two it will let the motor swivel anyway.

    It was just a thought. One of the things that irritates me to no end in my own shop is that a "Ill just put it here temporarily" turns into some grandfathers-axe and compromise upon compromise.... next thing I know its all a random stack of pipes and power cables!

    Just had the studio rewired last week. New AC, 15 and 20 amp circuits everywhere, 100% RCD and multiple independent circuits. I feel pretty special. It was a good excuse to pull all the crap out of one area and give it a re-do. When I started it was a single household power point... that migrated to a spaghetti nightmare of extension cords, power boards and compromises. All that is now done

    With dust it was almost the same story. A Festool CT32, then a dust deputy then 2" pipe (I was getting into the big time!), then 1hp DC with PE and 4" pipe! (woohooo!), then 2hp with PF now ... a "new and improved" 2HP with new super tall PF and 6" pipe!!! (everything but the last is second hand)

    Well, to answer the question, I've the 5 metres of 6" pipe laying out near the BBQ and the DC is still on back order with Timbecon. Its been worth the wait. Its been a long one, but its given me good time to think over that it's exactly what I want/need and whether the $$ could go elsewhere (ans: no, to the DC it goes!)

    Jason of TC rang only last week to say "soon" as a followup (Awesome company. Excellent CS too).

    I cant go with the 3HP as space is a consideration and outside isn't a possibility. If they offered a 3HP as a single bag I would have taken it though.

  16. #30
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    Nice on the rewire. That's something I need to do as the shed power is piggybacked of a power point in the house
    Problem is to run a new circuit I have to upgrade the whole front power board etc. etc $$$$$$
    My shed is pretty small and it's also used to store utilities like paint, tents, ladders, some powered garden toys etc, (wall of metal shelves) so with a bench, router table, saw table and SCMS I'm tight. All sheet cutting and assembly work gets done under the pegola.
    I've been putting up with a Super Vac with 50mm pipe for the router table and power saw and a Pirahna Kmart special with 35mm outlet hooked to a cyclone for my hand power tools and also to the table saw. I had one of Aldav's cyclone hooked to the Super Vac but it kept sucking the thick bucket into a Salvador Dahli
    Cant wait to get my new system finished and working but I won't be using DWV pipe again if I have to redo at any time.
    Cheers

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