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11th July 2011, 08:14 PM #16
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14th July 2011, 03:19 PM #17
prices quoted (for anyone else considering buying)
I'm currently looking at 2 options -
Option 1 - Face vise - Horvarter 52" & Horvarter Wagon Vise (696.63AUD)
Option 2 - Face vise - Horvarter 52" & Benchcrafted Tail Vise (885.86AUD)
Option 1 is cheaper (both vises from same supplier, shipped together) but I really like the Benchcrafted Tail Vise. Still undecided.
quotes as supplied last night:
(current exchange rate (1USD = 1.07AUD))
Horvarter Twin handle vise no hubs or handles 315USD 292.2AUD
Horvarter Wagon vise no hub or handle 210USD 194.8AUD
Shipping for above 40lbs. 226USD 209.64AUD
Total 751USD 696.63AUD
OPTION 2 - Horvarter face, Benchcrafted wagon
Horvarter Twin handle vise no hubs or handles 315USD 292.2AUD
Shipping for above 26lbs. 156USD 144.71AUD
Sub Total 471USD 436.9AUD
BENCHCRAFTED TAIL vise 359USD 333.01AUD
Shipping 125USD 115.95AUD
Sub Total 484USD 448.96AUD
TOTAL FOR OPTION 2 955USD 885.86AUD
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14th July 2011, 09:58 PM #18GOLD MEMBER
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Have you considered the benchcrafted leg vice?
BenchCrafted.com - Glide Leg Vise
That's what I'd like on the front of my bench. There is a video on their website which I'm sure you've watched, it looks very impressive.
Andy
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15th July 2011, 11:02 AM #19
Hey Andy, yep, seen it. It looks to have a real smooth operation, but a lot of what I have coming up will include making lots of drawers. So a face vise with screws spread far apart will work better for me (allow me to drop the drawer right down into the vise). The Glide has a center screw, so holding large stuff will require them to be held to one side of the vise, which was the exact issue I had with the Record #53 I've got.
To be honest, I'll be happy with either, so it really just comes down to personal preference.
I could use the Horvarter Wagon, but I have a gut feeling the Benchcrafted Leg Vise will be more compact/robust (the wheel is a neater solution than a long handle, as far as a Wagon Vise goes, in my opinion).
It'll cost me more to get one vise from each supplier (effectively double the postage), but for the amount of usage the bench will get, I think it'll be the better way to go.
Just gotta convince the Minister for Domestic Affairs of that fact.
TN
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15th July 2011, 04:11 PM #20
Fascinating thought process that you have been going through, TN.
Customs is 5% of the ex factory price overseas; GST is 10% of the landed cost in Aus including freight, insurance, Customs, etc. If total greater is than $1,000 then both GST + Customs are payable.
Cannot help with the Hovarter or the Benchcrafted vises, but they do look good on their websites - wouldn't they !
Fine Woodworking magazine did a comparative test of end vises early last year and gave a very good recommendation for the Veritas Twin Screw. Later (July ? issue) they did a mini review of the Lie-Nielsen Twin Screw vise, and explicitly rated it higher than the Veritas. Both are available in Aus for considerably less than the costs you are quoting. Or you could import if freight costs don't kill the costing.
Sorry to make your decision making even more complex.
Cheers
Graeme
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15th July 2011, 04:35 PM #21
Hey Graeme,
I was looking at the Veritas twin-screw, but the Horvarter has a nifty 'quick release' function that those others dont.
It'll cost a lot more to get the Horvarter, but quick-release gets used every time I use a vise and if I've gotta crank a handle 50 times each time I open/close the vise, it'd irritate the ... outta me.
So unless they plan on introducing a quick-release function I've really got no choice other than to get the Horvarter.
Time will tell if it's the right decision I guess. (still struggling with the Wagon Vise decision though).
Fortunately the total cost from Horvarter for both will still come in under that magic $1000 mark so no customs duty payable. Also, if I get one from Horvarter and one from Benchcrafted, same story.
TN
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15th July 2011, 08:39 PM #22
I decided on the hovarter for the same reason - little turning of a screw
but then I'm going to have a screw leg vice
but that's because I've already got the screw and I don't expect that it will need to get screwed out too for too often to annoy me.
Groggy made the comment in his bench build that the time taken to screw and unscrew was a factor in his benchcrafted purchase - I took it one further with the hovarter - just hope I use it enough.regards
Nick
veni, vidi, tornavi
Without wood it's just ...
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16th July 2011, 10:32 AM #23
Nick, when I bought the Record #53 I had the option of either getting the quick-release model, or not (think that one was the #52??). I decided to go down the quick-release path. It made such a difference. I have been real happy with that decision. Had it not been for the fact that the screw mechanism sitting in the middle was annoying me, I'd just re-use it.
I had a good long look at the videos for both Benchcrafted, and Horvarter (again) last night. Now I'm swaying to the Horvarter Wagon. The Benchcrafted wheel is less intrusive than the Horvarter long handle, but watching him spinning, spinning, spinning the wagon vice wheel made me think it's just something I'd rather not do (despite it's smooth operation). Also, the fact that the Horvarter requires a much smaller cutout in the bench means more solid bench space, more of the time.
Further reading required.....
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17th July 2011, 03:47 PM #24
Good Morning TN
That's persuasive. Veritas twin screw certainly does not have quick release. Lie-Nielsen, who perversely call their's a chain drive vise, do not mention quick release so I suppose that means it does not have that feature.
Lie-Nielsen Toolworks USA | Chain Drive Vise
If the gross order cost gets near the magic $1,000 then it might be worth splitting the order - now & next week - so that possible exchange rate fluctuations don't push you into the taxable range. Possible more freight but minimum tax is $150, plus possibly customs agents fees.
Cheers
Graeme
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27th July 2011, 10:15 AM #25
After a lot of investigation, and emails to/from, I've finally settled on the vises for the upcoming build.
For the Face Vise, I've ordered a Hovarter 21in Twin handle Vise no hubs or handles (this will give me 508mm clearance between shafts with a 780mm wide vise jaw.
For the Wagon Vise, I've ordered the Hovarter Wagon vise no hub or handle to suit a 65mm thick top.
Most of the issues I had in coming to this decision centered around the benchtop thickness (the wagon vise is made to suit a certain thickness, and is not adjustable). Also there are issues surrounding the overall length of the wagon vise, and the space required to fit it.
Drawing it all in Sketchup has been very handy in resolving most of the issues, and I'll post some prelminary sketches when I get some time.
TNLast edited by TimberNut; 27th July 2011 at 01:52 PM. Reason: typo
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29th July 2011, 08:04 AM #26GOLD MEMBER
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Sounds good mate, are you going to do a WIP?
Andy
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29th July 2011, 10:10 AM #27
Hey Andy,
WIP? you bet!
I will post some sketchup pics I've been working on, against this post shortly, and then when the vises arrive I'll be starting a WIP in a separate posting.
Interestingly, the Hovarter invoice number was 0007 which would sugges I'm the 7th person to order a vise from him. I wonder where all the other WIPs are? I'm sure these will grow in popularity as word gets out. I know a lot of people with upcoming bench builds are watching with interest, so I'll make sure I get plenty of details out there for everyone to help with their decision making.
By the way - the freight cost is a killer for these things, but with the Aussie $$ so high, right now was a good time to place the order.
TN
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29th July 2011, 10:36 AM #28GOLD MEMBER
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I'm looking forward to it- I'm curious to see the colour and grain in the timber your using.
Let me know if you need a hand flipping the top when you get to that stage- I'm happy to help.
Andy
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29th July 2011, 11:11 AM #29
Hey Andy, thanks for the offer. I'll probably take you up on that!
My moisture meter finally turned up, and the Swamp Oak I was planning on using, has an average moisture content of 17%. which means that either I use it like that (and hope the remaining moisture loss doesn't cause significant issues down the line), or I use the Jarrah I've got.
Right now it seems like the only option is to use the Jarrah, but I was hoping to keep it for other stuff.
Either way, the top will be damn heavy! so yes, I'll need some help turning it once it's joined together.
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30th July 2011, 12:23 AM #30
MC correction
Hi TN,
According to my chart for correct moisture content for river sheoak, (C. cunninghamiana) for a reading of 17% correct mc is 14% for wood temp at 20 deg C, further correction is needed if wood temp is >5 deg C or <5 deg C from the 20 deg C standard and assuming your meter uses Douglas Fir as the standard, your meter should have come with info on most of this...
Pete
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