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  1. #1
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    Default Shed Upgrade and Lining

    Seeking some opinions my ideas on lining my 7.2 x 3.6 metre shed. I've trawled through previous posts but most seem to be related to all metal constructions. Built some 40 years ago as a detached garage, it is a fibro clad, timber framed with a corrugated iron roof. Given its age, there is little doubt the fibro is A/C sheeting, however it is in good condition and the externals have been regularly painted. The walls are protected on three sides by awnings or an adjacent building and the western wall is mostly protected in summer by good sized franjipani tree. The wall frame studs are 75 x 50mm hardwood at 600mm centres and the rafters 95 x 38mm hardwood at 750mm centres. We are located 50km southwest of Sydney.
    IMG_0081.jpg
    Walls: I am planning on using 9mm CD structural ply on the walls fixed with 40mm brad nails using an air nail gun but not sure about gluing as well and whether I should insulate with bats or will the wall air space and ply will be adequate insulation.
    IMG_0077.JPG
    Roof: As the primary source of heat transfer I have used air cell insulation stapled between the rafters which has made a lot difference to radiated heat from the corrugated iron roof and want to line this as well to further reduce heat/cold transmission. However I am concerned the 9mm ply might be too much loading on the rafters and so I am after some opinions on what ply thickness would be suitable to used without overloading the rafters and still rigid enough to avoid too much sagging or to an alternative material. Rafter length is 1830mm from the ridge to the top plate.
    IMG_0075.jpg
    Sorry for being long winded but I wanted to include all the information as I think it helps to to understand the requirements and thanks in advance for any input

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  3. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
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    Australia
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    Default

    IF you are going to line it, put the bats in. Not only does it keep it cooler in summer and warmer in winter, it helps keep the noise inside the shed.

    I used brads to nail my sheets to the wall without glue. They hold fine and with a little convincing they can be removed if you need access (as I did to run power outside). Not sure if you will be able to shoot them into hardwood though! Worth a try. Might need to use pine roof battens onto the hardwood then nail the sheets to that.

  4. #3
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    I would use 12mm ply for the lining so I could then use a french cleat system for storage, the 12mm would hold fasteners better. Put any wiring etc in before you start and mark the vertical frames on the plywood for further reference.
    CHRIS

  5. #4
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    Hi apple8
    I second Chris's suggestion to use 12mm ply for the walls so that you can more easily attach stuff to it. I'd even be inclined to use 18mm ply.
    Being hardwood and 40+ years old, brads may not be driveable. Be prepared to drill and screw to the studs. In fact drill (for pilot holes) and screws might be the best option as it will allow you to remove individual sheets to get into the cavity if you need to.
    I think that the convention is to arrange the ply with the long axis horizontal.

    The roof?
    You should be more worried about the lining material sagging between the rafters rather than overloading them.
    It might be easier to frame out the roof with 2 x 1 pine and install gyprock. At least the Gyprock will be easier to paint white for light reflection than ply.
    regards from Alberta, Canada

    ian

  6. #5
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    Using the french cleat system will enable you to get away with 12mm, I have just done that, if you intend to use screws to hold heavy stuff perhaps use 18mm but the costs start snowballing at that point.
    CHRIS

  7. #6
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    Sep 2014
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    Australia
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Parks View Post
    Using the french cleat system will enable you to get away with 12mm, I have just done that, if you intend to use screws to hold heavy stuff perhaps use 18mm but the costs start snowballing at that point.
    This is a good point. I used 9mm ply and now wish I had gone thicker. At the time I was shooting for the cheapest option. It became a pain just recently hanging the ClearVue Cyclone. Its also going to be a pain when I get to the point of building my cabinets.

  8. #7
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    Arrow

    Quote Originally Posted by Pearo View Post
    IF you are going to line it, put the bats in.
    Yes, at $100 for insulation and little effort it would be worth doing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pearo View Post
    I used brads to nail my sheets to the wall without glue. They hold fine and with a little convincing they can be removed if you need access (as I did to run power outside). Not sure if you will be able to shoot them into hardwood though! Worth a try. Might need to use pine roof battens onto the hardwood then nail the sheets to that.
    With the brads I expect a bit a trial and error with plan B to predrill and screw, batterns I hadn't considered until now.

  9. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Parks View Post
    I would use 12mm ply for the lining so I could then use a french cleat system for storage, the 12mm would hold fasteners better. Put any wiring etc in before you start and mark the vertical frames on the plywood for further reference.
    The existing cupboards etc are attached to the studs which have served well over the years, I have cleaned them up and will probably reattached similar after lining. Power is currently in conduit attached to the top plate so I will slip the sheets under the conduit and reattach.

  10. #9
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    I did what you are doing ten years ago and used three ply, all I wanted was to get rid of the dirt catching frame and tidy the place up. I have never needed to attach anything to the lining so up until now it has worked out well, it was cheap at the time (the prime criteria) easy to handle and quick to do. I have started to put a french cleat system recently and now I am going to have to line part of one wall with some thicker material. I am not concerned that it will be part of one wall and look a bit different because to me it is only a shed and it is only me that needs to be concerned with the way it looks and I couldn't care less, functionality before looks is my creed, if it works who cares. So if you do not intend to hang stuff off it and change your mind down the track throw up some thicker stuff where you need it then, buy some tools with the money saved now and job done. I doubt the thicker material will have any huge impact on sound outside the shed but I am no expert, it has to have some of course but will it justify the extra cost. I would cost 18mm against three play, tell the missus, put up three ply and buy tools with the money saved.
    CHRIS

  11. #10
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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by ian View Post
    Hi apple8
    I second Chris's suggestion to use 12mm ply for the walls so that you can more easily attach stuff to it. I'd even be inclined to use 18mm ply.
    Being hardwood and 40+ years old, brads may not be driveable. Be prepared to drill and screw to the studs. In fact drill (for pilot holes) and screws might be the best option as it will allow you to remove individual sheets to get into the cavity if you need to.
    Fixing will need some experimentation given the age of the hardwood.

    Quote Originally Posted by ian View Post
    I think that the convention is to arrange the ply with the long axis horizontal.
    I was thinking that I would cut off 300mm the 2.4 length to match the 2.1M wall height and fix vertically, but I can see now that horizontal has the advantage of reducing the number of joins on the studs, especially if I have fix with screws.

    Quote Originally Posted by ian View Post
    The roof?
    You should be more worried about the lining material sagging between the rafters rather than overloading them.
    It might be easier to frame out the roof with 2 x 1 pine and install gyprock. At least the Gyprock will be easier to paint white for light reflection than ply.
    Yes sagging is an issue and looks bad where it occurs, hence something rigid and light is reqired.

  12. #11
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    Ply sheets should be delivered on Thursday.

    Is there any need to have the sheets clear of the concrete floor or to leave expansion gaps between the sheets? I would think that with timber on timber any expansion would be equal and installing on a warm day will be close to max anyway. And is there any value in painting/sealing the back side of the ply? I intend to paint the face side white after install.

  13. #12
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    What thickness did you eventually decide on? I would just stand them up vertically, that way each sheet is loaded to the ground and the wall studs just keep it standing up. You won't need that many screws to each sheet and screws are cheap anyway. I wouldn't bother painting behind the sheet but that is just me as I hate painting.
    CHRIS

  14. #13
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    I ended up with 9mm structural CD grade ply. It should strong enough to take a knock and flexible enough to shape around the deformities you get with an old hardwood construction. Actually found today where I scratched the year 1975 when the concrete was laid. I can use the wall studs or a battern fixed to the studs to hang anything with a bit of weight.

  15. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by apple8 View Post
    I can use the wall studs or a battern fixed to the studs to hang anything with a bit of weight.
    just remember to mark the location of the studs on the shed side of the ply
    regards from Alberta, Canada

    ian

  16. #15
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    Some progress after 35 degree days and great grandchildren visiting delayed things a bit which isn't a problem because there is no deadline. I'm doing it in one half and two quarters due to having relocate cupboards etc.

    Insulation on the first half is installed and the two narrow ply panels either side of sliding door are in. The 40mm brads drove into the hardwood ok but only barely flush with the ply. I might try 32mm brads on the next panel.
    IMG_0087.JPG IMG_0090.JPG

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